PA Changing the First Day of Rifle... Thoughts?

[MJE2083]

I really don't care one way or another personally. I know that some schools close on Monday(mostly rural areas), but many do not. Colleges and Universities don't close so it should make it easier for those "young people". I think this move makes a ton more sense if Sunday hunting is legalized(no it has not been legalized yet...please contact your State Reps). 1 more day to hunt and one less vacation day to burn is a win for me. Much ado about nothing I think.

Those farmers saying they're going to prohibit hunting all together if Sunday hunting passes are welcome to do whatever they want with their land. They'll also probably be the first ones crying about crop damage. Personally I would like to have the opportunity to hunt the millions of acres of public land on Sunday.

 

[deer_shooter]

I really don't care one way or another personally. I know that some schools close on Monday(mostly rural areas), but many do not. Colleges and Universities don't close so it should make it easier for those "young people". I think this move makes a ton more sense if Sunday hunting is legalized(no it has not been legalized yet...please contact your State Reps). 1 more day to hunt and one less vacation day to burn is a win for me. Much ado about nothing I think.

Those farmers saying they're going to prohibit hunting all together if Sunday hunting passes are welcome to do whatever they want with their land. They'll also probably be the first ones crying about crop damage. Personally I would like to have the opportunity to hunt the millions of acres of public land on Sunday.

I agree wholeheartedly. IIRC, Pennsylvania is one of 3 states left that does not allow Sunday hunting. The arguments against just don't make sense to me but I do recognize and respect the different points of view. I've heard the deer need a day to rest and the added 2 days will decimate the deer herd among many others. Personally, I don't think adding a few days to the season will have a drastic impact on the harvest.

 

[RobG]

I’ve hunted the opener there. Pretty crazy for a MT boy. Even more people will be out on a Saturday so more harvest. In addition, I wonder how much the day of no hunting after only one day of hunting will increase harvest. Reduced numbers seems to be the goal out there.

Good luck eliminating Sunday hunting...

 

[JLS]

Threaten to close ones land to hunting if Sunday hunting’s legalized is about as stupid as making it illegal in the first place.

If you don’t want to allow Sunday hunting on your farm, great, have at it. But using your land to leverage a law like this is simply ridiculous.

 

[jlmatthew]

Not from PA, and have never hunted there but I hope they open it on Saturday. My wife is from PA and I know she wants to go there for Thanksgiving to see her family so the Saturday would make it easy for me to hunt there on her uncle's farms if we were to make a short trip out

 

[Boarmaster]

I drive up from SW Florida to my lease in Alabama to hunt the saturday opener the weekend before Thanksgiving then
Drive up to Ohio for Thanksgiving with some family. Ohio has a Monday opener as well. So day after Thanksgiving guys show up at my cousins place and sight in. We do some cooking and pack up for the ride on Saturday down to Wayne National Forest . Sunday is sort of a wasted day as we wait for the Monday opener. We usually hunt three days then head back up to NW Ohio on Thursday. Saturday everyone shows up to process deer. All these different activities add to the whole experience of the hunt for me. So I can understand guys not wanting their traditions disrupted.
If I put myself in there shoes I would not care for the change unless I could hunt Sunday. Where we hunt on federal land opening day is the best day with more hunters in the woods keeping the deer moving. Like others have said , good for some , maybe not for others. Maybe opening hunting on Saturday would get more people in the woods and that might be a heck of a day.

 

[TheWanderer]

I grew up outside Pittsburgh and then in Cameron county PA in the north-central part. I think the change makes sense, but it sucks to lose the tradition. I grew up going to deer camp when I was old enough. We'd drive up on Friday or Saturday and it'd be a weekend of fun with the older guys. But a lot of that crowd is gone and a lot of the camps don't open anymore up that way. With my dad's generation getting older way less people are hunting. Less schools are giving off for opening day (we got the first two off). I hope it allows more people to get out for a day as the people who'd only hunt opening day will hopefully be more inclined to go than having to take a vacation day for that Monday.

