Wildife Task force 90-10, etc.

[Treeshark]

If NR tags are cut and then more NR landowners apply for tags due to being able to sell them there might not even be tags available for NR draw.

Yep, true story.

Or… hear me out here- the state figures out that they make a lot more money selling NRs tags, and they take some from the resident pool as well to supplement NR landowner/outfitter $upply.

Seen it happen…

 

[Johnny Bravo]

So I'm late to the game here so let me see if I have this straight without reading 20 pages....Today....the big 5 did go to 90/10 and they are "talking" about changing the other ones, deer/lope...etc.etc. to 90/10 but it has not happened. If that is the case, if it WERE to happen, how long before it might happen? 3-5 years? Next year?

 

[Shangobango]

There is simply too much demand and too little supply to support much NR allocation in any of these states.

There is a lot of money involved in NR tags as well though too. Be interesting to see how they balance that.

Going to come to a point where only well off residents and wealthy non-residents can afford to hunt anywhere in the U.S. When that happens the whole NAM will have succumbed.

Succumbed to what though? Greed, lack of foresight, lack of proper wildlife management, or a combination of all of the above?

As @RobertD said, that is a discussion for another thread.

 

[Deleted member 16014]

How bold of those residents to “draw the line” at the exact point at which this begins to impact them!

Set asides out of the NR pool and transferable tags would impact my hunts zero, and almost zero respectively. I still think they are BS and I don't want them on the books.

As @mulecreek alludes to maybe I'm naively optimistic there would be resistance.

 

[DFS]

There is a lot of money involved in NR tags as well though too. Be interesting to see how they balance that.

Going to come to a point where only well off residents and wealthy non-residents can afford to hunt anywhere in the U.S. When that happens the whole NAM will have succumbed.

Succumbed to what though? Greed, lack of foresight, lack of proper wildlife management, or a combination of all of the above?

As @RobertD said, that is a discussion for another thread.

People trying to make money off wildlife and public lands. The worst offenders for normal hunters are the public land diy promoters. The opportunities for normal hunters are rapidly going away.

 

[WYelker]

Set asides out of the NR pool and transferable tags would impact my hunts zero, and almost zero respectively. I still think they are BS and I don't want them on the books.

As @mulecreek alludes to maybe I'm naively optimistic there would be resistance.

On some level they would affect all resident hunts. Once transferable tags are an option all HMA and Access Yes enrolled lands would likely disappear. Simply put there would be no way for the state to compete with private outfitters and people buying tags from landowners. Take the Tipton Property in 57. NR takes 12+ years to draw, the Tipton land owner suddenly gets 3 transferable tags for one of the best antelope units in the state. Suddenly he is sitting on $15,000 for just the tags. Then decides that they can offer a place to stay and meals for self guided hunts for an additional $2000 per tag, that is now 21,000 they could make off 3 antelope hunts... Seems crazy but $7,000 for a guaranteed tag, in a top unit for lopes is just the start. Same landowner suddenly get 2 transferable 124 elk tags. Just south in Colorado unit 2/201 those tags are getting well over $10,000 each plus guiding. So for that land owner he now has some $30,000 in hunts with only 5 guys hunting his land. The end result is those tags are no longer available to anyone else so all our opportunity decreases and the land that is currently open is shut down for high paying clients. Of course once this happens just 3 lope tags and 2 elk tags is not enough to compensate for the damage the animals are doing and not enough for the feed the cow elk and doe are eating so the landowner now needs cow tags, and doe fawn tags to help keep the population in check because he is only have 5 hunters a year and the elk are now using that land for sanctuary etc. I only point this out because when I was a kid in CO I never thought that transferable landowner tags would matter, that RFW was a good thing etc. Now 30 years later I realize they were likely the single largest impact to my hunting in CO, even though I never hunt private.

