Whats a hunter...

[Moosie]

MAN, Just when I thought I knew what a hunter was, The rules change. What is considered hunting ? I hear that Hunting on a Ranch in Texas isn't hunting. Alright... I'll play along, then I hear that hunting in Texas even on Public land isn't hunting either. Do I have that right yet ?

So is Hunting with hounds Hunting ? Or is it only hunting if it's Bears and Cougar.. and not if it's chasing deer ? Is sitting in a Treestand on a Farm hunting ? Now I'm talking a Private ranch with NO fence around it. Where the deer come in every day Even if there is no fence but there is "0" pressure because it's private land ? YAH, I have a Grandmom-in-law that has Awsome Whitetail on her place and she has some nice bucks coming onto her place nightly. OHH thats hunting... I see.... BUT a 10,000 acre ranch sitting on a Stand ISn't.Or maybe THAT is but if there is a Feeder it's not... But then if It's a FOOD plot Back east to bring in the Whitetail it is Hunting again....

I'm guessing hunting with a Rifle and shooting an Elk at 1000 YArds Isn't Hunting but just shooting.... But if you sneak up to 300 Yards or closer it is hunting. So would the same go for shooting a Rifle at 300 yards V's Shooting a bow at 30 yards... I'm guesing the 300 YArd shooter isn't really a hunter either right ? Or is he/she.... ?!?!

MAN, So many hard Questions so Many smart guys on the Net with Big hairy ASS's and 2" peckers..... Will one of you please stand to the plate and Help a fellow hunter.. Errrr Shooter... Errrrr NON Hunter out

MAny thanx in Advance !!!

 

[danr55]

Hey 279 1/4.. Here's the same question in a different format. If my question was not quite to your liking, try this one...

 

[Michaelr]

Moosie....

I'm going to give this one a shot, but you are going to have to wait until later

The wife has me painting, and putting new carpet in the kids rooms

Maybe later after she runs out of steam

 

[Tara]

Well SWEETHEART for that comment we are going to do it(paint and carpet) all night long!!!

 

[BuzzH]

In the world according to me, I'll answer your question.

As for hounds and cats (I've never ran bears with hounds).

Hunting cats with hounds aint really hunting. Dont get me wrong, its cool to study tracks, see the dogs work, how they work, all that cool stuff. But, if you have decent hounds, a fairly new track, and you're in just decent physical shape, the hunts over once the dogs are out. I'd say killing a lion with dogs is just about like shooting a beer can off a fence post. I admit I killed on that way, but I didnt get much out of bagging that lion at all. Yeah, it was a tough day, lots of hiking, long pack carrying a dead cat, but killing that cat felt cheap. Now, tracking one on foot or calling one in with a predator call....now thats hunting. Am I against using dogs for cats and bears? Hell no. Is it really "hunting"? Yeah, sort of...until you pull the trigger.

On to the Texas style of hunting. To me if theres high wire the answer is no, its not hunting. I dont feel right about a hunt if the animals are enclosed. I'm not really opposed to it in Texas, but I'm dead set against it in states that have public lands and public wildlife a plenty.

Hunting public wildlife on quality private land without fences is hunting. In particular if you hunt the older age class animals. I do have a very big problem with paying private land owners to hunt their land, and thats why I dont pay to hunt, and why I rarely hunt on private land.

On the extreme long range shooting at game, its just that. I think its pretty impressive what a really good long range shot is capable of. I also think theres little to no hunting ability in it. I think a lot of game is wounded, even though I've never heard one story of a LRH wounding something at long range. I am not impressed with people shooting long range at big-game. I am impressed with hunters who take the sport seriously enough to get close. Those type of people may be capable of some LR shooting, even shoot rifle that are capable of shooting LR, but they dont. These type of hunters would be just as effective with an open-sighted lever gun...not because of their equipment or their skill with their equipment, but because they know how to hunt. Am I against LR shooting on game? Yes, because most that do it arent capable.

I think theres way too much emphasis put on hanging dead shit on a wall. The only thing that matters to lots of people is just that, a dead critter. Just staying within the state and federal laws doesnt make a hunt right for me. I take it a little more seriously than that. I know when a hunt is right and when its not, and theres plenty of legal "hunts", equipment, etc. that aint right in my book.

Some people just have lower standards, morals, and ethics than others...I just dont and wont support what I feel is wrong...and thats final.

 

[Moosie]

Mike... I'd rather Be "Laying Carpet" ythen posting here too.... Take your time, Hell take a few days if ya want !! Sounds like Tara is Keeping' ya Busy !!!!! Hubba Hubba

BUZZ... I expected alot shittier post from ya

Good post I must say !!! Thanx for your Clarification. I'll disagree on a few points but I can see 100% how you think with that post. MAybe someday We'll do some "REAL" hunting together.. Even if you're a HAiry ass 2" pecker guy

Anyone else have .02 out there ?

