Public Land Etiquette Question

[belly-deep]

I had old, fat guys get upset at me on two different occasions this fall. Some people don't like younger, fitter hunters leaving the truck later than they did and then passing them on the trail.

 

[The Hedgehog]

I had old, fat guys get upset at me on two different occasions this fall. Some people don't like younger, fitter hunters leaving the truck later than they did and then passing them on the trail.

The young fit guys were likely not happy with me either. By mid November, my beer gut is no longer slowing me down. They would have felt weird jogging to get around me. Good times.

 

[belly-deep]

The young fit guys were likely not happy with me either. By mid November, my beer gut is no longer slowing me down. They would have felt weird jogging to get around me. Good times.

These guys were much older than you. I'm not sure if they would have survived getting an elk of the mountain, but I doubt they had to worry about that.

 

[alwayshunting]

Some of these hunting ethics issues are challenging. Even in this thread there are examples being posted that are very much in contradiction. I do think it is valuable to put yourself in the other hunters shoes and see their perspective. I used to be more along the lines of keeping to my self and trying to avoid any contact with other hunters. The last few years I try to make contact with others that are near me. I do take different approaches based on the situation. If I show up later to a TH or catch someone on the trail I will usually ask where they are heading and then try to avoid them. If they don't want to tell me that is fine too and I will continue to where I am going. If the situation is reversed and I am already heading in from a TH, I instead just tell them where I am going (without too much detail). Not that one hunter or the other has a right to a location, but I do approach it with some leniency to the hunter who was there first. Just how I have been approaching the situation.

 

[LuketheDog]

I had a dude try to race around me for a deer spot just a couple weeks ago. I was already headed home, and figured I'd put my boots back on and hike up a steep ridge for the evening so I could get above the wind and look down into a canyon I know the deer funnel through. Another guy driving by sees me putting on my boots at the side of the road, slows down, nods and waves, then swerves over 50yds down the road to hop the fence and actually run to get ahead as I started walking the trail. The spot he was racing me to was not where I was going though. Where he ended up was down in the bottom of the canyon, right in the wind, and from the ridge above him I was able to watch deer scent him as they came down the canyon and then go right back the other way. I enjoyed a nice sunset from the top and hiked down, gave the dude a wave on the road as I drove by...what a goober

 

[Wyo7]

I have two for everyone that I would like to here an opinion on. First off to the original poster, you did nothing wrong. I appreciate when people tell me where they're going so we aren't constantly bumping into each other and have actually found to coordinate with others helps my personal hunting more by giving me more solitude and sometimes I've had them bump deer or elk towards me. But as for my two ethical stories here they are.

First one I want to share happened this year. I was lucky or unlucky enough to draw my 3rd choice pronghorn tag in Wyoming. High draw rate but low public lands. Anyway on opening day I spotted a very nice buck with a herd of does and decided to put a stalk on him. I had been stalking them for a solid hour and I heard a gunshot about 6-700 yards to my right. I saw two guys then proceed to gut a smaller buck. Awesome, good for them. I made sure they saw me and then proceeded to stalk to the big buck. While closing down within 300 yards on the big buck I suddenly see movement off to my right side to see those two guys stop gutting their buck and trying to shoot the one big buck out from underneath me. They had zero cover and proceeded to spook the entire herd all while being about 500+ yards from the herd and not taking care of the animal they had already shot. I know for fact that they saw me and still tried to beat me to the buck which then ruined it for both of us. Should I be pissed about it? I'll admit I wasn't happy because he was probably the biggest buck I had seen in the unit over 4 months of scouting but just the way they acted was irritating.

