SB 298 - Crossbow bill rears its ugly head

BuzzH said:
Hilarious...since my Dad started hunting in 1957 there have been changes. Instead of the standard 11 week season, there's now a Saturday opener over the traditional Sunday. We stacked a 2 day youth deer hunt too in between archery and rifle. Then in a stroke of brilliance, the archery hunters supported the week long muzzleloader season in December to keep that season out of October. Funny that the muzzleloader season happens after over the snow travel with machines is allowed behind locked gates, WMA's, etc.

So to summarize the only changes have been adding 10 days to an already 11 week long season, including opening areas to snow machines to polish off what's left of elk and deer that already endured the previous 11 weeks.

But, those damn crossbows, that's just a bridge too far, we'll just kill too much if we allow them.

WAFJ...
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So that's not entirely true.

So back in the 60's you could rifle hunt elk from Sept. 15 thru to Dec. 15. The definitive word in that sentence was "RIFLE".

There was only around 45,000 - 55,000 hunters then, but there was concern that the breeding of elk ws being interfered with and it was decided that this number of hunters was interfering with the elk rutting and breeding. We now have more archers out in the hills during the rut than back then.

Yes the weeks were about the same, but it was all rifle.
Lets add additional cross gunners and see what happens. Things are going to change anyway but lets just move the goal posts even more.

A line in the sand has to be drawn somewhere and this move to crossbows is the that line for me.

The people who fought to get our first archery seasons passed did so with the argument that there would be a lot of recreational value in it and easy on the resource.

With todays modern archery equipment the success rates have moved up exponentially every year, even though in small increments Add crossbows and you move that even more. To say there's no difference and the weight issue, bulky, blah blah blah is disingenuous to the facts that are out there. 8lb crossguns are in line with many rifles .

I'd submit that Elk rifle success rates have moved up too, maybe not huge but definitely an increase. We use to use open sights and lever 30-30's and now we use a 30-3000 ultra super duper long range thing a ma gig with range finder attached scope, that'll wipe your nose before the shot.

When do we draw all the lines in the sand to hold on to what we had? This will be for the younger crowd to decide eventually.

I've most likely had my best days in the hills, and certainly took them for granted.

On top of all of this is the fact that it's not needed for handicapped hunters to join in. As I stated earlier, I hunted with a guy who lost his whole right arm in a rock crusher and still pulled back a recurve bow. I witnessed him take 3 deer on a deer drive we put on. He took lot s of game this way.

my .02 cents worth
 
@BuzzH @JM77 We get it. Crossbows in MT archery seasons won't make that big of a difference.

But it will make some difference. And it's another bullshit political agenda.

Same guys bitching about crossbows here also bitched about MT blackpowder season, shoulder seasons, chasing bears with hounds, thousands of doe tags, pumped up limited quota licenses, etc,

We don't need a single extra thing to make hunting easier for the armies of pussies that buy cheap MT hunting licenses, not one. Can you guys at least agree on that?
 
Greenhorn said:
@BuzzH @JM77 We get it. Crossbows in MT archery seasons won't make that big of a difference.

But it will make some difference. And it's another bullshit political agenda.

Same guys bitching about crossbows here also bitched about MT blackpowder season, shoulder seasons, chasing bears with hounds, thousands of doe tags, pumped up limited quota licenses, etc,

We don't need a single extra thing to make hunting easier for the armies of pussies that buy cheap MT hunting licenses, not one. Can you guys at least agree on that?
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Certainly, but seems a funny place to draw the line in the sand and a strange hill to die on.

That sand in the line has been ignored over and over again like you said. This one is wayyyyyy more trivial than most of the others.

Nobody wanting to give up anything, ever, in Montana has consequences that nobody really cares about. If they did, none of the crap you mentioned would be reality.

Who do you think Molnar learned this from? Why would you expect him to not get his agenda when everyone else got theirs?
 
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Sending in opposition and making comments against it don't seem much like "dying on a hill" or making it higher priority than anything and everything else. Aside from not ever voting for Molnar, what should the reaction to his bill be?

On another note, what kind of crossbow should i buy? Are there semi-automatics?
 