 

[BuzzH]

Actually, its a hairy shouldered, hairy backed, very hairy assed, but 3" peckered guy!

Speaking of 2" peckered guys, I gotta tell this story.

I was calling coyotes one day, first time I ever did it. I went with my best friend and his dad (who used to hunt coyotes for a living when the prices were high.) Anyway the day he picked to go was prime, but it was freaking cold. I think it warmed up to about -21 and our first stand it was -30. Anyway, he called in 21 coyotes that day. We didnt get them all, but we bagged several. Anyway, my buddies dad stops on the way back to the truck from our first setup to take a leak. He says, "man I hate this!" I said, "what pissin' when its 30 below?" "No", he said, "having 4 layers of clothes on and only a 2 layer pecker!"

I laughed my ass off.

 

[Calif. Hunter]

I don't like paying a landowner to hunt on his land, but sometimes that is the only way to play. Here, the most common big game animal are wild hogs. The season is open year-round in most places, but the hogs are smart and stay on private land because there is water, crops and fewer hunters. They say a hog is as smart as a 5-year old child - just can't talk. In fact, a very successful elk hunter, who also is a successful hog hunter, told me to hunt elk like hogs with horns. That year, I got my first elk - a 6x6. In any case, if you want to hunt hogs, you either hunt private land or you pay to hunt on a miltary base (Hunter Liggett and Camp Roberts both have good hog populations.) Otherwise, you will hunt a lot before you ever even see a hog. I hunted hogs for years on public land before bagging my first - a little 125 pounder.

Deer out here are similar, in that they mainly hang out on private land. But you can get a buck out of the forest or wilderness areas if you hunt hard. I've never paid to hunt deer here, and I've got a few.

So I don't like to pay, but I will. I've paid to hunt an area out of state, gotten to know it, then hunted it on my own before too.

 

[Moosie]

So is hunting Hogs hunting ? If it's like hunting a 5 year old kid that couldn't be too hard... I am bringing my kids to Swimming lessons and there is 5 year olds Every were

 

[DRAFTSTUD]

I really like the spin on Western vs Eastern "what is a Hunt". First, Here in Louisiana we have small tracts that we lease up until we have enough to hunt Whitetails, Do I feel like I am doing something the Hunting Gods dislike, Hell No! My first lease was around 500 acres, the local rednecks had spotlighted it to the point that it was THREE years before I saw a deer! Now I have a Healthy number of bucks and does. So, If I had listened to the ones who say leasing land is'nt hunting, Who would have controlled this land until the deer population had time to recover? I now control around 2000 acres, deer come and go from my "safe lease" to expand into other nearby areas. If you could see what a smart buck can do to avoid being tagged on a small tract of land you would'nt think hunting in Texas, either public or High fence was out of bounds by the "hairy assed penis challenged hunting gods"!

 

[twodot]

great question, in my opinion we "hunters" as a group have become much to splintered into our own little elitest groups. traditional bow vs. high tech./ sidelock vs. inline. / quality deer management vs. the guy who wants his freezer full. spot n stalk vs. bait watchers. treestanders vs. organized drivers. and on and on. the problem with this {as i see it} is the attitude that the other guy is some kind of low life non sporting jerk who shouldn't be in the woods. this is pitiful. we have deer hunters around here who hate rabbit and coon hunters because they think the dogs are running the deer out of the area. that just should not be. i notice on these boards i see guys blast a guy for shooting a mt. lion over dogs, but think that jumping out of a truck to shoot a coyote is just fine, what kind of crap is that? then we have the guy who begrudges some little kid, first time hunter, or lady for killing the big buck rather than being happy for them and trying to help them know just what a special trophy they got. i'm trying not to puke here, what we gotta remember is some people only get that one week-end per season to go to the woods and if they just want to tag out on the first animal they see and get home that is their right and choice, not mine or yours. if they want to pay big bucks to go to a fenced ranch and get a monster bull or buck let em. what does that have to do with you and me? if a guy is satisfied to shoot a button buck rather than wait for a chance at the big boy once again, none of our concern. i personally could fill all of my deer tags from my front porch each year if i wanted to. but i chose to rarely even hunt at home. what about the guy who does shoot his from the house? if that is how he likes to get his deer, more power to him. in my opinion anyone who persues game with intent to kill it is a hunter. his methods should not enter into the picture at all. some folks can't stand a physical type of hunt. some want to go but not bad enough to make it a priority in their lifestyle. so be it. do i like the istant gratification type of hunts where the client is set up in a shooting box and the game comes in like clockwork? not for me, but that is what makes the way i hunt all the more special to me. if you take a gun,bow,spear,rock, or whatever to the woods to kill game you are a hunter and we have somthing in comon. greedy, selfish, holier than thou types are messing up our ranks. twodot

 

[1_pointer]

In line with Buzz's comments, hunting is what you make of it. Even if it is legal, you only have to make YOU happy. For me, hunting is a process, from scouting, to working over my gear, or even buying new/more gear, which hopefully culminates in a kill. However, the kill is not necessary for one to say they have been hunting. I didn't kill a bear in Canada, but I had one hell of a time trying and would do it again in the drop of the hat! I could've shot a bear or two, but neither would have made me happy so I didn't. Another example from my limited experience, I had a tag for the Elk Refuge in Jackson. I went up on Thanksgiving weekend with the thoughts of giving it a whirl. But after seeing the way the 'hunt' was conducted I decided it wasn't for me. I didn't want my first elk kill to be that way.