The second story I was kind of frustrated just for someone lying to my face. Once again I was hunting a small state section for muleys. A buddy and myself stalked into a herd of bucks. My buddy had missed multiple bucks in the previous days so it was my shot. I picked a buck I wanted and shot. I hit him quartering away, a kill shot but one that he would need to be trailed. We found the blood trail and started to follow it when we heard another gunshot. After following the trail it was obvious the gunshot was on the buck I had hit. We walked up to the guy, said congrats, offered help, then I asked if he had 2 bullet wounds (the guy shot once). He looked me in the eye and said "nope, only one." He had hit the buck directly on the shoulder yet you could see in the gut pile and on the carcass that an obvious bullet had went through the deer quartering as well. Not to mention the blood trail led right to him. I didn't argue with the guy because he did make the "killing shot" which is fine. But what was frustrating is that someone would lie to another hunters face like that. Honestly my biggest concern was making sure there wasn't a wounded buck on the landscape. But when guys lie like that its frustrating.

So my question is, what are everyone's take on this? Would you have handled it differently? We just need more ethical hunters that have respect for the wildlife and for other hunters mentoring people out there.

 

[Backcountry Hunter 2]

I think you handled both situations just fine. The second scenario, I probably would have pointed out your shot and the blood trail. Just so he was aware of what happened. I definitely wouldn't have tried to take the buck from him. Confronting strangers when loaded weapons are handy is not my cup of tea.

 

[PrairieHunter]

Seems that we are talking about different things and lumping them all as "ethics".

Shooting from a road, trespassing, taking 4 wheelers illegally off trail, etc... are not only unethical but also illegal.

Then you have the mid range "ethics" stuff like shooting at animals other people are stalking and much closer to, shooting at ranges beyond skill level, shooting at running animals from long distances, etc..

Then you have what amounts to low level buthurt when someone feels like they have "dibs" on an area or don't like the way other hunters are parking at the same trail head, walking the same trail, walking past eachother, making noise, walking at prime time, bringing kids in the field, etc... which is what the OP is describing as well as what Mallard experienced in Nebraska and from country 2 residents from Wyoming.

It's the level 1 and level 2 stuff that is dangerous/annoying and could warrant a confrontation or call to LEO depending on the situation. Level 3 is to be expected if you hunt public land. People like that are better suited for private land so they can freely spew butthurt on anyone who gets in the way of their hunt and be in the right. Acting that way on public land is just childish no matter if it's an outfitter or individual who thinks they have dibs on an area or want to control how/where everyone else hunts that area.

But lumping all that together as "ethics" is wrong IMO.
It's not unethical to park at the trailhead next to someone, or walk down a trail past someone. Nor is it unethical to bring noisy kids in the field or walk at prime time.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

PrairieHunter you make a great point, unethical behavior versus uncouth behavior.

 

[antlerradar]

You could be in Eastern Montana where there are few roadless areas big enough to warrant a trail head. I have however seen road hunters jockeying for who gets to drive point on a two track.

 

[BuzzH]

I think there are a couple different things here.

As far as parking at a trailhead, there's usually ample country to get into and for people to spread out and do their thing. Its not a big deal, and I have no problem with parking there as a take-off point. No problem with others parking here either, its a trailhead.

That's a bit different when hunting small pieces of public land. If I pull up to a smaller piece of public from a couple hundred acres to maybe even a couple sections, and there's another car there...I'm finding another spot. I don't need an animal so bad that I have to put the screws to another hunter and ruin it for them. I'll come back later and check out another spot in the meantime.

I'm not one bit afraid to let other hunters know when they're being unethical, intrusive and rude assholes, even if it is "public land".

The place I hunt elk with a general tag, I've let 2 different groups know exactly what I thought. In both cases, I had guys on ATV's, park within 20-30 feet of my wall tent, get off their bikes, hike the trail that I cut out, and attempt to hunt.

That kind of crap isn't going to fly, and in both cases, I had no problem administering a right proper ass-chewing on the ethics of hunting right out my camp.

One group was from out-of-state and they quickly got the not so subtle "hint". The other group knew better, as we've had a long-standing gentleman's agreement on where we hunt the first few days as to stay out of each others way. They got the same ass-chewing as the NR's. A couple days later, their camp patriarch took the time to come to our camp, leave a very nice note and a plate of cookies to smooth things over. They knew better, just forgot their ethics for a day, it happens. We're back in good graces and I suspect that wont happen again.

It amazes me, some of the replies I'm reading, about the lack of trying to give people their space. Private or public, it doesn't hurt to use some common sense and be respectful of others.

