Snow and feed or bait ?

[Tom]

Say I'm a resident of your state and have some cattle on my land. So, I put a huge round bale of alfalfa out for them to eat off of. Say it snows and there is like a bunch of snow on the ground covering the grass, etc. but not the huge round bale of alfalfa. Now, suppose every deer and elk in the area comes to eat off of that bale.

A) Is it baiting?
B) Is it legal to hunt there around the bale?
C) Is it fair chase to hunt there?
D) Would you do it?

 

[JoseCuervo]

Tom, we call them haystacks in this part of the country....


A. No, it is not baiting, it is called feeding the cows...
B. Yes, it is legal to hunt if there is no law against it.
C. Who defines "fair chase"? A Texan or a real hunter?
D. Do what?

 

[Tom]

...
C. Who defines "fair chase"? A Texan or a real hunter?
D. Do what?

C. You define it however you want.
D. Would you hunt there?

 

[JoseCuervo]

Not to be obstinate, but what are you defining?

Sitting on the bale and shooting?

Sitting 200 yards away and shooting?

Sitting 1/2 mile away and shooting them as they travel back and forth from Forest Service land to the farmer's field?

Sitting 20 miles away and shooting them as they migrate down from the Summer Range to the Winter Range on the farmer's field?

 

[Tom]

I wouldn't sit on the haystack, as you call it, I would do the other 3, how about you? You're defining what you would do and not do, its up to you to specify and amplify.
I wouldn't just shoot to shoot, but hunt, yes, I'd do that around that bale of alfalfa.

 

[MattK]

Tom- I know quite a few people who have shot deer, elk, moose and even antelope near haystacks (for antelope I believe it was more of a promitory point than eating). I'm not sure how "fair chase" it is but the people who did it were looking at the venison, not the prospect of hunting.

 

[JoseCuervo]

I wouldn't sit on the haystack, as you call it, I would do the other 3, how about you? You're defining what you would do and not do, its up to you to specify and amplify.
I wouldn't just shoot to shoot, but hunt, yes, I'd do that around that bale of alfalfa.

tom,

If you are sitting somewhere waiting for an animal to come in and eat, are you "hunting" or "shooting"?

How do you consider sitting on your butt watching a hay bale or a corn flinger to be hunting??? That is just called sitting with a gun....

 

[Tom]

Waiting for them to come eat at an accorn tree, or come drink at a pond, or where a trail crosses a creek, would you do those? It sounds like you don't like sitting at a hay stack, so when does it become hunting for you, when you walk around with a gun?

Sitting with a gun is similar to walking with a gun, with the main difference that in sitting with a gun, you chase the animals around a lot less.

 

[TLC]

Jose, have a feeling you haven't done much hunting in the midwest. part of the hunt here is finding the bedding areas, the current food sources, the watering spots, etc. when you find those, thats where you set up your stands. you also look for funnels, travel routes, and stuff like that. talking strictly deer here. one of the best spots to find a deer is on the edge of a field, picked, and sit where they are either coming in to or out of that field.

 

[JoseCuervo]

Waiting for them to come eat at an accorn tree, or come drink at a pond, or where a trail crosses a creek, would you do those? It sounds like you don't like sitting at a hay stack, so when does it become hunting for you, when you walk around with a gun?

Sitting with a gun is similar to walking with a gun, with the main difference that in sitting with a gun, you chase the animals around a lot less.

Tom,

Let me see if i get this straight..... In Texas, "sitting" is similar to "walking"?

And chasing seems to be bad for hunting?

What do you look for then, "Fair Sit" hunting ethics???

 

[Calif. Hunter]

What do you look for then, "Fair Sit" hunting ethics???

Gotta admit - that's funny right there.

But, there are places where it is useless to chase the animals around and finding scrapes, etc is like trapping - it takes work and some amount of skill to know where to set up.

 

[Tom]

We look for animals to shoot, that's hunting. Fair walking or fair sitting whether in Idaho or in Texas has nothing to do with that, its mainly seeking to kill the animal, that makes it hunting. If you just walk or sit to look at the animals, they call that "wildlife viewing".

Are you going to say what makes it hunting for you? Do you have to walk, or could you just sit and be hunting? I think you said the hay stacks are not baiting, I got that part. Maybe sitting is hunting to you, you're onto the fair sit ethics. Is sitting at the hay stack fair sit or not?

 

[Tom]

Hey, I looked it up. Its fair chase for B&C, it might be the only accessible food around, but they call that fair chase, even if its actually baiting and not haystacks sticking above the snow to feed the cattle, etc.

"BAITING
Trophies taken with the aid of bait are eligible for entry in the Club’s Awards Programs and listing in the records books so long as the practice is legal in the state or province where the trophy was taken."

 

[JoseCuervo]

We look for animals to shoot, that's hunting.

No, that is "looking" and "shootiing" by your definition, not "hunting".

When you hunt for a table in a crowded bar, are you "walking", "looking", or "sitting" at the time?

If you just walk or sit to look at the animals, they call that "wildlife viewing".

No, that is called Elk hunting in Idaho....

I think you said the hay stacks are not baiting, I got that part. Maybe sitting is hunting to you, you're onto the fair sit ethics. Is sitting at the hay stack fair sit or not?

Tom, you gotta read slower.... Haystacks are called "feed for cattle". They are legal to put where ever the farmer wants them. I know of no laws that preclude the location of a haystack, and, I know no organization that recognises haystacks for inclusion in a Trophy Book.

Usually, when I was growing up, sitting at the haystack was done to avoid work..... A couple of times it was done with the company of a "dear", but rarely was the rack on the dear worthy of trophy status.....

 

[Tom]

... A couple of times it was done with the company of a "dear", but rarely was the rack on the dear worthy of trophy status.....

I think I beg to differ on that one, like they say, trophy is in the eye of the beholder.

 

[noharleyyet]

A couple of times it was done with the company of a "dear", but rarely was the rack on the dear worthy of trophy status.....

...guided or DIY? Oh I get it, the hay was bait.