Peep sight or ghost ring?

[OntarioHunter]

I'm about to order a rail, quick detach rings, and quick detach rear iron sight so I can switch to iron sights in bad weather. New England Custom Gun makes the rear sight and I can choose between peep and ghost ring. The sight will be situated on the rail roughly where the rear Weaver base is now so fairly close to my eye (it's where the original military sight was located). I would have preferred a leaf sight but nothing I have found will work. I'll have to switch from Weaver bases to a rail or tap a new hole(s) in the receiver ahead of the loading/ejection port to reposition forward Weaver base. Right now the scope is wearing extended Weaver detachable rings. No one makes extended quick detachable rings so I'll need a rail to accommodate Warne rings and the short tube on my scope.

Which would be better, ghost ring or peep? I know squat about either.

 

[Dougfirtree]

I use a larger ghost ring on my 7600 because it's for close range work where I want quick target aquisition and I want to be able to follow a moving deer in heavy cover. I think if I were using it as backup in more open country, I'd probably want a smaller aperture.

 

[Don Fischer]

When I got my sako L61's years ago, the scope rings were machined into the reciever. And, the rifles came with a peep sight that slid on the base at the rear of the gun. Didn't care for the peep at all, just to hard to see through. Then I read to take out the insert on the peep and use it without that thing. Worked pretty well I though but I still never hunted with it. As I was to understand, you remove that insert and the eye still automatically pulls your eye to the highest concentration of light which is the center of the ring. Is that what you guys are calling a ghost ring?

 

[OntarioHunter]

When I got my sako L61's years ago, the scope rings were machined into the reciever. And, the rifles came with a peep sight that slid on the base at the rear of the gun. Didn't care for the peep at all, just to hard to see through. Then I read to take out the insert on the peep and use it without that thing. Worked pretty well I though but I still never hunted with it. As I was to understand, you remove that insert and the eye still automatically pulls your eye to the highest concentration of light which is the center of the ring. Is that what you guys are calling a ghost ring?

As I understand it a ghost ring is an isolated ring that lets light "around" it when looking through the hole. A peep sight is a hole through a housing that the shooter can't easily see around. The NECG peep and ghost ring sights both have same diameter aperture 0.93" but the peep has an extra optional aperture 0.125".
NECG ghost ring

NECG peep sight

To be honest, I'm not entirely sure about the advantage of one over the other, hence the thread.

 

[Dougfirtree]

As I understand it a ghost ring is an isolated ring that lets light "around" it when looking through the hole. A peep sight is a hole through a housing that the shooter can't easily see around. The NECG peep and ghost ring sights both have same diameter aperture 0.93" but the peep has an extra optional aperture 0.125".
View attachment 205425NECG ghost ring
View attachment 205427
NECG peep sight

To be honest, I'm not entirely sure about the advantage of one over the other, hence the thread.

You may be right. I always thought the difference was just the size of the aperture. A peep sight has a very small hole for more precise shooting, a ghost ring has a large, open hole and the front sight just floats in the middle of a big circular view.
So with my Williams peep sight, I can do either. There's a small aperture piece that screws into a larger circle if you want the little peep. Just remove it for the ghost ring.

 

[Jbaldwin40]

I'm only familiar with a ghost ring on my shotgun. Does not have a housing around it and is barely visible when shooting. I don't use this gun for hunting. I think it would depend on application. Ghost ring for close work and peep for when more accuracy is needed.

 

[VAspeedgoat]

Ghost ring allows you to focus on the front sight and beyond. Because of the usual layout it kinda gets blurry and you don't see it much. Hence the term ghost ring. Honestly looking at that design I'm not sure how much that is truly gonna be a ghost ring? If you look at XS sights you will see it's basically just a ring without that much housing. The one you show really just looks like a larger peep sight. That being said, if it's for bad weather I'd go with the larger hole so you can pick snow and ice out of it. I'd also just consider flip up scope caps.

XS does make some nice rails that have the ghost ring built in but not sure what models they fit.

 

[OntarioHunter]

Ghost ring allows you to focus on the front sight and beyond. Because of the usual layout it kinda gets blurry and you don't see it much. Hence the term ghost ring. Honestly looking at that design I'm not sure how much that is truly gonna be a ghost ring? If you look at XS sights you will see it's basically just a ring without that much housing. The one you show really just looks like a larger peep sight. That being said, if it's for bad weather I'd go with the larger hole so you can pick snow and ice out of it. I'd also just consider flip up scope caps.

XS does make some nice rails that have the ghost ring built in but not sure what models they fit.