I hope it does add pressure to the argument for Sunday hunting. There's a lot of people who head out of state for their weekends rather than head up north to the deer camp country I grew up in. When they have to drive a few hours to get there and only get one day to hunt it makes more sense to go to NY or OH or MD (where its allowed). It'd be nice to see people head back up to deer camp. The herd seems to be better managed there in the last decade and some of the towns up there could really use more economic support from hunter dollars.

I lived in NJ when they loosened the regs and allowed bowhunting on private land on Sundays. I live in DE now and in the last couple years they opened all Sundays to hunting. I haven't heard of any pushback from landowners who've blocked off access because "sunday should be a day of rest". Landowners should be allowed to do whatever they want. If they only want hunting on every third day they can have it their way. But if there hasn't been much of a change in access trends in any of the other states that are striking down "blue laws" then why would we expect there to be one in PA?

 

[Mattff200]

I think this will help retain hunters in PA. College years is a time when people get out of hunting due to limited time off and I'm fairly sure there is a good amount of people that dont get back into hunting after college and this change could help with the decline of hunters.

 

[Adamm88]

I like it, it gives me a day off to hunt that i dont have to tale pto. I really think the move to Saturday is setting up for Sunday hunting the next year.

As far as farmers not wanting sunday hunters, that fine by me, its there land amd there choice, i hunt 99 percent public anyways.

 

[MT Bound]

I would love someone to come on and defend it... what is the argument for that rule.

I also agree no hunting on Sunday is one of the dumbest laws out there. Society is so far removed from the religious blue laws most don’t even remember why they are in place to begin with.
I lived in New England for over 20 years, the anti hunting crowd now uses the no Sunday hunting law to their advantage. I have also heard guides in Maine approve of the no Sunday hunting rule as it gives them a break & a day to turn in new hunters, complete bullshit to not support hunting 7 days a week. I have also heard numerous MA & RI hunters agree that no Sunday hunting is good as it gives them time w their family, etc etc all horseshit...if you don’t want to hunt on Sunday then don’t hunt, but don’t tell me I can’t go out. Gonna be hard to pass that bill if you don’t have all the hunters backing it up in a mass of anti hunting society, never gonna happen there...

 

[Mattff200]

I totally agree with that just because you dont want to hunt on Sunday doesnt mean that there needs to be a law against it. I recently moved out to Wyomjng and for my work in working Monday to Saturday for the busy season. Sunday hunting allows me to get a full day of hunting per week during the spring bear season and two when work slows down.

 

[jt13]

Most folks with common sense are pro Saturday opener and pro Sunday hunting. Lots of the vocal minority out and about though. At least one member of the Board of Commissioners has resigned due to his opposition of the decision for the Saturday opener and several politicians have call for the resignations of all the commissioners who voted for the change. Some landowners have pledged to post their ground and not allow any hunting on their farms in protest.

 

[squirrel]

The pressure on farmers lands in Pa is something else, if you have never experienced it with a combination of traditions and laws causing it to happen. Tiny fines, combined with no enforcement and high hurdles of easily avoidable legal thresholds make for some very frustrated land holders. The "no trespassing " signage requirements are just plain hard to believe, compared to other states. And throw in the game commissions "we will not come to enforce" policy and it is a complete shit show kinda like catch and release fishing if you are the land owner.

Then you throw in religion on top of politics and what could go wrong?

To keep trespassers at bay it requires one to not hunt, just cruise fence lines and chase down shots all day on saturday, and quite a bit on the weekdays as well. Many land holders just do not want another day of this on top of what they already have.

Of course the godless heathens know who the devout are and would swarm like biblical locusts to drive their farms devoid of deer during the 2 hour window of church induced opportunity.

Case in point, my Dad put trout in his pond which grew to huge size and he loved feeding them into a thrashing mass of fish and we were forbidden to fish for them, they were his pets.

