Unable to retrieve animal due to private land and punching tag

[jt13]

I can only speak for the laws in Pennsylvania but the best bet is, as many recommended, to contact local Fish and Game and ask what you should do.

In PA a landowner can legally prevent you from going on their private property to retrieve a downed game animal without their permission. This however does not allow the landowner that prohibiting access to take the animal. They cannot so much as move it as they are not the individual that legally harvested the game. Their choices are to let you get it or let it there to rot into food for the coyotes and crows. Also, though game wardens in PA are allowed to go upon any lands or waters posted or otherwise, they will not step in on private boundary line issues and retrieve game animals for you that jumped a fence unless there's extenuating circumstances.

EDIT: And to answer the actual question, in Pennsylvania if you make any "reasonable effort" to recover your game animal but are unsuccessful in doing so you are not legally required to punch a tag.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

I have heard stories here in Indiana where there are people who year after year hunt property lines, make bad shots on animals, then want to stomp all over their neighbors ground for the rest of opening weekend looking for their deer, effectively ruining the other person's chances. I can understand this happening once or twice, but if it becomes a pattern year after year then I can understand a landowner eventually denying access. This is, of course, a different scenario than having an animal down within sight of the property line.

Two years ago my father-n-law had a guy ask permission to retrieve a buck that had jumped the fence onto his property, they guy told us he had been hunting on the neighbors place with permission and wounded a buck, my father-n-law said yeah no problem, this was around 10 am. That evening we are hunting and see the guy taking a shot at buck on the property, that didn't have a scratch on it. We were pretty sure the guy had seen a buck on my father-n-law's place that morning, then got permission to "retrieve" so he could surreptitiously kill it... Needless to say a phone call was made to various neighbors and that guy isn't going to be hunting in that unit anymore.

On the other side of things there was a spot I wanted to hunt on BLM where the best access point was through a strip of private... I used onx + county property records (I have a decent amount of experience doing title searchers for work) + called the local assessor/clerk + called local game warden and I wasn't able to get a number for the owner to make the call to ask permission. It was one of those giant ranches that was held by a dummy corp that had a physically address, which when you looked it up was actually the address for a company who provided a mail forwarding service. In the case of situations like that I'm not sure how you would make a good faith effort to get permission to retrieve game.

 

[JDH]

There are a lot of blanket statements in this thread, that even if they are accurate in the state you're familiar with, need an asterisk next to them because these laws tend to vary from state to state.

I have heard stories here in Indiana where there are people who year after year hunt property lines, make bad shots on animals, then want to stomp all over their neighbors ground for the rest of opening weekend looking for their deer, effectively ruining the other person's chances. I can understand this happening once or twice, but if it becomes a pattern year after year then I can understand a landowner eventually denying access. This is, of course, a different scenario than having an animal down within sight of the property line.

I am fortunate that in each of my private property spots we have good relationships with the neighboring landowners. If I need to grab a deer on their side no problem, they need one on ours no problem. But when I hunt public, and don't usually know the adjacent private property owner, I try to give a fairly wide berth to the boundary to allow for a 100-yard death sprint.

And I've never had to do it either, but like some others have said, if the deer is within sight of the line I'm going to grab it, even if it does mean risking a ticket.

In Indiana, isn't the first trespassing offense basically a slap on the wrist? I have always heard that if you catch someone trespassing once you need to get a witness (preferably LE) so that you can have a report so that the second time that person trespasses you can file charges. The first offense is just a warning.

 

[LCH]

In Indiana, isn't the first trespassing offense basically a slap on the wrist? I have always heard that if you catch someone trespassing once you need to get a witness (preferably LE) so that you can have a report so that the second time that person trespasses you can file charges. The first offense is just a warning.

I really don't know. I do know that a lot of people trespass for less honorable reasons with seemingly no real repercussions.

 

[bobbydean]

I question calling the Game and Fish warden. I have hunted for 45 years. I was at least in the field at least 35 years. I have had contact with a warden 2 times. If you call a warden, where is he and will he respond? New Mexico is a large state with a very thin, too thin, warden pool. I would think they are already at a geographical point that they consider important and really doubt they would respond to a retrieval call.

My hunting party did shoot a deer on a private land boundary and he fell the wrong way. We went under the fence and drug the deer 5 feet. Did not ask the landowner and never thought about asking the landowner. I do think different states have a different attitude on this issue. I have only ran into 1 landowner in my years on hunting. We were camped on his land with his cousin with his permission. He was checking his land. We were hunting National Forest, but camped on private.

 

[RobG]

I question calling the Game and Fish warden. I have hunted for 45 years. I was at least in the field at least 35 years. I have had contact with a warden 2 times. If you call a warden, where is he and will he respond? New Mexico is a large state with a very thin, too thin, warden pool. I would think they are already at a geographical point that they consider important and really doubt they would respond to a retrieval call.

My hunting party did shoot a deer on a private land boundary and he fell the wrong way. We went under the fence and drug the deer 5 feet. Did not ask the landowner and never thought about asking the landowner. I do think different states have a different attitude on this issue. I have only ran into 1 landowner in my years on hunting. We were camped on his land with his cousin with his permission. He was checking his land. We were hunting National Forest, but camped on private.

In Montana the procedure is to call the MFWP (1-800-TIP-MONT) if you can't get permission from the owner. They will then try to contact the owner and then advise you. I don't think that they necessarily have to be there in person. I think this used to be in the MT regs, but I don't see it anymore.

 

[MNElkNut]

So this thread has danced around this topic but let me ask the question I ask my firearm safety students (and there are no right and wrong answers!).

