WY 2021 deer/antelope results

[shootbrownelk]

If you want to bet that the rate of year over year app growth in the West will be the same 10 years from now as we saw over the last couple of years, I’ll take that bet.

Honest question, have app numbers never declined before?

Everyone acts like this spike in demand is here to stay and that it is inevitable that we keep seeing record numbers of apps indefinitely.

I don’t get why.

Because there are always applicants with deeper pockets that will pay anything to hunt Wyoming.

 

[RobertD]

I don’t get into conspiracies, like at all, but I have to wonder if some of this current push toward cutting NR opportunities and raising NR prices doesn’t go back to the old adages of “never let a crisis go to waste” or “make hay while the sun shines”, at least on some folks’ parts.

I don't think it's outlandish to say price increases are a product of "making hay while the sun shines."

Dudes are paying 600 bucks and burning two or three points in the special to hunt units that went leftover for probably decades. States see the demand and they're gonna capitalize on it.

 

[TOGIE]

i think there are plenty of legitimate reasons for the push to cut NR opportunities wyoming.

but some of the vitriol i've heard hurled at NRs in wyoming makes me wanna overrun the place even more. even a landowner that has let me hunt on his property in wyoming has let things slip while i'm talking to him that made me pretty angry. seemed odd while he was chatting me up and about to open his gate for me.

i personally am pushing for cutting NR opportunities in colorado, but i'm also pushing for further limiting R opportunities. our state is out of control in its own way.

it's just weird to hear wyoming residents complain so much (i'm not exactly referring to forum members here) when from everyone else's perspective from the outside, i don't see how you could have it any better.

 

[antelopedundee]

I burned points this year because of the fear of 90/10 or worse price increase to special price for an antelope. Very pricy meat if you calculate the price per pound the way my wife does. She doesn't buy the well you were going to eat anyway so food shouldn't count argument. I was so worried I hunted a different unit to be a little more sure I would draw instead of 47. Looks like with 6 points I would have drawn oh well. At least know the area from hunting 32 for doe last year.

On a purely economical basis it's a losing proposition and we all know that. But that's not the point. There is recreational value also. No doubt that $1500 - $2000 could buy a lot of t-bone steaks [which may not be the healthiest choice from the meat case] at your local supermarket. That same amount spent on a vacation could put some pounds around your waistline instead of 35 or more pounds of meat in the freezer.

 

[greatwhitebuffalo]

Sorry, but Census data paints a different picture.

Over the last decade, Wyoming has grown:
-Slower than the nat'l average
-Slower than every state it shares a border with
-Slower than all but six other states.

And a growth of 2ish percent isn't much when you're starting with half a million people.

And I actually support most of the 90/10 stuff pretty thoroughly, but I think it's necessitated on principle, not because the resident hunter population of Wyoming is growing.

Yes. However, these numbers are probably going to come down even more once the hit to o&g is reflected.

 

[Shangobango]

Because there are always applicants with deeper pockets that will pay anything to hunt Wyoming.

I get that. And that is kind of the whole point. There are a limited number of people willing and able to “pay anything”.

At what point in the process has it become simply pricing out those who don’t have deep pockets.

I personally am not a fan of making hunting a rich persons endeavor. It seems like that is where it is headed, and not just in the west.

I have a whole lot of questions, and not many answers on this subject.

I am intrigued by it as someone who loves hunting.

 

[antelopedundee]

You also taking bets on hell freezing over?

People have money to spend. Instead of buying a cheap $350 Savage Axis rifle folks are buying $900 or more production rifles and high dollar scopes. The good gunsmiths are busier than a one-legged man in a butt kicking contest. I don't think that a few hundred extra dollars is going to be a stopper for those folks. If antelope numbers don't start to increase expect more competition for the available tags.

 

[greatwhitebuffalo]

Prices are being inflated; maybe along with greed. But, the real shock for me is to hear/read people's perceptions of some of these tags.

There are A Lot of tags in WY than most knowledgeable residents and some non- residents wouldn't even want, if they were free.

 

[Pedropistola]

Prices are being inflated; maybe along with greed. But, the real shock for me is to hear/read people's perceptions of some of these tags.

There are A Lot of tags in WY than most knowledgeable residents and some non- residents wouldn't even want, if they were free.

People are willing to pay for the opportunity alone, even if it's slim odds. It's the experience that is selling itself now I think

 

[greatwhitebuffalo]

People are willing to pay for the opportunity alone, even if it's slim odds. It's the experience that is selling itself now I think

I kind of agree with this, with the exception that a lot (if most) have really overestimated the experience. I'm hoping that a lot of these people are the "Creed more/Swarovski/hipster" crew of late and ponder the fact that they just paid $15,000 to shoot a doe or a spike. Then, maybe some of them will have it out of their system and free up some tag opportunity.

