When Hunting became shooting.

[geetar]

Seems more like a boomer rant that goes all over the place than an actual article but I’m a millennial so I’m sure the writer doesn’t care what I think. Just curious though. Wouldn’t it have been easy for people a generation or two before this guy to write a gripe page about back in the good old days when real hunters used guns that only held one bullet at a time? Things change Mr. Wensel. It’s almost comical that people get to be near 70 years old and can’t figure out things don’t stay the same but they call my generation stupid.

 

[Dan O]

Golf is to easy now that people can hit the ball 300 yards.

That depends on which fairway it lands in

 

[Gerald Martin]

I definitely wish they would go away, I think they help accelerate threads off the rails.

Personally, I love a good debate, I feel like occasionally I will spar with someone make a comment and get a bunch of “likes” and that person feels like the entire forum is against them. Pretty much destroys any chance for dialogue as understandably that individual gets defensive. Been on the reverse end as well, doesn’t feel great.

The key is to read the wind and make an end run to insert a zinger to harvest a few easy likes to up your reaction score.
It’s kind of like seeing a bunch of hunters heading up a canyon and hustling around the top to cover the escape routes.

 

[gouch]

Seems more like a boomer rant that goes all over the place than an actual article but I’m a millennial so I’m sure the writer doesn’t care what I think. Just curious though. Wouldn’t it have been easy for people a generation or two before this guy to write a gripe page about back in the good old days when real hunters used guns that only held one bullet at a time? Things change Mr. Wensel. It’s almost comical that people get to be near 70 years old and can’t figure out things don’t stay the same but they call my generation stupid.

Interesting take, Thinking that Mr. Wensel didn't understand that things change. That is what the entire article is about. How much hunting has changed. What he is lamenting isn't so much the change but the fact that when things change something gets lost in that change. What he feels is being lost is what he, and I, feel are some of the most important aspects of the experience of hunting. The development of the hunting skills that allow you to have an up close and personal relationship with your prey. Then using those skills to kill an animal with minimal aid of technology. That's a damn fine feeling. I don't see where he blames young people for anything. Old farts use compound bows, inline muzzleloaders and magnum rifles topped with scopes that do everything but grill the backstrap for you, just as much as young folk do. Personally I think things are slowly trending back to " the good old ways" Long bows and recurves are becoming all the rage. Many are starting to realize that a sidelock is ten times more fun to shoot than a scope mounted inline. It wouldn't even surprise me if people started to realize that a lever action .30-30 with open sights is a damn fine way to fill the freezer.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

Interesting take, Thinking that Mr. Wensel didn't understand that things change. That is what the entire article is about. How much hunting has changed. What he is lamenting isn't so much the change but the fact that when things change something gets lost in that change. What he feels is being lost is what he, and I, feel are some of the most important aspects of the experience of hunting. The development of the hunting skills that allow you to have an up close and personal relationship with your prey. Then using those skills to kill an animal with minimal aid of technology. That's a damn fine feeling. I don't see where he blames young people for anything. Old farts use compound bows, inline muzzleloaders and magnum rifles topped with scopes that do everything but grill the backstrap for you, just as much as young folk do. Personally I think things are slowly trending back to " the good old ways" Long bows and recurves are becoming all the rage. Many are starting to realize that a sidelock is ten times more fun to shoot than a scope mounted inline. It wouldn't even surprise me if people started to realize that a lever action .30-30 with open sights is a damn fine way to fill the freezer.

Lots of different people in our community. 7 years ago one group dominated hunting media.

Randy and Rinella left sportsmans/outdoors channel as did others. Instagram/youtube/amazon have allowed other groups to gain market share and showcase their experiences.

Muzzy hunters, long bows, etc are not a recent phenomenon. Those folks have been practicing their craft for decades, they just weren't the most vocal or marketable.

You are certainly right that these hunting styles have become more mainstream. I remember the Kuiu add from a few years ago with someone rappelling with a long bow.



No wrong way to do it, I enjoy rifle hunting and holding out for big bulls and I hope to fill the freezer with an east coast button buck with my longbow hopefully with some help from @ChrisC, and get to see what flintlock hunting is about with @Slm864.

I hope everyone is able to get out and enjoy this fall whether its with an AR, selfbow, crossbow, custom long range rifle etc. lots of good stories so far I look forward to more!

 

[Gerald Martin]

Oh my. My logical mind has so many questions about that pic. What goes down must come up. Unless, of course he is walking out the bottom. In that case, why didn't he walk up? Oh, I know. The heli dropped him off at the top.

I wonder what kind of beer he drinks?

