Ukraine / Russia

[BigHornRam]

Gee, I thought you might post a video of Putin and Trump in Helsinki if you wanted to show some Putin ass kissing.

Here is some ass kissing for you.

Trump signals strikes against Syria, lays into Assad ally Russia

U.S. President Donald Trump warned Russia on Wednesday of imminent military action in Syria over a suspected poison gas attack, declaring that missiles "will be coming" and lambasting Moscow for standing by Syrian President Bashar al-Assad.

www.reuters.com

No manners, no diplomacy, just right to the point.

 

[VikingsGuy]

Just curious - when you read a post like that from a new member, do you guys immediately think someone from Russia sitting in a dark room full of computers just looking for a place to interject/ stir stuff up, or do you picture someone who enjoys hunting and was following the conversation as a lurker and was compelled to create an account so he could just into this particular conversation? Could go either way in my mind, it’s just interesting to think about as you read a thread like this one.

I wished it was a Russian bot - but my concern is that Russian bots influenced a real American that then resulted in a lost hunter. We need a Garmin InReach product to help conspiracy lost folks find their way back home.

 

[406dn]

So my argument is while one might argue that both were unjust wars, Russia invaded Ukraine unilaterally without warning, while the US debated invading Iraq for months in front of the world. Putin hasn't said why he invaded or what is goal is with the invasion.

Putin did claim there was genocide against Russian speakers in Ukraine. He also declared by executive action areas of eastern Ukraine to be independent states.

He pronounced he would enter to act as a peacekeeper if necessary. A former president called it genius and very savvy.

Trump calls Putin 'genius' and 'savvy' for Ukraine invasion

The former president's praise for Putin comes at a perilous geopolitical moment in Europe.

www.politico.com

 

[VikingsGuy]

The entire debate in summary:

But Orangeman…

Or Russian Hybrid War takes root . . .

(and while we are correcting your/you're - remember that the best kind of ellipsis are the ones with spaces . . . )

 

[Deleted member 28227]

Putin did claim there was genocide against Russian speakers in Ukraine. He also declared by executive action areas of eastern Ukraine to be independent states.

He pronounced he would enter to act as a peacekeeper if necessary. A former president called it genius and very savvy.

Trump calls Putin 'genius' and 'savvy' for Ukraine invasion

The former president's praise for Putin comes at a perilous geopolitical moment in Europe.

www.politico.com

The Russian embassy in China gave the Chinese governments documents correct, but that's it?

No Russian ambassador has addressed the UN and Putin hasn't made a formal address? I may have missed that if did happen.

I was contrasting it with Bush as that was the comparison made by the original poster.

U.S. President Speech

President George W. Bush spoke to the United Nations General Assembly warning of a "grave and gathering danger" posed by Iraqi leader Sadam Hussein. He challenged the Security Council to enforce past and future resolutions on Iraq and detailed several Iraqi violations since the Gulf War. Making...

www.c-span.org

 

[VikingsGuy]

There is a website called allsides.com that is great for getting students to see the spectrum of positions. My son was in charge of their social media streams for a few years as an intern. They also have evaluations of most common news sources and where they are across the political spectrum.

As for argumentative writing, I am assuming you are tackling issues where there is not scientific truth, but rather a spectrum of policy choice. And making one’s argument in the gray is the exact skill they are trying to develop. They don’t need to find “truth”, they need to credibly and clearly articulate a point of view with support. In fact, I hope you make them write both sides of an issue in separate papers (like debaters and moot court students need to). The worst part of our current state is not that there is to much gray and too little alignment on sources, it is that too many people start the discussion with, “I don’t know how anyone could think that”. That is just the sign of narrow thinking and a lack of empathy. Good luck with your class. It sounds like a great thing to be teaching our kids today.

I will add - I think the "ladder of inference" is an approachable tool to make people think through their views and why the views of others may be different. It points out that in most cases the communicated information is not hard facts - facts are only very early first step in our opinions.

MindTools | Home

Essential skills for an excellent career

www.mindtools.com

 

[BigHornRam]

Putin did claim there was genocide against Russian speakers in Ukraine. He also declared by executive action areas of eastern Ukraine to be independent states.

He pronounced he would enter to act as a peacekeeper if necessary. A former president called it genius and very savvy.

Trump calls Putin 'genius' and 'savvy' for Ukraine invasion

The former president's praise for Putin comes at a perilous geopolitical moment in Europe.

www.politico.com

Sarcasm. Ever hear of it? He's a bull in a China shop, often to his own detriment.
Trump did point out that he thought Putin was not right in the head at the end of the article, though.

