This just in...Feds/wolves/courts

[geewhiz]

Who is spending money?

I saw wolf tracks yesterday

The Foundation for Wildlife Management – Ensuring ungulate populations recover in areas negatively impacted by wolves

With 2400+ wolves removed, F4WM has saved an estimated 336,000+ elk, moose, deer, and livestock, by promoting science-based predator management. (2400 wolves each consume 20 big game per year for 7 years- 7x20=140 x 2200 = 336,000 saved!) Season Stat Counter Season to Date (7/1/24 - 6/30/25)...

f4wm.org

 

[OriginalOscar]

Sucks for Great Lakes States & CO, but I ain't surprised. This is what happens when you let Don Peay tell you what to do.

Don Peay reference? Enlighten.

 

[brymoore]

The Foundation for Wildlife Management – Ensuring ungulate populations recover in areas negatively impacted by wolves

With 2400+ wolves removed, F4WM has saved an estimated 336,000+ elk, moose, deer, and livestock, by promoting science-based predator management. (2400 wolves each consume 20 big game per year for 7 years- 7x20=140 x 2200 = 336,000 saved!) Season Stat Counter Season to Date (7/1/24 - 6/30/25)...

f4wm.org

Expense reimbursement if you are successful in killing a wolf.

 

[BrentD]

3 S’s boys.

Another poacher.

 

[Stocker]

Another poacher.

Yeah, let the wolves into animals we have cornered for them. Elk once roamed the plains when wolves were prevalent, now they are getting squeezed even in the mountains. I’m for letting wolves roam when the bison and elk roam the plains in numbers they did before.

Never poached anything in my life.

 

[Rhcuam]

Whoa whoa whoa

They go on and never come off.
The esa is nothing more than a political tool. It could of been something great, the blueprint on how to recover and manage a species. They just forgot the manage part.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

They go on and never come off.
The esa is nothing more than a political tool. It could of been something great, the blueprint on how to recover and manage a species. They just forgot the manage part.

Been a while since I did a deep dive but last time I checked 39 species have been recovered.

In terms of species that were listed, protected, then went extinct anyway, I think 4, with maybe 20 that a haven’t been seen for a long time.

Then there are a ton of species who basically are going to be listed forever because they just have super limited habitat with no chance of expansion, the ESA is protecting there only remaining small range.

So yeah sure on wolves (add grizzlies) but I think your dead wrong the ESA as a whole.

 

[BrentD]

They go on and never come off.
The esa is nothing more than a political tool. It could of been something great, the blueprint on how to recover and manage a species. They just forgot the manage part.

Not true. Just simply not. Ever participated in managing for an ESA species? I have a couple of times. Basically, you are just flat wrong. But management is not easy with ESA species because of the political handcuffs, people on forums and their politicians put on them. Yet it is done.

And, as usual, wllm1313 knows of what he speaks. He is right.

 

[Rhcuam]

I am right. The ESA in reference to Bears and wolves has been a dumpster fire caused by a train wreck. Political football. What good has come from the esa is outweighed by the miss management and corrupt actions regarding those two species.

 

[BrentD]

I am right. The ESA in reference to Bears and wolves has been a dumpster fire caused by a train wreck. Political football. What good has come from the esa is outweighed by the miss management and corrupt actions regarding those two species.

Wrong.

 

[brocksw]

Wrong.

@wllm1313 you may be able to answer this too. You'll have to excuse me, as there aren't any wolves in ND aside from the occasional stray from MN, so I'm not as familiar with all aspects of this. But my impression is that the usfw set up a plan for esa recovery for both wolves and griz. In those plansthey specified recovery goals in terms of ecosystem level population recovery. Those goals were very specific in what numbers the populations needed to reach. Once those populations reached those specified numbers, they were to be removed from esa protection and handed back to the state to continue management. It's also my impression that both wolves and griz have reached said population recovery requirements. There's a publication out there from the usfw where they acknowledge recovery goals have been met in both cases, as dictated by their recovery plans.

So, what is the justification or reasoning for wanting to keep them under esa protection? I feel as if I'm missing something in these conversations.

 

[BackofBeyond]

I am right. The ESA in reference to Bears and wolves has been a dumpster fire caused by a train wreck. Political football. What good has come from the esa is outweighed by the miss management and corrupt actions regarding those two species.

So what’s your fix, other than kicking back and arm chair quarter backing it?

We all know there’s a problem, but nobody ever moves past that. It’s always some one else’s fault. It’s the f*cking guberment or it’s the knuckle dragging mouth breathers… blah blah blah.

 

[lastlight]

I love what the ESA is suppose to represent. But at this point I’d just about vote to abolish it given the chance and let local DFGs manage everything. Obviously it’s a lot more complicated than that, but there are ways. What we have now, like said above, is a pathetic political football game with our wildlife. At least for the larger fauna in our country.

But by all means, if you guys have some good idea that will work to make all the HSUS and Center for Biological diversity folks disappear along with their insanely deep pockets and bought and paid for politicians I’d be all ears. I know this can happen on both sides.

 

[Hydrophilic]

I am right. The ESA in reference to Bears and wolves has been a dumpster fire caused by a train wreck. Political football. What good has come from the esa is outweighed by the miss management and corrupt actions regarding those two species.

That really depends on who you ask and what your perspective is. As a conservationist who hunts I’m thankful for the ESA and to have wolves back in Oregon. I’m thankful it provides potential to weave California condors back into my life. I’m thankful for the rare plants it preserves, some are even delisted.

Successful habitat rehabilitation to remove golden paintbrush from endangered species label

The plant's rehabilitation has benefited other Willamette Valley species such as Fender's blue butterfly and Taylor’s checkerspot butterfly.

amp.registerguard.com

Oregon coast coho were ESA listed and have been a relative success story so far. There are a couple environmental non profits who have a goal of delisting them, and the feds have the same idea.

Massive new recovery plan for coho

The federal government finalized a massive recovery plan Wednesday with an ambitious goal: get Oregon Coast coho salmon off the threatened species list in a mere 10 years.

www.dailyastorian.com

Realistically, what better options are there? To conserve in our society is to self regulate. Americans have a hard time doing that. A good place to start would be having 2 political parties with an environmental and conservation platform, then there would be competition and possibly less extremism.

 

[WapitiBob]

So, what is the justification or reasoning for wanting to keep them under esa protection? I feel as if I'm missing something in these conversations.

In his 26-page ruling, U.S. District Judge Jeffrey White wrote: “...the Service’s analysis relied on two core wolf populations to delist wolves nationally and failed to provide a reasonable interpretation of the ‘significant portion of its range’ standard.” He therefore set aside the delisting rule and restored wolf protections in the Great Lakes region, West Coast states and southern Rocky Mountains.

 

[appaloosa]

I would get rid of the Equal Access to Justice Act before I got rid of the ESA.

 

[shoots-straight]

3 S’s boys.

ANNNNNNNNNNNNNND that's why we're here. Wish there was a better understanding by our brothers.

 

[44hunter45]

Sucks for Great Lakes States & CO, but I ain't surprised. This is what happens when you let Don Peay tell you what to do.

Has Idaho ever had listening to Utah work out good in the end?

 

[MO Betta]

I would get rid of the Equal Access to Justice Act before I got rid of the ESA.

I'd add the WH&BA to that as well.

 

[dgc1963]

Who is spending money?

I saw wolf tracks yesterday

The FnG is paying up to $2500 in some areas and $1000 to 500 in others depending one the areas population and I was told they increases the budget for this yr