For clarification, my line in the sand is just on this cross bow bill for now and just on the archery season. I've drawn a lot of lines all over the state that have been crossed earlier. Hard to get people to listen until they start losing opportunity. Then you get their attention.

Yes, in the Root Hunters have lost opportunity on open seasons many years ago. We have 3 limited entry mule deer units, 1 LE Elk unit, and 1 unit you have to apply for 1st choice only. 2 mule deer units that run 3 weeks instead of 5.

WE have increased opportunity on lions and bears.

Active sportsmen's groups can (at a min) do some good.

RW
 
Greenhorn said:
@BuzzH @JM77 We get it. Crossbows in MT archery seasons won't make that big of a difference.

But it will make some difference. And it's another bullshit political agenda.

Same guys bitching about crossbows here also bitched about MT blackpowder season, shoulder seasons, chasing bears with hounds, thousands of doe tags, pumped up limited quota licenses, etc,

We don't need a single extra thing to make hunting easier for the armies of pussies that buy cheap MT hunting licenses, not one. Can you guys at least agree on that?
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Man, this really isn't what we are talking about, now is it? What is going on here is a lot of archery guys don't want one extra hunter in the field to mess up their 6 week season. They put every high tech innovation on their compound, but the crossbow is a bridge too far. So be cool and they call them crossguns, say the herd will be decimated and complain about having to draw in the face of a 7x7 that is leaving the country anyway because he smelled your ass.

My wife is all of 110# soaking wet and she drew a slamming moose tag. She can't draw back the fifty# required by law and some of the best bull hunting is the first week of archery. Glad we are in Wyoming. We had a blast chasing moose and guess what? She didn't kill one until rifle season.

So lets complain about handicapped folks abusing the system. Truth is, as much as I don't want to admit it, my shoulders aren't what they used to be. If I want to rut hunt bulls, I need to hunt archery. Kurt, I have a Parker that's great out to 60 yards if you do everything right. I got it the year some big dude took me out at 1st base playing softball and blew my shoulder. I drew a premium LQ elk tag that year and wanted to rut hunt. You are welcome to borrow it and arrows w/broadheads, as long as your honest about whether or not it's enjoyable to hunt with a crossbow in the backcountry. If you like it, it's yours.
 
Montana issues more tags than there is wildlife to shoot. Until you have the solution to that you can keep your crossbows in your state because you are comparing apples to oranges. Could it be fixed with management? Absolutely. Many have tried and that’s not where we are at. PS let’s see those big mature whitetails you shot in Montana, it seems the wyoming boys have different standards of a decent whitetail.
 
DougStickney said:
Montana issues more tags than there is wildlife to shoot. Until you have the solution to that you can keep your crossbows in your state because you are comparing apples to oranges. Could it be fixed with management? Absolutely. Many have tried and that’s not where we are at. PS let’s see those big mature whitetails you shot in Montana, it seems the wyoming boys have different standards of a decent whitetail.
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He’s hunted Montana before it was what it is today. Bucks he killed are huge.

Montana has more opportunity than anybody needs, 100% at the expense of the animals. regardless of a hunter’s weight, size, strength, health, etc.

Jeff - had you followed all the bullshit free bonus points to all BS associated with this bill, you’d agree the sponsor needs nothing more than a giant kick in the balls.

Montana is not Wyoming, and we don’t need crossbows in archery. That said I’m sure hunting with one is fun - and your model probably has a way shorter range than my compound.
 
Greenhorn said:
He’s hunted Montana before it was what it is today. Bucks he killed are huge.

Montana has more opportunity than anybody needs, 100% at the expense of the animals. regardless of a hunter’s weight, size, strength, health, etc.

Jeff - had you followed all the bullshit free bonus points to all BS associated with this bill, you’d agree the sponsor needs nothing more than a giant kick in the balls.

Montana is not Wyoming, and we don’t need crossbows in archery. That said I’m sure hunting with one is fun - and your model probably has a way shorter range than my compound.
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I was trying to inject some humor and apparently failed. You guys do what you want in your state, but the reason you rely on the most is a little lame when the tag is two season. Or is it 3 season now?🤷‍♂️

As far as how fun they are, I would choose a compound any day of the week. Like I said, you like it and it's yours.
 
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