The term "SPORTSMAN" doesn't seem to carry much weight to some...it does me. Show a lack of it around me, and you'll get a reminder. Which, considering how my family, and the guys I grew up hunting with would handle such behavior, is wayyy better than the "reminder" they would have gotten from those guys.

Carry on...

 

[beginnerhunter]

No offense, Buzzh, because I respect your opinions and I don't know your situation. But a little kindness and explanation can often be a better choice than an ass-chewing, especially with NRs who may not have much experience. Just MHO.

 

[COEngineer]

This thread can be summed up with one of Rinella's favorite quotes, paraphrased here, "There are two types of hunters. The guys in my party and the assholes."

The further I hike in, the fewer of both types I have to deal with.

 

[beginnerhunter]

This thread can be summed up with one of Rinella's favorite quotes, paraphrased here, "There are two types of hunters. The guys in my party and the assholes."

The further I hike in, the fewer of both types I have to deal with.

That's awesome.

 

[BuzzH]

No offense, Buzzh, because I respect your opinions and I don't know your situation. But a little kindness and explanation can often be a better choice than an ass-chewing, especially with NRs who may not have much experience. Just MHO.

NR or not, you flat don't park your machine 20 feet from the front door of my wall tent...you aren't getting an explanation...you're getting your ass chewed.

Who doesn't have the common sense to know better than to pull that crap?

I don't think an explanation would do those types a bit of good.

For the record, I'm very kind to NR, and R hunters when they don't act like a bunch of jackasses. Ran into a NR that posts on several boards, including hunttalk, while hunting mule deer this fall. We were both hunting the same spot and I left an area I'd seen a good buck in because he was there first. He ended up killing one of the bucks I had seen and I went over a few hours later to congratulate him on his deer. Super good guy.

I got the impression he wasn't the type of person to park his ATV 20 feet from my tent...

 

[MTGomer]

Some might think ‘you flat don’t have exclusive rights to a trail simply because you’re camped on it’.

 

[BuzzH]

Some might think ‘you flat don’t have exclusive rights to a trail simply because you’re camped on it’.

Not camped on the trail, and there isn't room for more than 1 camp...but we do hike out of camp everyday to hunt. They found the trail that my 75 year old buddy and I cut in there by following our tracks in the snow from our camp, after parking 20 feet from the front door. That's douche-baggery no matter how you slice it.

I really don't care that much as I can out-hunt and out-hike those DB's all day long...everyday. But, it is chickenshit for them to try to ace out a group of guys in their late 70's-early 80's that have been hunting there for nearly 50 years.

That, I cant abide...and they'll get their ass chewed.

Lots of other places for them to hunt...and now they do.

 

[hansontyrel]

I was listening to Randy's podcast today about hunting etiquette and I got to thinking about a recent trip I made to a large piece of National Forest land in WY. I arrived at a trail head before shooting time and saw a truck and camper parked there. Knowing the trail was about 3 miles long and that there was thousands of acres of land, I proceeded to get ready. As I was getting my pack on, the person from the camper quickly walked past my wife and I and headed down the trail. I was hoping to chat with him about his plan for the day but he never stopped. A few hundred yards down the trail I ran into him and asked what his plan was so that I could avoid him and not ruin his hunt. He got upset at this point and sort of claimed that he had "dibs" on the trail being he parked his camper there. After talking for awhile we went our separate ways down the trail but he was still unhappy.

My question is, was in the wrong for continuing down the trail? I can see the issue from both sides and was wondering what other people that hunt more in Western states thought. Let me also add that many of the other trail heads had rigs parked on them and that the day before I was back in the same area and ran into two other groups of hunters.

Your land just as much as his. Public lands in the Publics hands.

 

[mtmiller]

Your land just as much as his.

The question was about ethics.

 

[rtraverdavis]

This thread can be summed up with one of Rinella's favorite quotes, paraphrased here, "There are two types of hunters. The guys in my party and the assholes."

Rinella is quoting the author John Gierach when he says that. Just cuz, credit where credit’s due...