When they started to lessen in numbers his boys were suspects... being boys after all. Then he went to church on sunday and got sick, went to the basement puked and decided home was where he needed to be. Went home and caught a whole family on their weekly 1-1/2 hour fishing vacation with bobbers and worms and about 10-20 30" trout on a stringer belly up sitting around his pond 50 yards from his doorstep.

He was so pissed he might have even thought about a bad word... but the previously suspected "boys" were off the hook!

Until you withstand the weekend invasion from the city on your land you know only part of the story, and the city far out-numbers the land owners and they have decided to take what they want. not ask.

 

[88man]

The craziest thing with the guys at my hunting club is now they don't know when or should I say are arguing about the date to hold our annual Buck Party and raffle. Since it was always the Saturday after thanksgiving for over 50 years

 

[Deleted member 28227]

The pressure on farmers lands in Pa is something else, if you have never experienced it with a combination of traditions and laws causing it to happen. Tiny fines, combined with no enforcement and high hurdles of easily avoidable legal thresholds make for some very frustrated land holders. The "no trespassing " signage requirements are just plain hard to believe, compared to other states. And throw in the game commissions "we will not come to enforce" policy and it is a complete shit show kinda like catch and release fishing if you are the land owner.

Now that is a valid reason of why Sunday hunting is problematic.

Also makes hunting in the east some like a total shit show...

 

[squirrel]

Now that is a valid reason of why Sunday hunting is problematic.

Also makes hunting in the east some like a total shit show...

It really must be experienced to believe it... Tons of stories but one was "interesting" My Dad owns a big hill with a major state highway going up it. Sunday night storm leaves it solid ice, opening morning traffic all stalls right there, road is solid cars for length of my Dads place (maybe a mile) Daylight comes on the opener and all those people just walk away from their stranded cars and onto my Dads place. Maybe 200+ guys in orange flooding his farm, the ensuing carnage was as ugly as it was predictable, dead deer, fights over dead deer, cut fences, trucks driving right through the hay stubble.

By noon the road melts off and they all just disappear to wherever they had been going. I don't think there was a deer seen on my dads place for a week.

Now with the younger generation it is getting to the point of armed "F-U" confrontation. When we were youthful criminal miscreants we had the decency to run when confronted, not anymore.

 

[Festus]

Same story here...
I grew up in PA. It was ALWAYS ducks and/or rabbits and grouse Thanksgiving Thursday, and Friday, then off to deer camp up North Fri night. Sat and Sun were spent checking guns and stands and talking with neighbors about stands and deer. Then after dark, while most camps were playing poker, we would spotlight - other properties, of course. It was all legal (except maybe the annual trip through town putting out the street lights with our spotlights). That never got old. No firearms in the vehicles. We would see literally hundreds of deer and get even more pumped for the Monday opener. Schools were closed and we would deer hunt Monday and Tuesday with 312 gazillion other guys in orange after the elusive 'mountain buck'. If it had bone (1 spike 3" or more), it was down. You might see 20 or 30 deer a day, but usually only 1 or 2 bucks at the most. I had a slump where I would only kill half-racks for 3 or 4 years in a row. We would then return to camp Friday evening, even if you did kill, just to help with deer drives and extractions for the first weekend. Doe season was another Monday, Tuesday, and Wednesday also, if you were fortunate enough to get a stamp. You could almost always get that done in the first morning. Bear season was yet another Monday, Tuesday, and Wednesday.
Now I'm in VA and when I visit for Thanksgiving, my brothers and nephews are still doing the same thing (except for the spotlighting) and me and my family always talk about staying for the opener, but usually head home Saturday because they are all busy checking stands and guns and we can't stay all the way til Tuesday..

This year will be fun finally deer hunting with the family again on the Saturday opener.

