Wyoming > Hicks at it again

[406dn]

I don't have a dog in this fight. I hunt elk as a resident in Montana.

Part of why this sort of bill pops up from time to time can be explained in how this thread is titled. It is not lost on residents of the Rocky Mountain states that a portion of non-resident hunters view them as hicks from the sticks.

I am not a big fan of outfitters getting a guaranteed share of the tags. That existed in Montana for a period of years. I think it puts the Fish and Game into bed with the outfitters and turns out the lights. Nothing bad is going to happen at that point,,,,, you think??

 

[NYyotekiller]

So are they planning on doing away with the NR special drawing if this passes? I didn’t see where they proposed a price increase for the special draw so I’m guessing they are doing away with it?

 

[----]

I'm an unabashed WY fan. I think they have the best all-around deal for elk and antelope of any state. Their fishing is superb. I'll continue to give them my $$ until/unless I get priced out of the game.

Just out of curiousity, how many times have you hunted elk and antelope in Wyoming, compared to other western states?

 

[Little Canyon Creek]

Part of why this sort of bill pops up from time to time can be explained in how this thread is titled. It is not lost on residents of the Rocky Mountain states that a portion of non-resident hunters view them as hicks from the sticks.

I think the title was phrased as such because one of the bills sponsors is Senator Larry Hicks...

 

[406dn]

That would explain it.

 

[schmalts]

And you wonder why Zim whines. Crap like this is reason. Rip on him all you want but he is spot on with many of his gripes.

 

[sbhooper]

unfortunately there are bowsite and SCI type hunters that lick their chops with every increase, knowing full well that the higher the prices get the bigger slice of the pie they can get because they can still afford it.

The bottom line, whenever this comes up, is that hunters do not band together. One will cut another's throat, if it means he can get a permit. It won’t change because by nature, people are greedy. The pricing bullshit has run me out and there will come a time where states will lose to the antis, because they have run all of the hunters (especially nr hunters) off. I feel sorry for young hunters wanting a western experience, as it is a disappearing thing. I have been fortunate to have some great hunts, without mortgaging the house to do it. Times are changing and not for the better.

 

[rtraverdavis]

Times are changing and not for the better.

It’s certainly starting to feel that way in a number of regards.

Things are pretty dire in my state, at least for mule deer, and we’ve already stifled our funding system by cutting most NR’s out. There’s an open comment period right now from ODFW seeking hunter input for how to improve things, and the selfishness from many of the commenters is astounding. Bitching about license fees but demanding all these expensive measures be taken. One guy even wrote that we should make Oregon like Texas or some of the African countries with private game reserves. Unbelievable.

Wyoming has seemed to me, since I got serious about hunting five years ago, like an amazing and very accessible place for a hunter with reasonable expectations. I plan to hunt there for the first time this fall, now that I should have enough to draw a hunt I’m really excited about. This bill (and the likely changes to NR tag allocation in the future that Buzz wrote about) suck, and sure do diminish a lot hope of future plans.

Would it be worth more than just screaming in the wind for nonresidents to write to the Wyoming legislature and speak up about this?

 

[Flatrock]

So are they planning on doing away with the NR special drawing if this passes? I didn’t see where they proposed a price increase for the special draw so I’m guessing they are doing away with it?

Looks like they're just going to one price for tags and eliminating the 2 tiered system???

 

[cahunter805]

Seems as though it’s an inevitable issue and the results will have some effect on most us NR.
What I’m curious about is what is the residents of WY opinion on all the hotels, restaurants, bars, butchers and other businesses that make a good amount of their yearly income from hunting season? Mainly off NR hunters.

 

[JM77]

I agree with Buzz's assessment of this bill and I also understand why this is happening.

Being a resident of Wyoming, who does apply and hunt other states, I am more than aware how other states treat the NR. Licenses for residents, even here, are becoming harder and harder to draw. Anymore social media tells everyone, everything. It goes without saying that frustrated residents want more tags available, especially considering how generous Wyoming is to nonresidents. This isn't a hate the out of stater thing.

While there is no chance that I see this bill passing, the 90/10 idea is not going away. Eventually resident hunters in Wyoming will rally and demand a change, someone other than Larry Hicks will sponsor a better bill and it probably will pass.

 

[WapitiBob]

Looks like they're just going to one price for tags and eliminating the 2 tiered system???

The Bill rescinds 23-2-101 section f which defines the special draw.