 

[Deleted member 16014]

On some level they would affect all resident hunts. Once transferable tags are an option all HMA and Access Yes enrolled lands would likely disappear. Simply put there would be no way for the state to compete with private outfitters and people buying tags from landowners. Take the Tipton Property in 57. NR takes 12+ years to draw, the Tipton land owner suddenly gets 3 transferable tags for one of the best antelope units in the state. Suddenly he is sitting on $15,000 for just the tags. Then decides that they can offer a place to stay and meals for self guided hunts for an additional $2000 per tag, that is now 21,000 they could make off 3 antelope hunts... Seems crazy but $7,000 for a guaranteed tag, in a top unit for lopes is just the start. Same landowner suddenly get 2 transferable 124 elk tags. Just south in Colorado unit 2/201 those tags are getting well over $10,000 each plus guiding. So for that land owner he now has some $30,000 in hunts with only 5 guys hunting his land. The end result is those tags are no longer available to anyone else so all our opportunity decreases and the land that is currently open is shut down for high paying clients. Of course once this happens just 3 lope tags and 2 elk tags is not enough to compensate for the damage the animals are doing and not enough for the feed the cow elk and doe are eating so the landowner now needs cow tags, and doe fawn tags to help keep the population in check because he is only have 5 hunters a year and the elk are now using that land for sanctuary etc. I only point this out because when I was a kid in CO I never thought that transferable landowner tags would matter, that RFW was a good thing etc. Now 30 years later I realize they were likely the single largest impact to my hunting in CO, even though I never hunt private.

That is a fair point and one I considered, but not to that extent.
Edited to add: I still think it would affect me minimally in my hunting lifetime, and I'm still adamantly opposed to both regardless.

 

[The Hedgehog]

I bailed on Wyoming moose/sheep 20 years ago. What's the price of a point alone? Then the permit itself?

I also gave up on the $15 chance for a 1 in 1000-4000 chance to get drawn for a $2200 sheep, moose, goat licenses in Utah. I'm banking on $75 giving me a lot more of a happy face elsewhere than those annual unsuccessful emails.

At that price, I say let the residents have 100% of the permits..

 

[Shangobango]

People trying to make money off wildlife and public lands. The worst offenders for normal hunters are the public land diy promoters. The opportunities for normal hunters are rapidly going away.

What is your definition of a normal hunter?

 

[Buffs35]

What is your definition of a normal hunter?

Road hunters that shoot past 700 yards off the hood of their truck. Ya know, normal.

 

[cahunter805]

Yep, true story.

Or… hear me out here- the state figures out that they make a lot more money selling NRs tags, and they take some from the resident pool as well to supplement NR landowner/outfitter $upply.

Seen it happen…

Wyoming resident LO tags already come from the resident pool.

 

[WapitiBob]

Guy Eastman needs to quit writing about WY hunting.

 

[ccc23454]

Guy Eastman needs to quit writing about WY hunting.

I am impressed anyone still reads his (eastman's) garbage

 

[JM77]

So I'm late to the game here so let me see if I have this straight without reading 20 pages....Today....the big 5 did go to 90/10 and they are "talking" about changing the other ones, deer/lope...etc.etc. to 90/10 but it has not happened. If that is the case, if it WERE to happen, how long before it might happen? 3-5 years? Next year?

If DEA 90/10 happens in the future, it will happen without a Task Force recommendation.

Same goes for transferable LO tags.

 

[Treeshark]

Wyoming resident LO tags already come from the resident pool.

You are right, I meant transferable ones.

 

[Steve O]

If DEA 90/10 happens in the future, it will happen without a Task Force recommendation.

Same goes for transferable LO tags.

Did you watch or attend the task force meetings? I watched every minute of them and that is not the impression I got.

 

[BuzzH]

Did you watch or attend the task force meetings? I watched every minute of them and that is not the impression I got.

He was there in person and a lot of what happens is discussed when the cameras aren't rolling. 90-10 for deer, elk, and pronghorn is not going to be a task force recommendation.

I don't see much else coming from the task force with the exception of maybe converting preference points to squared bonus points.

 

[Addicting]

exception of maybe converting preference points to squared bonus points.

How does that help? Is it to increase random odds?

 

[Shangobango]

I don't see much else coming from the task force with the exception of maybe converting preference points to squared bonus points.

Thanks for keeping us all updated @BuzzH.

Will that recommendation be for all species? Will it be to keep the current random allocation in place as well?

Personally, I would like squared bonus better than preference if their is still a random draw as well. Gives some of the lower point holders a better shot to draw.

 

[WYelker]

I have not been anywhere as involved as Buzz and Jeff, but the DEA 90/10 is a much larger lift and way more polarizing. I am not sure the future of the task force recommendations. I think there are some other low fruit that the task force might address, resident no resident allocation on doe fawn/cow calf? Maybe the fee for NR tags doe/fawn/cow/calf. Also feel that we can work on funding to increase access programs and benefits to landowners who are in HMA and access yes programs….

I also agree there are some changes coming for points. Be it an adjustment to the percents. 50/50 random vs points or a move to squared bonus points…