Thanks. Most ghost ring setups are tactical crap and set exceedingly high. I guess there's supposed to be some tactical advantage to sighting a rifle when only half on it (½ mounted). My hunting rifle and scope fits me perfectly now. It comes to my shoulder and presto the crosshairs are in view completely and centered. Cheek is just resting on the comb, not ground into it (makes for a painful day at the range!) or loose from it (= hunting for the crosshairs in quick shot situations).

I agree, there's is kind of an oddball ghost ring setup. Usually they are a ring on a post anchored from the bottom and open at the top. 0.93" seems like a small aperture for ghost ring. I'm wondering if it's a typo? Given the similarity in designs, I don't see much advantage in NECG's ghost ring over peep unless the aperture is in fact larger. I think it would be very easy to make a similar design adjustable QD folding leaf rear sight similar to the dovetail ones Williams and Marbel sell. NECG makes several traditional leaf sights including a folding blank one so it wouldn't be a huge leap for them. Perhaps I could have a machinist make a similar detachable platform for a rail with a dovetail for Williams folding leaf sight. That way the folded sight could stay on the rail underneath the scope. No need for it to be quick detach. Simply remove the scope and pop up the leaf. I think you may be right, switching to a peep or ghost ring in bad weather might not gain me much. The aperture is easily fouled. If NECG can't come up with a leaf design for me I'll order a peep or ghost ring from them and have my machinist here use it as a template for a dovetail platform. Given the booming popularity of rails you'd think someone would already be making these. Or another quicker route might be to pick up a high steel Weaver ring and have the machinist simply cut off the ring, flatten the top, and cut a dovetail in it for Williams/Marbel folding leaf. I'll have to look and see if there would be enough metal in the bridge for the dovetail and still clear the scope. Hmmm.

 

[elkduds]

Ontario, how is your vision? I had to give up my Lyman peep and switch to ghost ring when my glasses could no longer focus on the front sight and the target. I'd see a set of concentric rings in the peep hole, where before it was a crisp, bright dot that made the front sight and target clearer. My ghost ring setup had fiber optics and was good for the 125 yd range of my caplock. Good luck.

 

[OntarioHunter]

Ontario, how is your vision? I had to give up my Lyman peep and switch to ghost ring when my glasses could no longer focus on the front sight and the target. I'd see a set of concentric rings in the peep hole, where before it was a crisp, bright dot that made the front sight and target clearer. My ghost ring setup had fiber optics and was good for the 125 yd range of my caplock. Good luck.

My vision is probably worse than yours. Sounds like this peep/ghost ring scheme is going south fast. Having a machinist make a base with leaf sight dovetail that clamps on the rail may be my best option. I could have a gunsmith mount a leaf sight base or dovetail on the barrel ahead of the scope except 1) we are now short of gunsmiths here (as in nonexistent) and 2) given my recent traumatic experience with a gunsmith in Superior, WI, I'm reluctant to trust someone else to do modifications to that gun, especially if I can accomish what I need myself. Also, a longer sight line should improve accuracy.

Just now looking at my 760 pump with quick detach scope and leaf sight well ahead of the scope, the rear sight is a little fuzzy but no trouble putting the ivory front bead in the V. Looks like a folding leaf sight mounted on the rail just behind the front QD ring would be a tight fit between the ring and loading/ejection port but I think there'll be room. Mounting the rear sight at the other end of the rail probably would not work well with my old shooting eye. Too close. I guess that is the advantage to the NECG sights: they are easily attached anyplace on the rail to accommodate vision and just as easily removed so clearance with the scope is not an issue. Fiddling with attaching the sight when hands are wet or cold might be an issue though. I should clarify that the rail I have chosen is relatively low centered and exactly the same height as my current Weaver bases. It also has partial cutaway over the loading port. It's much more aesthetic (not as tactical tacky in appearance) and more practical than the typical p rail (cutaway allows for easier loading). Should have no worries about scope being the right height if new QD rings are the same height as current Weaver extended rings.

 

[Caseknife]

I believe the Williams and Lyman aperture sights were the precursor to the ghost ring sights. We would sight in our rifles with the small aperture screwed in for a finer sight picture at 100 yds, but always removed the aperture for hunting purposes. Your eye naturally centered the "ghost ring" and all you were focused on was the front sight and the ribcage of the bull at 70 yards. My eyes are failing me, handguns sights are difficult, but an aperture sight on the receiver has always just been a blur, nothing has changed. I've got the XS sights rail and aperture on my Vortek ML along with a globe front sight with a fine cross-hair insert, best of both worlds. Can install a scope on the rail when going to a different state, or take it off at home.