So, I hunt to make ME happy and greatly enjoy the process that goes into it. I've also found that being more focused on the process has made hunting more enjoyable for me. Hunt what/how that makes you happy and is legal, the rest is just fluff.

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 08-07-2003 09:00: Message edited by: 1_pointer ]</font>

 

[Calif. Hunter]

Moosie - it's baiting, and unethical, to hunt 5-year olds within 500 yards of a swimming pool or jumper.


Good points, all.

 

[Tom]

Its a male chovenist question!? What's a hunter/huntress would be a more politically correct way to ask the question. haha

They are a person who legally seeks to kill animals.

If you don't want to kill them, its a nature observer. If its not legal, its poachers.

There are different styles of hunting that people discuss some and try some of also. Some hunters even hunt one style with more style themselves also, but that is a different issue. Hunters have their own ethics in the ways they hunt the different styles. Hunters have their own ethics when we hunt in groups also. Like P&Y rules, B&C rules, TGR rules, SCI rules, ROE rules and rules in other countries also.

I've never heard of an ethics discussion on the styles in varmint hunting though, is there such a topic? Like a guy, who kills 20 coyotes for kicks and then pisses in his pants. He's a hunter, if it was legal, but some may not hunt with such style as he exhibits. Get it?

 

[1_pointer]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> Its a male chovenist question!? What's a hunter/huntress would be a more politically correct way to ask the question. haha
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>When referring to people of both sexes with a generic term proper convention is to use the masculine form of the noun if there is a difference. Right? Besides, I don't feel the term hunter portrays any indication of sex.

PS- Don't get huffy over this, I was just bored.

 

[cjcj]

I`m glad that buzz has somewhat changed his stance on hunting, i think most of us prefer his style of doing it,sound`s like he won`t be joining PETA,if we don`t support everyone`s right to legaly hunt the way they want[it doesn`t mean you have to like it] then in my opinion ALL hunting will suffer.

 

[Tom]

1_pointer, good point.

 

[dgibson]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Hunting public wildlife on quality private land without fences is hunting. In particular if you hunt the older age class animals. I do have a very big problem with paying private land owners to hunt their land, and thats why I dont pay to hunt, and why I rarely hunt on private land.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>So if you aren't hunting for "older age class animals" (which is to say, big racks, I assume), it isn't hunting? That would mean that only trophy hunters are "real" hunters. Which I must call BS.

As to paying landowners to hunt, I think leasing & access fees are a pissy situation and I hate that things are headed that direction, but I also think that has ZERO to do with whether you're "hunting" or not. If a farmer lets me hunt for free one year, then charges me a trespass fee the next, what's the difference? Did the animals suddenly become tame when I handed over the cash?

Paying for a guide is a different matter; but how you gain legal access to the property has nothing to do with the quality of the hunt.

 

[BuzzH]

dgibson, what I meant in regard to the older age class animals is that it wouldnt be much of a challenge on good quality private land (or even good public land) to whack the first legal deer you see. If I did that every year, my seasons wouldnt last more than a few hours. It may be hunting, but it sure doesnt provide much adventure, creativity, or challenge.

Also, killing older age class animals can be good management...

It isnt all about the trophy quality, it about being able to spend more time hunting and maybe practicing good wildlife management.

On the private land issue, I feel if I lease private or pay a trespass fee, I'm contributing to a problem, and then PART of the problem. So, I just refuse to do it for that reason. I dont want to see hunters being forced into paying trespass fees, paying $750 for a cull buck or $4500 for a trophy buck. Thats the reason I think its so imperative to have quality habitat on public lands....and also why its important to keep public lands in public hands.

As Tom pointed out in another thread, some states are going to deals where the F&G pays a fee to landowners in exchange for access. I support and donate to that, because the rights to hunt those properties are not exclusive and its not a requirement for those that hunt there to even contribute.

 

[Troy Jones]

Seems like some of you just don't get it. There is a differance and seems to be quite easy to see. You have shooters, killers and hunters, no skill needed for the first two. To me a hunter is an ethical, skilled, and moral outdoorsman. The rest are lazy part-timers with more money than brains.

I wish my dong was 8 inches long, so I wouldn't have to carry this big bastard around!