Non-resident outfitter license (MT) Bill is up for hearing 2/2/2021 (SB 143)

[Gerald Martin]

I wonder if Berglee would have sponsored legislation to guarantee Gerald Martin a sheep tag?
I need some stability for my future plans....
Any ideas on whether there is any possibility of a veto?

 

[The Hedgehog]

There is ZERO possibility of a veto.

 

[Big Shooter]

I wonder if Berglee would have sponsored legislation to guarantee Gerald Martin a sheep tag?
I need some stability for my future plans....
Any ideas on whether there is any possibility of a veto?

He may have if you could have showed him how you could create $375-400 million dollars in nonresident tourism money by getting said sheep tag. You may have caught his attention with that. Just a thought.

 

[Gerald Martin]

He may have if you could have showed him how you could create $375-400 million dollars in nonresident tourism money by getting said sheep tag. You may have caught his attention with that. Just a thought.

Sure thing. Just give me five sheep tags to distribute and I will show you how to create $500 million dollars in tourism money.
Should I include an address to send the tags to?

 

[shoots-straight]

He may have if you could have showed him how you could create $375-400 million dollars in nonresident tourism money by getting said sheep tag. You may have caught his attention with that. Just a thought.

LOL, you're saying that the addition of around 3000 NR tags will create that much revenue?

That's some sketchy math at best. Lets say the original 5500 OSL were still in existence. They would have to spend $68,000 each for that much revenue to be generated by one bill.

That does sound like a MOGA talking point moment though.

 

[Kiwi]

I was considering buying MT bonus points but am I right in thinking that if this change is made then drawing a special permit tag will be harder / more complicated as I would need to draw a general tag before I could enter the special permit draw? Effectively I might only be able to get a general tag once every 3 years (and then the preference points expire) and be able to go in the special draw every 3 years.

 

[timmy]

Expecting to hunt a 5 week rut hunt with a high powered rifle every year or nearly every year isn’t realistic for nonresidents, outfitted or diy. Or residents hunters either.

 

[WIbiggame]

He may have if you could have showed him how you could create $375-400 million dollars in nonresident tourism money by getting said sheep tag. You may have caught his attention with that. Just a thought.

So outfitters are back to the $$side of their circle talk today? A few days ago it was survival family business or a way of life, before that it was less pressure on accessible lands and before that it was to protect the resources. I feel like I'm listening to a white house press briefing.

 

[Big Shooter]

Sure thing. Just give me five sheep tags to distribute and I will show you how to create $500 million dollars in tourism money.
Should I include an address to send the tags to?

Very valid point!

 

[Eric Albus]

“The concept of a special interest tag was wildly unpopular and that was illustrated with (SB) 143,” said Nick Gevock with the Montana Wildlife Federation. “So what did they do? They rammed a bill through in a matter of hours with zero public input. The trust is gone.”
With increasing applications for nonresident tags, Gevock believes Montana outfitters should focus on growing their client pools for the draws rather than trying to change the system. Having more clients in the draw would mean a better chance for full bookings rather than relying on relying on repeat clients that won’t draw every year.

Nick, over booking is not a viable solution. I would rather see the good outfitter rewarded by having a solid repeat business. Relying upon a lottery is no way
To run a business.
In order to run a viable business you must have a sound client base. The hard part of this business is FINDING the clientele who wish to use service offered. I realize most of you don’t (and many of you REFUSE) to understand this. The skewed perception is that the clients are lined up waiting for license. This is far from reality. Even as successful as my own operation is I have open hunt dates, due to many reasons. I lost a group due to the fact they did not apply and went to another state(at the last minute) where they could secure license. Just a fact of doing business with a lottery system.

Looking forward at what we have right now. I have started the conversation/movement that we(outfitters) need to sit down with the haters/detractors and see if there isn’t a compromise both sides can live with. I realize this will be a huge ask, for both sides, as we don’t trust your team anymore than you trust us.
If both sides don’t compromise and come up with a viable solution we can both spend 100’s of thousands of dollars fighting it out. Personally I’d vote to see that money spent on something worthwhile, like research/access/habitat enhancement. Far better than making lawyers and media men rich.

 

[WIbiggame]

Nick, over booking is not a viable solution

But in post 252 you said this?

"Buzz, I already do that(pass off the over drawn hunters to other outfitters)."

I am confused

 

[brocksw]

Nick, over booking is not a viable solution. I would rather see the good outfitter rewarded by having a solid repeat business. Relying upon a lottery is no way
To run a business.
In order to run a viable business you must have a sound client base. The hard part of this business is FINDING the clientele who wish to use service offered. I realize most of you don’t (and many of you REFUSE) to understand this. The skewed perception is that the clients are lined up waiting for license. This is far from reality. Even as successful as my own operation is I have open hunt dates, due to many reasons. I lost a group due to the fact they did not apply and went to another state(at the last minute) where they could secure license. Just a fact of doing business with a lottery system.