 

[406dn]

Sarcasm. Ever here of it? He's a bull in a China shop, often to his own detriment.
Trump did point out that he thought Putin was not right in the head at the end of the article, though.

You have to be pretty gullible to think that was sarcasm. Trump's stock in trade is lying. It comes pretty easily to him.

 

[longbow51]

Trump did point out that he thought Putin was not right in the head at the end of the article, though.

Not fair reading the whole thing, or, as VG pointed out, looking at another source. Your supposed to pick soundbytes . . .

In all seriousness, Putin is somewhat savvy. Savvy doesn't mean correct. Genesis 3:1 "Now the serpent was more cunning than any beast of the field which the LORD GOD had made."

So is Xi. Completely wrong, but not dumb. Dangerous to underestimate your foes.

 

[Beignet]

Or Russian Hybrid War takes root .

This is real. They’re simply not a true peer competitor (in a conventional warfare sense) to the US or NATO. But they have done a damn good job of weakening western institutions without firing a shot.

Call me crazy, but the US political body spending more time bickering about zero-consequence cultural-war BS at the cost of achieving consensus on broader global geopolitical issues plays right into their hands.

Anyone who on the fence about the future US role in global affairs needs to realize that we have two near-peer competitors in the world, China & Russia (though one could argue that the prior has become an actual peer competitor). Would you prefer to have one of those two usurp the US as the global hegemon? Sure, we’re far from perfect here, but I believe we’ve still got the best thing going.

Sincerely,
Your resident kinda sorta neorealist

Simple Primer on Russian Hybrid Warfare

 

[noharleyyet]

Or Russian Hybrid War takes root . . .

(and while we are correcting your/you're - remember that the best kind of ellipsis are the ones with spaces . . . )

Perhaps I should quote myself with a correction . . .

 

[BackofBeyond]

Not fair reading the whole thing, or, as VG pointed out, looking at another source. Your supposed to pick soundbytes . . .

In all seriousness, Putin is somewhat savvy. Savvy doesn't mean correct. Genesis 3:1 "Now the serpent was more cunning than any beast of the field which the LORD GOD had made."

So is Xi. Completely wrong, but not dumb. Dangerous to underestimate your foes.

I don’t think anybody has argued the level of Putin’s intelligence. What most have argued is the glorification of that intelligence.

No one gains that amount of power, and holds on to it for that length of time by being stupid - but at the same time we shouldn’t be praising him or calling him a “genius” either.

 

[BigHornRam]

You have to be pretty gullible to think that was sarcasm. Trump's stock in trade is lying. It comes pretty easily to him.

TDS is a powerful affliction.

 

[VikingsGuy]

Not fair reading the whole thing, or, as VG pointed out, looking at another source. Your supposed to pick soundbytes . . .

In all seriousness, Putin is somewhat savvy. Savvy doesn't mean correct. Genesis 3:1 "Now the serpent was more cunning than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made."

So is Xi. Completely wrong, but not dumb. Dangerous to underestimate your foes.

No doubt, both have navigated the Game of Thrones of their respective countries and true morons rarely do that. My biggest objection to the "genius" and "clever" label given to them when they behave badly is that it implies some level of respect and support for their approach - it does not seem to be a sincere remark about their IQs, but rather an approval of their tactics and a suggestion we need more of this.

 

[Ben Lamb]

Yins guys need to go do some vodka shots, have a nice sauna & go get frisky with your significant others.

 

[406dn]

TDS is a powerful affliction.

Oh you must be able to do better than that.

 

[longbow51]

No doubt, both have navigated the Game of Thrones of their respective countries and true morons rarely do that. My biggest objection to the "genius" and "clever" label given to them when they behave badly is that it implies some level of respect and support for their approach - it does not seem to be a sincere remark about their IQs, but rather an approval of their tactics and a suggestion we need more of this.

You may have inferred that, which is different from him implying it.

 

[VikingsGuy]

@BigHornRam - given all your concern yesterday, just thought I would set your heart at ease and let you know I slept very well last night and feel quite refreshed. Thanks for caring.

 

[VikingsGuy]

You may have inferred that, which is different from him implying it.

Whoops, I misread at first. My on-point response.

It is a fair inference that he implied that.

 

[Beignet]

Yins guys need to go do some vodka shots, have a nice sauna & go get frisky with your significant others.

I’m gonna be in NY next month and am looking forward to a schvitz at the banya while pounding back some Baltikas and pelmeni. War or no war.

My regular banya in mostly Uzbek bros, so it’s kinda neutral anyway.