 

[Europe]

gouch

I sure hope you are right. But it has been a long time since a young stud in his 20's, 30's or even 60's has made a pass at me. But, Hope springs eternal !

geetar

if we are going to base our responses and his article on the names given each generation, please ask Randy to delete my post's on page 4 ( 62 AND 72 ), since I represent the "silent" generation--my bad.

willm1313: I disagree. I can not remember how many times I said to my husband. "If you had done it right we wouldn't be tracking him !!! "

Just joking with you, I do in fact agree with you and I have been doing this a long time. Sometimes I learn something new from my grandchildren and sometimes they learn something new from me.

Keep ones ears and mind open (-:

Mr, Martin--"Ditto" I am NOT doing that ! ( rock climbing,)-- a least not like the one in that picture. That is why helicopters were invented (-:

 

[MTLabrador]

Oh my. My logical mind has so many questions about that pic. What goes down must come up. Unless, of course he is walking out the bottom. In that case, why didn't he walk up? Oh, I know. The heli dropped him off at the top.

I wonder what kind of beer he drinks?

Super hardcore dehydrated beer.

Powdered Beer To Go. Just Add Water - Beer Street Journal

Hiker? Camper? You might want to take a look at this one. A beer powder that you add water (and bubbles to) and boom beer on the go. Alaska-based company

beerstreetjournal.com

 

[noharleyyet]

Ah, the old days....

 

[Gerald Martin]

At some point, I have to realize that it's time to stop mocking the competition and climb the mountain tomorrow. Anyone want to loan me a helicopter to get me to the top? I promise I won't shoot over 300 yards with my stock 30-06.

 

[longbow51]

And the seasons they go round and round
And the painted ponies go up and down
We're captive on the carousel of time
We can't return we can only look
Behind from where we came
And go round and round and round
In the circle game...
Joni Mitchell

 

[Pucky Freak]

Interesting discussion, but...

Any votes to have a thread lock automatically after 2 years of inactivity?

“Oh, I didn’t see that the last post was over __ years ago”

 

[Panda Bear]

gouch

I sure hope you are right. But it has been a long time since a young stud in his 20's, 30's or even 60's has made a pass at me. But, Hope springs eternal !

geetar

if we are going to base our responses and his article on the names given each generation, please ask Randy to delete my post's on page 4 ( 62 AND 72 ), since I represent the "silent" generation--my bad.

I hope I can still laugh at myself when I am your age. "20's, 30's, or even 60's "

as to the article, I may be wrong but I thought he was relating to us, his view of "change". I think the two things that have changed since my grandfather was doing it, is technology and time. Technology has changed hunting, whether it is as simple as better bullets or the functions and features of cell phones. And we just dont seem to have as much expendable time or we dont allow ourselves to have it perhaps, but it is not there. But as far as hunting goes, we have people right here on this forum who hunt differently. I like the 71 and close shots, Brent still hunts with the long gun, others with the bow, I saw a thread taking about shooting 600 yards, noharleyyet posted picture of his rig on this thread (trebuchet)

too each their own.

 

[geetar]

@Europe hope you didn’t mistake anything I said to be a shot at you in any way. I had not even read your comments when I posted. I actually tried to read the article and have an objective perspective on it but the further I went the more of a lengthy gripe it seemed and we can hardly complain that hunting is a dying sport as is often talked about if we are always talking about how the good old days are behind us. After reading his article why would anyone even want to try this boring shooting match we call hunting?

 

[geetar]

Interesting take, Thinking that Mr. Wensel didn't understand that things change. That is what the entire article is about. How much hunting has changed. What he is lamenting isn't so much the change but the fact that when things change something gets lost in that change. What he feels is being lost is what he, and I, feel are some of the most important aspects of the experience of hunting. The development of the hunting skills that allow you to have an up close and personal relationship with your prey. Then using those skills to kill an animal with minimal aid of technology. That's a damn fine feeling. I don't see where he blames young people for anything. Old farts use compound bows, inline muzzleloaders and magnum rifles topped with scopes that do everything but grill the backstrap for you, just as much as young folk do. Personally I think things are slowly trending back to " the good old ways" Long bows and recurves are becoming all the rage. Many are starting to realize that a sidelock is ten times more fun to shoot than a scope mounted inline. It wouldn't even surprise me if people started to realize that a lever action .30-30 with open sights is a damn fine way to fill the freezer.

I understand what you’re saying. Maybe I would have been better off wording it that Mr. Wensel seems surprised and frustrated that things change instead of not realizing it and after 70 years I would have thought he would have come to expect it. I’m not into the long range shooting craze myself. In fact I usually shoot an 06 with a 4x scope and I’ve sold my compound bow to get into traditional archery so I totally get wanting to keep the old ways around. It’s just a bore to listen to a guy act like all the good days are behind us in an article that rambles all over the place. We definitely lose something each time something changes but there are things to be gained each time something changes. Just depends on how you look at it.