 

[RobertD]

I kind of agree with this, with the exception that a lot (if most) have really overestimated the experience. I'm hoping that a lot of these people are the "Creed more/Swarovski/hipster" crew of late and ponder the fact that they just paid $15,000 to shoot a doe or a spike. Then, maybe some of them will have it out of their system and free up some tag opportunity.

One of the issues, though, is that my generation cares less about how they perceive the experience themselves than how others perceive the experience as they're having it.

Poor quality hunts look great with the right Instagram filter... and I'm only half joking.

 

[Pedropistola]

I kind of agree with this, with the exception that a lot (if most) have really overestimated the experience. I'm hoping that a lot of these people are the "Creed more/Swarovski/hipster" crew of late and ponder the fact that they just paid $15,000 to shoot a doe or a spike. Then, maybe some of them will have it out of their system and free up some tag opportunity.

Maybe I can pick up some cheap used swarovskis and see what they're all about! haha

 

[greatwhitebuffalo]

Maybe I can pick up some cheap used swarovskis and see what they're all about! haha

Yeah. I'm right with you.

 

[antelopedundee]

People are willing to pay for the opportunity alone, even if it's slim odds. It's the experience that is selling itself now I think

The cost of those slim odds is $15 and the time it takes to complete the application.

 

[bpitt]

"Kicking out" the non-residents by meeting the standard set by every other state in the West I guess... But at least we will be "complaining" about each other.

With less non-resident tags allotted there will be just as many tags, but likely in the hands of fewer people. Not many residents are sitting on the sidelines waiting to hunt because they can't get tags here, so I don't see many more starting to buy tags just because the non-residents get cut. The same people will just buy more tags, heck we may go back to having leftovers.

Cutting non-resident tags means more tags for us, better chance at drawing the best units and likely less people afield. Now that is some great hunter management!

The real solution to crowding is more access. Another spot WY shines with the HMA's and Walk-in's.

Yeah, like drop the requirement that I need a guide to hunt Federally declared wilderness areas, and let's pass some legislation that mandates easements for access to landlocked public lands, not just in Wyoming, but everywhere. I do like how Wyoming does work with private landowners for the HMA/Walk-in areas. The only antelope we saw last year, that we had 'legal' access to, where on a walk-in area. I am thankful for that.

 

[madtom]

Sorry, but Census data paints a different picture.

Over the last decade, Wyoming has grown:
-Slower than the nat'l average
-Slower than every state it shares a border with
-Slower than all but six other states.

And a growth of 2ish percent isn't much when you're starting with half a million people.

And I actually support most of the 90/10 stuff pretty thoroughly, but I think it's necessitated on principle, not because the resident hunter population of Wyoming is growing.

I wouldn’t rely on the last census to predict what happens between now and 2030. The statewide housing market right now suggests the trajectory is changing drastically post-covid. Whether it’s a blip between now and the next bad winter or a new trend remains to be seen.

 

[RobertD]

I wouldn’t rely on the last census to predict what happens between now and 2030. The statewide housing market right now suggests the trajectory is changing drastically post-covid. Whether it’s a blip between now and the next bad winter or a new trend remains to be seen.

That's a fair point. "Post-covid" is rewriting a lot of narratives.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

If you want to bet that the rate of year over year app growth in the West will be the same 10 years from now as we saw over the last couple of years, I’ll take that bet.

Honest question, have app numbers never declined before?

Everyone acts like this spike in demand is here to stay and that it is inevitable that we keep seeing record numbers of apps indefinitely.

I don’t get why.

If demand stays exactly where it is or even declines slightly there will still be point creep.

Right now there are 4000 people applying for 40 tags in lots of units. Even if that number is 1000 you still will see the same trend.

 

[Pedropistola]

Yeah, like drop the requirement that I need a guide to hunt Federally declared wilderness areas, and let's pass some legislation that mandates easements for access to landlocked public lands, not just in Wyoming, but everywhere. I do like how Wyoming does work with private landowners for the HMA/Walk-in areas. The only antelope we saw last year, that we had 'legal' access to, where on a walk-in area. I am thankful for that.

You can hunt it with me! And I'm not a guide. Just have to make nice with folks in WY you can hunt with if your keen on it. I think it's buffalo chip for the most part, but seeing as how the grizzly bear numbers and encounters are going up and hunting does pose a significant risk for a negative encounter, its not a bad idea to be back in some of those places with someone who is used to being in bear country if you aren't. I guess maybe they look at it as reducing liability? Course the hikers are on their own, but they don't carry around bags of meat and let off gunshots

 

[Pedropistola]

The cost of those slim odds is $15 and the time it takes to complete the application.

I meant the opportunity with a less than desirable tag, like shelling out hundreds for a low-quality cow hunt in a unit with low populations or very limited public access year after year. Gives people a reason to be excited, spend money and get outdoors I guess