As far as Sunday - I don't hunt on Sundays, but that is my personal choice. Even when hunting in a state where legal, I don't hunt on Sunday. They made it legal to hunt private land on Sunday here in VA last year or two and I know quite a few people that still don't hunt on Sunday here. It does not bother me if you hunt on Sunday - your choice. I don't think it needs to be a 'stupid law' or anything, just a personal choice.

 

[gutshootem]

The pressure on farmers lands in Pa is something else, if you have never experienced it with a combination of traditions and laws causing it to happen. Tiny fines, combined with no enforcement and high hurdles of easily avoidable legal thresholds make for some very frustrated land holders. The "no trespassing " signage requirements are just plain hard to believe, compared to other states. And throw in the game commissions "we will not come to enforce" policy and it is a complete shit show kinda like catch and release fishing if you are the land owner.

Then you throw in religion on top of politics and what could go wrong?

To keep trespassers at bay it requires one to not hunt, just cruise fence lines and chase down shots all day on saturday, and quite a bit on the weekdays as well. Many land holders just do not want another day of this on top of what they already have.

Of course the godless heathens know who the devout are and would swarm like biblical locusts to drive their farms devoid of deer during the 2 hour window of church induced opportunity.

Case in point, my Dad put trout in his pond which grew to huge size and he loved feeding them into a thrashing mass of fish and we were forbidden to fish for them, they were his pets.

When they started to lessen in numbers his boys were suspects... being boys after all. Then he went to church on sunday and got sick, went to the basement puked and decided home was where he needed to be. Went home and caught a whole family on their weekly 1-1/2 hour fishing vacation with bobbers and worms and about 10-20 30" trout on a stringer belly up sitting around his pond 50 yards from his doorstep.

He was so pissed he might have even thought about a bad word... but the previously suspected "boys" were off the hook!

Until you withstand the weekend invasion from the city on your land you know only part of the story, and the city far out-numbers the land owners and they have decided to take what they want. not ask.

This is the perspective that a lot of people just don't get. While we only own a few hundred acres, I completely understand this sentiment. We've had neverending problems with trespassers ever since I can remember and now with my brother and me living out of state it's even worse. We've had someone shot and almost killed one turkey season, signs constantly torn down, roads damaged etc. I even had to kick one of those fake deputy wco's off our place on the rifle opener when I was a teenager.

I'd say the majority of these issues occur on the opener or a Saturday so they'll all be exasperated and then even more so when Sunday hunting inevitably passes. The % of yahoos in the orange army will also increase now since people dont have to burn a day of leave to hit the woods. I think that the Monday opener weeded out some of the less serious hunters even though it did negatively impact the poor guys who justed couldn't get the day.

On the bright side, I'll prob hit up the Ohio opener this year and KS rifle starting next year. There's pros and cons to everything but I can certainly understand why some are against the changes.

And to all of the guys saying that they dont care about landowners closing property because they hunt public land anyway, where do you think the displaced hunters are going to hunt? The ones who don't just trespass anyway.

 

[squirrel]

I hear you gutshootem, especially on the torn down signs, and they only need to tear down one to make their foray legal. An awful lot of old traditions will have to be rescheduled to suit the new opener, and of course nowhere else on earth has the "opener" such an impact on success.

I remember in the early 80's my roommate was astounded that I was pissed I couldn't hunt the opener, no big deal right? Until i told him that 80% of ALL BUCKS ALIVE were dead by 10:00am opening morning.

Those days are past now but it is still a big deal. In the 70's if you could find a spot and not see orange somewhere it was a wilderness experience to be savored for it would not last long.

With the big organized drives, the "amish issue", and openly hostile laws towards landowners, PA is a unique place to try and thread any legislative needles.

 

[jnagel32]

I have a 200 acre farm and have problems every year with tresspassers as well, but changing the opener to Saturday or allowing Sunday hunting isn't going to stop them or entice them either way. They will still continue to illegally hunt and tresspass regardless. That's the thing about people that break the law, they don't care about the law...