This guy figured it out.... I wonder what he tells people who don't have the points to draw the tag.....

 

[Ben Lamb]

I am confused

It's because they keep spinning, and don't care or realize when they contradict themselves.

Every small business owner in the world has to compete for clients. We do it because we realize nobody owes us a living and that the ability to succeed should be dependent upon our ability to offer a superior product or service. MOGA continues to think that the world (or at the very least, the state) owes them a living with guaranteed clientele. Not sure there is any other business in the US that operates on such a shady business model, except for maybe funeral homes.

That's why so many small business owners look at the outfitting industry quizzically.

https://www.podbean.com/media/share..._share_ep&utm_medium=dlink&utm_source=w_share

 

[Beignet]

This guy figured it out.... I wonder what he tells people who don't have the points to draw the tag.....

Yup. I have aspirations to hunt one of those famous mule deer units in Wyoming someday. The outfit I spoke with told me exactly how many points I was likely to need, and to give them a call back about two years before I meet that number of points to get started on placing a deposit with them to hold my place in line. Pretty easy, and something special to look forward to.

 

[BuzzH]

Nick, over booking is not a viable solution. I would rather see the good outfitter rewarded by having a solid repeat business. Relying upon a lottery is no way
To run a business.
In order to run a viable business you must have a sound client base. The hard part of this business is FINDING the clientele who wish to use service offered. I realize most of you don’t (and many of you REFUSE) to understand this. The skewed perception is that the clients are lined up waiting for license. This is far from reality. Even as successful as my own operation is I have open hunt dates, due to many reasons. I lost a group due to the fact they did not apply and went to another state(at the last minute) where they could secure license. Just a fact of doing business with a lottery system.

Looking forward at what we have right now. I have started the conversation/movement that we(outfitters) need to sit down with the haters/detractors and see if there isn’t a compromise both sides can live with. I realize this will be a huge ask, for both sides, as we don’t trust your team anymore than you trust us.
If both sides don’t compromise and come up with a viable solution we can both spend 100’s of thousands of dollars fighting it out. Personally I’d vote to see that money spent on something worthwhile, like research/access/habitat enhancement. Far better than making lawyers and media men rich.

From the first few lines, total load of crap.

I just wonder how it is that outfitters in Wyoming, Arizona and other states that don't have general NR tags and are almost exclusively LQ run a viable business?

I think Montana outfitters are just plain lazy and put ZERO effort into finding clients.

Maybe Gianforte should use the same philosophy with outfitters as he is for those on unemployment...take away the extra handouts to outfitters and force them back to actually working.

I've never seen a more entitled, lazy, and thoughtless bunch that want to put in as little effort as they can to prop up their business...ever.

 

[Ben Lamb]

From the first few lines, total load of crap.

I just wonder how it is that outfitters in Wyoming, Arizona and other states that don't have general NR tags and are almost exclusively LQ run a viable business?

I think Montana outfitters are just plain lazy and put ZERO effort into finding clients.

Maybe Gianforte should use the same philosophy with outfitters as he is for those on unemployment...take away the extra handouts to outfitters and force them back to actually working.

I've never seen a more entitled, lazy, and thoughtless bunch that want to put in as little effort as they can to prop up their business...ever.

it's just good, old fashioned Soviet style communism Buzz. It's all the rage in some circles.

 

[406dn]

Maybe Gianforte should use the same philosophy with outfitters as he is for those on unemployment...take away the extra handouts to outfitters and force them back to actually working.

I largely agree with all of your post.

This nugget is a distillation of a certain philosophy. For business interests,, greasing the skids is nearly always good. For lazy hourly workers, they are best helped with a kick in the backside.

 

[brockel]

I wish the government would require people to use an accountant to do their taxes. Would really help my wife’s business. Then she wouldn’t have to do the leg work of advertising and meeting with new clients.

 

[Sytes]

I didn't vote for Jersey G however, best thing I've seen to hit this covid deal is to put people back to work and the point the D's don't want to share... the "incentive" handouts are still present as an addition to their actual earned income after 4 weeks working vs couch potato handouts by Biden...

As for the outfitters, agree 100%. What a joke. The same R's (Jersey G, et al) that come up with a quality solution to get our workforce going are the same numb-nuts mandating socialized handouts to a select private business.

Messed up R's and D's.

 

[RobertD]

I have started the conversation/movement that we(outfitters) need to sit down with the haters/detractors and see if there isn’t a compromise both sides can live with.

Anytime I'm looking to start a productive conversation and work towards a compromise, I always make sure to start by labeling the other party as "haters/detractors" to really facilitate said compromise.