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Deleted member 28227
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Ukraine / Russia
Wanting to do something and being capable is two different things.
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Sorry for the confusion, this post.
Ukraine / Russia
- Thread starter Cheesehead
- Start date
www.hunttalk.com
Sorry for the confusion, this post.
Cheesehead
Well-known member
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- Dec 6, 2017
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- 1,046
One of the things that has been super interesting to me is this
The hard core conservatives on this forum (and elsewhere) aren’t pro democracy nor pro American. They are pro-autocracy
It’s been super confusing to me why republicans (teardown this wall!) seemingly are constantly and without clear rational excuse pro-USSR all of a sudden. Conservative Americans love Hungary
The hard core conservatives on this forum (and elsewhere) aren’t pro democracy nor pro American. They are pro-autocracy
It’s been super confusing to me why republicans (teardown this wall!) seemingly are constantly and without clear rational excuse pro-USSR all of a sudden. Conservative Americans love Hungary
Irrelevant
Well-known member
The mythical fiscal conservative is a fickle beast.
To be fair, some people simply think that any money spent by the US not on US soil is a waste. There are no exceptions. I tend to believe that additional debt on our part doesn't appear to be a big deal. I also don't really understand why that is, but I'm not an expert at macro-economics, but I trust the powers that be more than I trust random peeps on Al Gore's internet.
Back to actual Ukraine coverage...
The EU has begun debating how to fund the reconstruction of Ukraine
Where will it find the money required and how will it prevent it being wasted?
VikingsGuy
Well-known member
So, Putin will ultimately get another hobbled poor angry neighbor (Ukraine) and he pushed industrialized Finland and Sweden into the arms of NATO after many decades of neutrality (and at times NATO hostility) all while making Russia a Chinese vassel state - well played Mr Putin. He better watch out or his beloved Stalin or Peter the Great may rise from their graves and kick him in the nuts.
www.wsj.com
Turkey Backs NATO Membership for Sweden, Finland
The agreement announced for a Madrid summit ends a dispute that had slowed an expansion of the alliance.
www.wsj.com
SAJ-99
Well-known member
But the money is essentially spent on US soil, isn’t it? I mean, we are essentially sending them out weapons. It seems ok if we build these weapons and allow our military to practice using them on a non-functioning targets, but they are not ok with sending them to Ukraine to be used on live-target Russian equipment. I view it as a great opportunity to learn how the stuff works in practice.The mythical fiscal conservative is a fickle beast.
To be fair, some people simply think that any money spent by the US not on US soil is a waste. There are no exceptions. I tend to believe that additional debt on our part doesn't appear to be a big deal. I also don't really understand why that is, but I'm not an expert at macro-economics, but I trust the powers that be more than I trust random peeps on Al Gore's internet.
Back to actual Ukraine coverage...
The EU has begun debating how to fund the reconstruction of Ukraine
Where will it find the money required and how will it prevent it being wasted?www.economist.com
KB_
Well-known member
I've been hearing some things about troops mobilizing in neighboring countries. If I had to guess i'm think a D-day like invasion is coming. Which if and when that happens there is your 3rd world war and its only a matter of time before boots are on the ground from our country.
I dont particularly foresee a draft coming as we have a large volunteer force and war tactics are much different now then the last world war. I just dont see how this doesn't happen soon, maybe the next couple of years. I dont think Putin falls back if he fully takes Ukraine, he will continue to move forward imo.
When you say endgame.... I dont think that endgame is clear to anybody. He is looking to take as much as he can.
This is very reminiscent of what was happening to the French in both world wars prior, they suffered for awhile before other countries showed up. and only when they were provoked. I think something bad is gonna happen to some us territory then we will have boots on the ground.
This is getting worse before it gets better i believe.
VikingsGuy
Well-known member
Lots of different downsides for Putin when US and NATO send arms to Ukraine - here is another:
Russia’s War in Ukraine Drives a Quantum Leap in NATO Weaponry
The conflict in Ukraine is honing the alliance’s ability to face off against Russia and adding to the list of unintended consequences from Moscow’s invasion of its smaller neighbor.
www.wsj.com
Yeah, you're right. My mistake
L
longbow51
Guest
Once again, assuming those who don't want another war (after a 3-month pause) following 20+ years of American blood spilt essentially for nothing in the mid-East are pro-autocracy is assigning motives you know little about.
Maybe we're just tired of our kids fighting wars. Or, maybe some would rather see the focus on American problems; we have a few. And don't underestimate Biden's ability to stumble into a real war. Remember Obama's cautionary words. And there are Rs and Ds in power who want nothing more than another war, so I don't see this as a conservative or liberal issue.
How many deployments have your children done in the past 20 years? How many of their friends lost limbs/lives? Afghanistan is basically the same except has a new army supplied courtesy of the U.S. taxpayer.
L
longbow51
Guest
Whatever you may think of Trump, he got us out of wars. Bush/Bush/Biden urging us on. I'll check out again, as I'm obv an anti-war minority. Change the country...
Cheesehead
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I hear you on the anti-war front. Grace and peace
SAJ-99
Well-known member
I agree, but getting us out didn’t fix the problems. That is why we were there for 20+ yrs. Running away from problems is easy. Fixing problems is hard. Most Americans don’t like the hard stuff.
Nick87
Well-known member
Fify. Nobody wins in that situation.
I'm curious of the resolve Putin / Russia bears to win this war... After all, they remained in Afghanistan for a heck of a long time.
U.S., Saudi, U.K., Pakistan, etc managed leveraging Russia's opposition in that theater, as well. However, I wonder if Ukrainians hold the same war torn, internal fortitude as Afghanis.
Are Ukrainians willing to pay the same price?
U.S., Saudi, U.K., Pakistan, etc managed leveraging Russia's opposition in that theater, as well. However, I wonder if Ukrainians hold the same war torn, internal fortitude as Afghanis.
Are Ukrainians willing to pay the same price?
VikingsGuy
Well-known member
I tend to agree that most people don’t like “hard stuff”. But I think most people identify the “tough” and “hopeless” causes at the outset and avoid them from day one. Americans seem to uniquely rush into these situations colored with an initial belief that our origin story/narrative (defenders of liberty for all) will be embraced by others and carry the day if we just get the ball rolling - only to quit once it falls apart.
What got “fixed” by us being there 20 years? I’ll answer that, nothing!
SAJ-99
Well-known member
I agree. See @VikingsGuy post. There was initially a clear set of military goals but then it turned into a project that had a low chance of success, changing directives, and the for which the military was not trained to do. Ukraine is different. But also there is value in the US maintaining a presence across the globe, so there is risk in leaving and creating a void of power. Consequences that probably won’t be seen for years.
Straight Arrow
Well-known member
This seemingly endless thread is replete with many varied viewpoints. Some appear based on common sense perspectives of news reports, others based on political, ideological, or personal bent ... however, none with high level Pentagon based experience, expertise or real knowledge and insight regarding global national interest strategy.
It does seem to be a venue for those who enjoy the analysis and the opportunity to vent political, ideological, or just personal perspectives.
It does seem to be a venue for those who enjoy the analysis and the opportunity to vent political, ideological, or just personal perspectives.
I believe this is a summary for most threads on Hunt Talk.
We are people that place our public opinion for conservation matters in whatever State we reside and those we seek to support as non residents, as well as the federal level for voting and govt sought opinions / comments. Typically based on your summary and those we, "follow" that we opine (within our anonymity) holds valued experience. Same as politics, etc.
Nature of America. We, the people vote, as best our arm chair QB roles allow us.
Agree with your summary.
noharleyyet
Well-known member
Spot on, thank you...
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