Tax welfare

[midwesthunter]

Might not be the correct term, but that's what I call it. With all the talk about budget cuts and additional funding needed for so many things. It made me wonder how much taxpayer money is given away to people with kids in a certain tax bracket? I am not sure what the cut off amount is for annual taxable income. But every year around this time I start to hear people talk about getting 8K-12K back in taxes. I have a good idea how much they make and know they aren't paying that much in. Most dont even pay in because they know they will get it all back and more. Last year I knew a person that paid under $700 into federal taxes and received over $9K back.

I would really like to know how much is given out annually. It has to be a huge chunk of money.

 

[CiK]

Can we instead talk about how much the government steals from us?

 

[Deleted member 28227]

 

[Gr8bawana]

Most dont even pay in because they know they will get it all back and more. Last year I knew a person that paid under $700 into federal taxes and received over $9K back.

If you're talking about income tax refunds that is not even possible.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

If you're talking about income tax refunds that is not even possible.
View attachment 128579

Earned income tax credit - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[Schaaf]

Seems relevant to a DIY hunter. Looking forward to seeing how I do on my applications this year.

 

[Irrelevant]

Paying people to have kids and own houses sure seems like gov't overreach to me. But sure as a morning constitutional it seems to have bipartisan support.

 

[rwc101]

 

[Doublecluck]

Don’t know, god I hate people with kids! I do like when I enter the 5 living under my roof and 1 in college on my taxes and the amount on the check I write to the fed goes from 15-20k down to 5500 or so.. kids can be a pain in the arse but who wants to pay the man anyhow? When they all grow up and move out I might as well quit working, what’s the point if I gotta give it all away anyhow.. anyhow hopefully the part I pay goes to someone in need.. or roads, or dropping bombs on terrorists or some chit... lol..

Oh ya and funding some public land agency of course..

Seems like a easy problem to fix, you shouldn’t be able to get back more than you pay in.

 

[smarandr]

If you want to complain about tax welfare, corporate America paid almost $135b less in income taxes in 2018 after the TCJA. https://www.taxpolicycenter.org/taxvox/did-tax-cuts-and-jobs-act-pay-itself-2018

 

[VikingsGuy]

Might not be the correct term, but that's what I call it. With all the talk about budget cuts and additional funding needed for so many things. It made me wonder how much taxpayer money is given away to people with kids in a certain tax bracket? I am not sure what the cut off amount is for annual taxable income. But every year around this time I start to hear people talk about getting 8K-12K back in taxes. I have a good idea how much they make and know they aren't paying that much in. Most dont even pay in because they know they will get it all back and more. Last year I knew a person that paid under $700 into federal taxes and received over $9K back.

I would really like to know how much is given out annually. It has to be a huge chunk of money.

Not sure about the $9k number, but with 3 kids the earned income tax credit could be worth up to $6,500 last year. It's actually a reasonable program that better ties work to benefits than many welfare programs.

 

[midwesthunter]

Not sure about the $9k number, but with 3 kids the earned income tax credit could be worth up to $6,500 last year. It's actually a reasonable program that better ties work to benefits than many welfare programs.

I know the "welfare" system isnt perfect, it quite the opposite, especially when it comes to low income individuals. The system is designed to keep them in poverty. Perfect example IMO. A coworker of my GF is a CNA at a nursing home. Single with 3 kids, dad is in jail so no child support. She works full time, she gets almost $400 in food assistance from the state. She also gets $23 per kid per day to pay for daycare, this goes directly to the daycare. She had to turn down a small promotion that was going to come with a $2 an hour raise. So $4,160 in additional income she would have lost $17,940 in child care benefits.

But to my tax question/rant. I asked the person what credits/deductions they used. They said the earned income credit. Which was $6,560 last year. They could claim child tax credit, which would be $1400 per child you could receive depending on what you owed. Then a child care tax deduction. This deduction goes towards anything you may owe but you cant receive a refund from this.

 

[VikingsGuy]

I would really like to know how much is given out annually. It has to be a huge chunk of money.

$69 billion in 2016 was the best number I could find.

 

[COEngineer]

I don't know if there is a name/term for it, but there is broad acceptance of the idea that growth is good and to have economic growth, you have to have more people. So, the government subsidizes having children so that the economy grows and we all just keep getting richer. According to this approach, if the birth rate goes down then you have to supplement the working age population with immigrants.

Personally, I think this whole theory needs to get thrown out the window. It's biggest assumption is that resources are infinite and growth can be sustained forever. I think we would be better off finding ways to increase efficiencies (so we don't need more people in their working years than in their retirement years) and just be content with the economy we have (find a way to measure "success" other than GDP growth).

 

[Ben Lamb]

I don't know if there is a name/term for it, but there is broad acceptance of the idea that growth is good and to have economic growth, you have to have more people. So, the government subsidizes having children so that the economy grows and we all just keep getting richer. According to this approach, if the birth rate goes down then you have to supplement the working age population with immigrants.

Personally, I think this whole theory needs to get thrown out the window. It's biggest assumption is that resources are infinite and growth can be sustained forever. I think we would be better off finding ways to increase efficiencies (so we don't need more people in their working years than in their retirement years) and just be content with the economy we have (find a way to measure "success" other than GDP growth).

Absolutely agree that we have a country that subsidizes the indentured servitude of citizens through welfare. But we also need a system where the work you do pays enough to live where you do. People work 3 jobs & still can't get by. Housing costs are out of hand in most towns & cities. Food costs create insecurity & obesity because we've subsidized corn to the point that it's cheaper to by doritos than fresh fruit & veg.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

@COEngineer Nicolae Ceaușescu Decree 770

 

[VikingsGuy]

just be content with the economy we have (find a way to measure "success" other than GDP growth).

And this is why you are known as COEngineer and not COEconomist

 

[COEngineer]

Absolutely agree that we have a country that subsidizes the indentured servitude of citizens through welfare. But we also need a system where the work you do pays enough to live where you do. People work 3 jobs & still can't get by. Housing costs are out of hand in most towns & cities. Food costs create insecurity & obesity because we've subsidized corn to the point that it's cheaper to by doritos than fresh fruit & veg.

I like the thought of someone agreeing with me...but I think you took a running start from my post and went straight off a cliff. I disagree with almost everything you wrote after "...we have a country." But especially, I disagree with "we also need a system where the work you do pays enough to live where you do." I think one of the things our country has done right (common language, laws, etc across the country) is made it extremely easy to physically move anywhere there is better opportunity. I think that people that stay where they are (and complain about their situation) are just afraid of change. Do we not celebrate our ancestors that had the fortitude to leave their homelands in search of better lives for themselves and their descendants?

 

[Trial153]

We have the largest corporate government partnership in the history of the world and all our welfare stems from that fact.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

I like the thought of someone agreeing with me...but I think you took a running start from my post and went straight off a cliff. I disagree with almost everything you wrote after "...we have a country." But especially, I disagree with "we also need a system where the work you do pays enough to live where you do." I think one of the things our country has done right (common language, laws, etc across the country) is made it extremely easy to physically move anywhere there is better opportunity. I think that people that stay where they are (and complain about their situation) are just afraid of change. Do we not celebrate our ancestors that had the fortitude to leave their homelands in search of better lives for themselves and their descendants?