!!! Wooo hooo !!!

[ELKCHSR]

I was just out on a walk and had 126 elk walk inside of 30 yards from me

There was 21 sets of twins

All but 2 or 3 had a calf, this should be a good year for elk if this is an indicator of the herds around the state

The coolest of them all was an elk that is almost jet black except for the tan patch on her butt, I have a picture of here emblazoned on my mind

I'll have to see if I can find her again, this time I think I'll try to remember my camera

As I got to the edge of an aspen patch on one of my walks, I happened to hear an elk mew, then saw one walking towards me thru the trees

They just kept coming and coming

They started out as one cow with two calves following close behind, then more and more

I just stood still and watched the show, some of the little ones would stand on hind legs and spar, others would call out, there was a lot of talking amongst them as they meandered past

I had a few of them walk within touching distance

If I had been ten seconds sooner, I'd have been in the middle of the herd as they went by

I'm not sure how long I stood motionless, but a guess it would have lasted about 45 minutes

What a treat to end a day, I'll probably be stoked for a couple days after this one

 

[BuzzH]

Wow, 21 sets of twins in one herd huh...

Ever researched how common twins are in elk?

I'm calling big-time BS.

I wonder if Tom (beings how he's a phD in stats) could calculate the chances of 21 sets of twins being in one herd of elk when the occurance of twins in elk is less than one percent?

Now I know why we pay biologists to manage wildlife and also why an education is so important.

 

[Moosie]

Bring a CamCorder next time. Or at least a Camera. Sounds prety cool.

 

[JoseCuervo]

I was just out on a walk and had 126 elk walk inside of 30 yards from me

There was 21 sets of twins

All but 2 or 3 had a calf, this should be a good year for elk if this is an indicator of the herds around the state

The coolest of them all was an elk that is almost jet black except for the tan patch on her butt, I have a picture of here emblazoned on my mind

I'll have to see if I can find her again, this time I think I'll try to remember my camera

As I got to the edge of an aspen patch on one of my walks, I happened to hear an elk mew, then saw one walking towards me thru the trees

They just kept coming and coming

They started out as one cow with two calves following close behind, then more and more

I just stood still and watched the show, some of the little ones would stand on hind legs and spar, others would call out, there was a lot of talking amongst them as they meandered past

I had a few of them walk within touching distance

If I had been ten seconds sooner, I'd have been in the middle of the herd as they went by

I'm not sure how long I stood motionless, but a guess it would have lasted about 45 minutes

What a treat to end a day, I'll probably be stoked for a couple days after this one

Lemme see if I can do the math here.....

Here is what we know.

The Cheese claims to have seen 126 elk.

• 3 Elk did not have calves.
  
• 1 Elk was nearly black
  
• 42 of the elk were twins.
  
• All of the twins had a cow for a mom.
  
• 21 of the cows had two twins.
  
• 66 of the Elk were Twins(42), Moms of twins(21) or had no calves(3).

That leaves 60 elk to be "pairs", or, perhaps, to be "Quads", as a mom could have triplets and not be considered to be "twins".

So, we could have the remaining 60 elk to be 30 cows and 30 calves, or, perhaps, 15 cows and 45 triplets. ( I guess there could be 12 moms and 48 quadruplets, or 10 moms and 50 quintuplets).

So, assuming no triplets, no quads, no quints, etc... we have the following.

126 total elk

broken out to be:

1. 3 elk without calves
2. 42 twin calves
3. 21 moms of twins
4. 30 moms of single calves
5. 30 single calves

Resulting in 51 cows with calves, of which, more than 40% of The Cheese's herd had twins in a species that normally produces less than 1% twins.


But, maybe I read too much into The Cheese's comments....

 

[ERSS]

Real successful very late season cow hunt?

 

[Oak]

The twinning rate in most elk herds is less than 1/3 of 1%, so your observation is significantly abnormal.

 

[The Hedgehog]

I was just out on a walk and had 126 elk walk inside of 30 yards from me

I had it pegged from the first sentence. He can't count to 126.

 

[A-con]

Sounds like you had a great walk, I’m glad to hear calf recruitment is doing so well this year.
It’s a long way from lots of calves to lots of mature elk, but it sounds like a good start. I hope the survival rate is good.

 

[mtmiller]

http://www.jstor.org/stable/3796713?seq=6

http://www.jstor.org/stable/3796713?seq=7

 

[Oak]

Miller's link won't work without being logged in. He is referring to page 7 and 8 of the attached document, in the "Young per Female" section.

 

[Moosie]

Gunner.. I thought you were going to do the "SIZE" math. Within 30 yards would make a 30 Yard circle.

How many Elk can fit in a 30 yrd circle ?

That being said, a Video would have been cool !! Elkchsr, take a Camcorder out next time !!!

 

[noharleyyet]

...take a video...better take a notary along too.

 

[BuzzH]

NHY...may be a better plan to take some common gdamn sense along?

That and remember who his audience is when he chooses to stretch to truth beyond the breaking point by about 2 miles.

Unbelievable...and from someone who claims to know so much about wildlife, resources, etc.????

Hmmmmm?????

 

[noharleyyet]

That and remember who his audience is

...too phuggin funny.

 

[BuzzH]

NHY,

I agree with that...

 

[JB]

Now I know why we pay biologists to manage wildlife.

yep but obviously we should get rid of some of the dead weight.

 

[shoots-straight]

Maybe he got whitetail deer and elk confused. Usually a good birth rate for elk is 84% of mature cows. In all fairness to ElkCHSR, he could have seen a herd of 121 elk with 42 calves in it. The ones hanging out together might have been in nursery groups. They might even suckle another mother, but usually will get the hoof. Our calf to cow ratio in the Bitterroot Post season is hovering around 15 with some areas' a lot less. It's not so much as how many are born, as those that survive. We're in big trouble over here. Can you say Gardner herd all over again but at a smaller scale.

 

[BuzzH]

yep but obviously we should get rid of some of the dead weight.

Agreed.

Dead weight on the wildlife system like game farms, outfitters, welfare ranchers, etc. need to go.

ss, you're probably right. Just find it funny that a guy who goes by the handle of "elkchsr"...wouldnt know that the odds of elk twins is less than 1 percent.

 

[1_pointer]

Now this is a FUNNY thread!

 

[ELKCHSR]

I've been out most of the time since this post was made looking for the black elk again

14 days altogether looking

The sets of twins mentioned earlier in the first post ended up being a mistake I believe

The herd mainly hangs on private ground where the feed is good because the individual who owns it doesn't run cattle and there is plenty of places to hide

You can see them most of the winter from vantage points 2-3 miles away

Anyway, I went into the area I took DanA this last year so as to get above private ground and see if I could intercept them as they moved in and out as the snow receded

The main herd has broken up into groups of 8-12

Some of you seem to get a little over excited which always seems to be the case when I post which is entertaining to no end to say the least

Some of the findings in my travels over the last three weeks is that someone has been poaching cows

I've found a few new skeletons of back bone, head, ribs, and pelvis (which for some who don't know are parts most don't want to pack out)

The skeletons were from this spring some time and still had meat on them

I would guess what I had at first thought were twins are more than likely adoptions by other mothers

Who knows, maybe the bull inseminating all the ladies had a tendency to throw twins, just because it hasn't been seen before doesn't mean it can't happen on rare occasions

But I digress, I wasn't looking for twins or proof they exist as this really isn't important in my book, seen lots of twins, while exciting to watch, my pic portfolio is full of them

The black elk is what I'm after, I'm going to keep looking and maybe get a picture of her