Working on a levergun

[p_ham]

My next project involves my perfectly accurate and serviceable Marlin 1895XLR in 45-70. It just doesn't get a whole lot of use and I'm itching for another cool build. Anyways, with the bolt face being sized for a 45-70 rim and parts being very hard to find, I'm building a wildcat. It's a 45-70 necked down to .375. I'm using a 375 H&H improved reamer and running it in to a cartridge depth of 2.105" which is the same case length of the 45-70. I'm going to whip up a barrel stub to test feeding and such to make sure it will work.

I made a forming die the other night by reaming with a sizing reamer and then boring out the top side of the die and making a sizing bushing with a 20⁰ shoulder so I wouldn't wrinkle cases. I thought about making a .40cal bushing to step it down and still might.

According to quickload and Gordon's, I should be in the 2550-2600fps range with a 200gr. Bullet. And 2450-2500fps with a 220. I think I'm going to try Hammers out of it.

I'm going to be carving out a new stock that's a monte carlo style for scope use. It's just getting a scout scope, thanks @schmalts , but the whole "jaw weld" thing sucks to shoot.

It's still in its infancy but I thought I'd share.

you'll notice the 20⁰ shoulder, it will fireform to 40⁰ like any other ackley. I still have some tweaks to make, then I will make a set of headspace gauges.

L to R: .243win, 375-70, 45-70, 30-06.

 

[std7mag]

Very nice!

When you do your "barrel stub" for testing, let us know how the 40° shoulder does in that type of action, please.

 

[D4570]

Interesting.
Sounds similar to the OLD 33 Winchester centerfire or the more modern 348 Winchester.

 

[p_ham]

Very nice!

When you do your "barrel stub" for testing, let us know how the 40° shoulder does in that type of action, please.

Definitely will do.

Interesting.
Sounds similar to the OLD 33 Winchester centerfire or the more modern 348 Winchester.

It has less body taper than the 33win, there was also a 38-56 and 40-65 based on the 45-70 designed for black powder use. Both have long body tapers.

Power wise I should be pretty close to matching the 348.

 

[mevertsen]

I would like to say. Pretty cool project

 

[std7mag]

Definitely will do.


It has less body taper than the 33win, there was also a 38-56 and 40-65 based on the 45-70 designed for black powder use. Both have long body tapers.

Power wise I should be pretty close to matching the 348.

I'm curious how the less body taper & 40° shoulder feed.

 

[p_ham]

I'm curious how the less body taper & 40° shoulder feed.

Me too. The shoulder might be more issue than the case taper. The shoulder should only be .050ish on a loaded case so it may not even be an issue. .498" at the shoulder and .402-.405" on the neck.

I'm kind of thinking that since the carrier was made for 45-70 originally, it'll be pretty much centered up in the chamber.

I do know that the 30-30 ackley feeds fine in a Marlin 336.

I'm researching how to make hyrdoforming dies now, I think it would help with my R&D process. I'm not really interested in paying Whidden to make one for me.

 

[std7mag]

Me too. The shoulder might be more issue than the case taper. The shoulder should only be .050ish on a loaded case so it may not even be an issue. .498" at the shoulder and .402-.405" on the neck.

I'm kind of thinking that since the carrier was made for 45-70 originally, it'll be pretty much centered up in the chamber.

I do know that the 30-30 ackley feeds fine in a Marlin 336.

I'm researching how to make hyrdoforming dies now, I think it would help with my R&D process. I'm not really interested in paying Whidden to make one for me.

Hornady also makes hydro forming equipment, including dies.
Might be a cheaper alternative.

 

[OutdoorEdventure]

.375-70? Cool build. Love wildcats.

 

[cahunter805]

Very cool idea! I’m guessing it will feed rather well actually. The shoulder shouldn’t cause that much of an issue and it’s already setup to feed 45-70.
I would make the step down bushing also. Sizing that much at once might cause some cases to deform eventually. Are you annealing the cases?

 

[std7mag]

p_ham,

Just checking in on any progress.

 

[p_ham]

@std7mag
I made a seating die, just copied the Hornady design. I've got to make a couple tweaks to it but it'll work fine. I'm going to make a few different stems for it for cast, hammers, etc..

I went ahead and spun a bullet out of aluminum for cycling testing. I used the dimensions for a Hammer 200gr, I don't think the nose profile is right but eh...I don't see there being any issues with the 40 degree shoulder. The way the carrier lines up with the chamber it's pretty much a straight shot.

I'm planning on making the hydraulic form die in the next couple days. I've got a Lee Factory Crimp die that was made for 375 H&H that I need to trim to length too, that should only take a few minutes though.

still no word on the barrel, I'm about to order a blank from X-Caliber and profile it myself.

 

[std7mag]

Yeah, when i grow up, i want a machine shop too.
Oh, wait....

Looking good so far.
Aluminium bullets, eh?

 

[p_ham]

Don't get any ideas with the Aluminum bullets. They don't work. Lot's of people have tried. It does work for bullet tips though.

I got the hydraulic die done today, and modified a shell holder to accept a plug to keep the primer in while forming. I'm going to have to heat treat the plunger head to make sure it lasts. It's O1 tool steel so that'll be easy.

The process so far for straight 45-70 brass (subject to change without notice):
1: size with .40 cal bushing 20⁰ shoulder
2: size with oversized .375 cal bushing 20⁰ shoulder
3: anneal
4: hydroform
5: decap

The 375 bushing has to be larger than the final neck diameter because the neck is what forms the case seal in the hydro die. A few good whacks with a hammer is all it takes. I think I'm going to pick up a cheap Lee press to beat up instead of my Rockchucker.

Finished case capacity (non-fired) avg: 73.1gr H20
Just for kicks I measured a case with the 20⁰ shoulder and it came out to 70.3 gr H2O.
So there's roughly 4% difference.

I'm getting antsy now.
I suppose I should start on the new stock while I'm waiting on the barrel to show.

 

[std7mag]

The way things are right now, the great grand children may be hunting by the time a barrel comes in.
Barrel leade times are ridiculous!
My 12 week barrel took 18 weeks.
Friend ordered his bench rest barrel in June & was told March next year.

 

[mevertsen]

Awesome work...

Curious...

Why is the 20 vs 40 degree shoulder an issue? Or is that just the way you wanted it.

Case capacity?

 

[p_ham]

Awesome work...

Curious...

Why is the 20 vs 40 degree shoulder an issue? Or is that just the way you wanted it.

Case capacity?

Thanks. One reason is case capacity, because this will be in a Marlin lever gun I want as much powder as possible so I can get good performance at lower pressure.
The other reason, is simply because I was able to use a 375 H&H improved reamer instead of having a custom one ground. The standard H&H has too much body taper and other 375 magnums wouldn't line up as well in body diameter.
If a fellow wanted to, he could use any magnum reamer and adjust the neck to whatever he wanted.

 

[p_ham]

This evening I modified the carrier and ejector to allow for a COAL of 2.68". No hang ups at all. It even cycles laying on its side.

 

[p_ham]

I did a little bit of stock work. Still a long ways to go on it. I won't be able to do the fore end until the new barrel is on.

I always forget how much work goes into carving one out.

 

[std7mag]

But you have machinery to do most of the work for ya.
I'd be stuck with a Dremel, files & sand paper.