 

[3855WIN]

My gripe with it is that I hear about “My Public Ranch”. But it’s my public ranch that I can’t hunt when laws like this get enacted. Same with the wilderness area deal.

 

[marksjeep]

Completely agree with @cahunter805, what is the economic impact to the peripheral businesses which derive income from NR hunters? While this proposal might be revenue neutral to WGF, it's a big loss to small businesses in Wyo, outfitters excluded.

 

[Trial153]

The problem with stating that peripherals are taking a hit is that its not true. Dispite the rising costs in almost all western states you dont see many tags or seasons under subscribed. The tags are being sold and hunters are hunting and spending money on goods and services

The difference is that if we look at all potential tag buyers and chart them on a bell curve based on their economic means to pay, we keep shifting a little more each year to high side. Right now there are plenty of us on the higher side of the curve to fill all the demand , so on the surface the price increases seem benign. Where we will run into issues ( i would argue that its been happening years) is that the majority of wealth is shiftimg futher to the right of the curve as well. So what does that mean? As more and more of the hunting opportunitys are shifted to less and less hunters we erode our base, those hunters that afford it drop out and dont come back. Unfortunately I see this tread continuing and being embraced by plenty of our own ranks. We are happy to pay more for exclusivity, we are here now we have the money, why not get the "best " experience we can right now. And that will be our demise.

 

[MTGomer]

@BuzzH is the current way NR tags are split between max pref and random written into state statute too or is that set by the commission?

IF (and hopefully you’re right that it won’t) this passes, it would be interesting to see how the NR tags are split.

 

[rmauch20]

Just my quick thoughts.
I hate the part about the guide draw.
I like the way Wyoming has it set up now with a special/ regular draw.
Raising tag cost and cutting quotas seems like the things to do right now. I wouldn’t mind the increase in the cost if quotas were left the same.
hunting out west is a cool thing to do right now so I guess the states have to capitalize while they can. I do think we will eventually hit a point where it’s just not worth it. It’ll be very unfortunate when that happens. I just don’t want to hear any bitching about Hunter recruitment and retainment.

I just don’t understand the desire to cut tag quotas and take another 30% off the that. I look at it as they are reducing antelope tags 40% elk tags 36%.
I am not going to Worry about the moose, bison, or sheep tags I will never draw those and even if I did I wouldn’t be able to afford them.

 

[88man]

I don't have a dog in this fight. I hunt elk as a resident in Montana.

Part of why this sort of bill pops up from time to time can be explained in how this thread is titled. It is not lost on residents of the Rocky Mountain states that a portion of non-resident hunters view them as hicks from the sticks.

I am not a big fan of outfitters getting a guaranteed share of the tags. That existed in Montana for a period of years. I think it puts the Fish and Game into bed with the outfitters and turns out the lights. Nothing bad is going to happen at that point,,,,, you think??

?????????????????? I am lost! Must be something in that pipe. I'm guessing your watching Rinella and Joe Rogan

 

[BuzzH]

@BuzzH is the current way NR tags are split between max pref and random written into state statute too or is that set by the commission?

IF (and hopefully you’re right that it won’t) this passes, it would be interesting to see how the NR tags are split.

Sheep, moose, goat, bison splits are set in statute.

Deer, Elk, Pronghorn splits are set in regulation.

 

[marksjeep]

The problem with stating that peripherals are taking a hit is that its not true. Dispite the rising costs in almost all western states you dont see many tags or seasons under subscribed. The tags are being sold and hunters are hunting and spending money on goods and services

The difference is that if we look at all potential tag buyers and chart them on a bell curve based on their economic means to pay, we keep shifting a little more each year to high side. Right now there are plenty of us on the higher side of the curve to fill all the demand , so on the surface the price increases seem benign. Where we will run into issues ( i would argue that its been happening years) is that the majority of wealth is shiftimg futher to the right of the curve as well. So what does that mean? As more and more of the hunting opportunitys are shifted to less and less hunters we erode our base, those hunters that afford it drop out and dont come back. Unfortunately I see this tread continuing and being embraced by plenty of our own ranks. We are happy to pay more for exclusivity, we are here now we have the money, why not get the "best " experience we can right now. And that will be our demise.

I agree completely that the rising cost is shifting the hunting demographic to the right of the curve. But, additionally, this bill cuts nr tags in half, from 20 to 10% of the quota. That results in less nr hunters visiting wyo; buying fuel, food, logging, beer, propane, etc.