Is there a situation where the ethical thing to do is break a law? Another situation that has came up is if an animal has its jaw shot off but you do not have the appropriate tag, do you shoot it? It is the ethical thing to do but is against the law. Conundrums for sure.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

Is there a situation where the ethical thing to do is break a law?

“Ethical behavior is doing the right thing when no one else is watching- even when doing the wrong thing is legal.”

I would argue that ethical behavior is doing the right thing when everyone is watching-even when doing so is illegal.

In your example I think the ethical thing would be to shoot the animal and then self report. Do the right thing and take the points on your license.

 

[JosephBrown]

So this thread has danced around this topic but let me ask the question I ask my firearm safety students (and there are no right and wrong answers!).

Is there a situation where the ethical thing to do is break a law? Another situation that has came up is if an animal has its jaw shot off but you do not have the appropriate tag, do you shoot it? It is the ethical thing to do but is against the law. Conundrums for sure.

I do think it can be ethical to break the laws. People make laws. Lots of people are very unethical. I personally do not think that laws define ethics based on that reason alone.

 

[BrentD]

Just as a point of for comparison and possible future needs, IF you hunt in IOWA and lose a game animal over onto private ground, you may pursue it with or without the landowner's permission. You do NOT have to ask. But you must go unarmed if you do not have permission to do otherwise. So, if you get there and your deer is not dead, you have a problem. However, if the animal is dead, you can drag it back without asking - DO NOT DRIVE, WALK.

 

[8andcounting]

I hunt montana for several weeks every fall for deer and elk and if this happened to me where I had a wounded animal cross the fence to where I don't have permission, the very first thing I would do is call Fwp tip hotline and get info to a warden . Second thing I'd do is the same is the first and so on and so on .

 

[Schaaf]

I’ll wait till dark if I have to...permission or not, that critter’s getting a backpack ride.

Yep.

 

[Nameless Range]

Last fall, I was hunting with my brother on some public land. He lined up on a bull and hit it solidly in the neck. It dropped, got up and took off running. He let a few more fly, but not before it had made it 500 yards onto some nearby private land and laid down. We sat there for a moment. It looked dead as could be, so walked back down to the truck, and called the landowner. He told us to go get it. This landowner holds about 3,500 contiguous acres. By the time we got back up the mountain it was dark. We crossed over onto the rancher's land and where the elk was lying was a pool of blood in the snow, and tracks heading up-gulch. We tracked that elk for hours, bumping it in the dark, pushing it further and further. Until about 1:30 am when it finally expired. We got it off the mountain around 4:00 in the morning.

I've thought about what would have happened if we just trespassed to retrieve it. That would have been bad. But had the landowner told us to pound sand, I think the results would have very much been the same.

 

[TheGrayRider]

Another interesting, similar legal topic is old, unkept public roads or trails formerly used by persons with horses or early automobiles and machinery through private property. Is the road or trail still available for public use on foot or otherwise to access other property?

 

[antelopedundee]

So this thread has danced around this topic but let me ask the question I ask my firearm safety students (and there are no right and wrong answers!).

Is there a situation where the ethical thing to do is break a law? Another situation that has came up is if an animal has its jaw shot off but you do not have the appropriate tag, do you shoot it? It is the ethical thing to do but is against the law. Conundrums for sure.

Years ago in Wyoming we had heard of a buck antelope with his jaw shot off. Was on a school section as I recall. Since we were done hunting we called the game warden if we could look for it. He said ok and suggested we put it down and take it to the ranch house if we did. We found the buck but the horns had been removed and the meat wasn't salvageable.

 

[antelopedundee]

Not an etics issue, but some years back I was watching a processor skin out a nice buck deer. The animal had apparently been shot some time earlier and one side of the rib cage was infected and festered badly. The processor remarked that the hunter didn't have to accept the animal and a GW could condemn it and give the hunter another tag.

Anyone heard of this?

 

[antelopedundee]

Has anyone EVER been pro-active and asked a neighboring landowner before hunting about access if a critter dies on their property?

 

[Carlin59]

Has anyone EVER been pro-active and asked a neighboring landowner before hunting about access if a critter dies on their property?

Growing up in the Midwest, yes, this was common, and we had discussions and understandings in place with all of our neighboring landowners covering this situation. In the West? It would be very difficult if not impossible for many guys. When you are hunting multiple states, multiple units within each state, and multiple areas within a unit, you could have literally 100s and 100s of neighboring land owners related to your fall hunting plans. Add to that the fact that a lot of land is held by various corporations that are hard to track down and find a "real" person to talk to, and I think that is why most guys hunting a variety of critters in the West wait until after the situation arises to contact the applicable landowner.

 

[sweetnectar]

Besides all the belly aching over a possible situation, we have to remember it is a sport with rules that make it a pain in certain situations like the one being discussed. If it was just about killing then throw all the hunting rules out the window and just poison the water holes.

 

[antelopedundee]

Growing up in the Midwest, yes, this was common, and we had discussions and understandings in place with all of our neighboring landowners covering this situation. In the West? It would be very difficult if not impossible for many guys. When you are hunting multiple states, multiple units within each state, and multiple areas within a unit, you could have literally 100s and 100s of neighboring land owners related to your fall hunting plans. Add to that the fact that a lot of land is held by various corporations that are hard to track down and find a "real" person to talk to, and I think that is why most guys hunting a variety of critters in the West wait until after the situation arises to contact the applicable landowner.

Well it might be prudent if you always hunt the same land in the same area like some do.