 

[gouch]

Longing for the good old days only makes sense if the good old days were taken away by means beyond you control. I started hunting with a recurve bow in 1966. I killed my first deer in 1968 with that recurve. Just this year I upgraded to a long bow. So not much has changed for me in the last 54 years. The fact that other people are killing animals at 600 yards with high tech equipment doesn't effect my hunting at all. The only things I really miss about the good old days are that there were more critters so it was easier to get one, there were a lot less people out there during archery season so it was more peaceful and my knees didn't hurt. Mostly it's the knees.

 

[BuzzH]

Longing for the good old days only makes sense if the good old days were taken away by means beyond you control. I started hunting with a recurve bow in 1966. I killed my first deer in 1968 with that recurve. Just this year I upgraded to a long bow. So not much has changed for me in the last 54 years. The fact that other people are killing animals at 600 yards with high tech equipment doesn't effect my hunting at all. The only things I really miss about the good old days are that there were more critters so it was easier to get one, there were a lot less people out there during archery season so it was more peaceful and my knees didn't hurt. Mostly it's the knees.

The bolded part, yes it does, it affects us all.

There is absolutely no debate about it that the ability to kill animals more efficiently at long range, better glass, GPS technology, google earth, trail cams, better clothing, better optics, ATV's, UTV's, ebikes, it all impacts the resource.

The more efficient we become, it impacts herd dynamics, bull to cow/buck to doe ratio's, impacts trophy quality, and total populations.

The only way that the GF agencies have to really compensate for the efficiency of the modern hunter is to:

1. Limit technology which is hard to legislate and unpopular because companies like to sell products that many think they "need" to be successful. Follow the money. Its also tough to put the technology genie back in the bottle.

2. Limit permits as more efficiency means more animals die.

3. Limit season length.

After seeing the BS that goes on with sheep hunting in Wyoming first hand (as well as elk and deer), there is NO question in my mind that technology is severely limiting over-all opportunity and over-all quality.

The only real question is how much opportunity we are all willing to sacrifice for the sake of technology making it easier to find success.

But, make no mistake about it, technology is impacting our wildlife and hunting opportunities. That really sucks for the guys that value season length, days in the field, and opportunity over efficiency.

 

[Nameless Range]

The bolded part, yes it does, it affects us all.

There is absolutely no debate about it that the ability to kill animals more efficiently at long range, better glass, GPS technology, google earth, trail cams, better clothing, better optics, ATV's, UTV's, ebikes, it all impacts the resource.

The more efficient we become, it impacts herd dynamics, bull to cow/buck to doe ratio's, impacts trophy quality, and total populations.

The only way that the GF agencies have to really compensate for the efficiency of the modern hunter is to:

1. Limit technology which is hard to legislate and unpopular because companies like to sell products that many think they "need" to be successful. Follow the money. Its also tough to put the technology genie back in the bottle.

2. Limit permits as more efficiency means more animals die.

3. Limit season length.

After seeing the BS that goes on with sheep hunting in Wyoming first hand (as well as elk and deer), there is NO question in my mind that technology is severely limiting over-all opportunity and over-all quality.

The only real question is how much opportunity we are all willing to sacrifice for the sake of technology making it easier to find success.

But, make no mistake about it, technology is impacting our wildlife and hunting opportunities. That really sucks for the guys that value season length and opportunity over efficiency.

Well said Buzz. It's a drum I've beat too often on here, but your point (1) is one I wish folks would entertain more.

We could retain all the opportunity we currently have, and maybe more, if we seriously entertained limiting technology. We aren't bound by logic to limit permits and season lengths as time and pressure progresses. It's a path we are choosing.

 

[MTGomer]

Buzz is right. Even just gear and glass.
I don’t shoot what most consider long range, but I do put nice binoculars that never used to exist on tripods that didn’t either and that has killed a few things that otherwise never would have been seen.

 

[Panda Bear]

As I mentioned in post 93, Technology has changed hunting a lot and not just "gadgetry", but that also,. I am in agreement with BuzzH, MTGomer. and Nameless Range and the points they have made. We are even hypocritical about using technology. If anyone but an Inuit hunts Polar Bear , they can only hunt them via a dog sled. But we can use a snowmobile. Plus the other side of the coin in reference to technology. We are able to determine the thickness of the ice so we have fewer falling through the ice when hunting.
But being a traditional hunter ( whatever that is ) I agree with BuzzH that technology has a huge impact on wildlife, hunters and the future of hunting. But how do we stop it, what do we stop--better bullets, better glass, better cell phone technology---and, who decides ?