Bambistew
Well-known member
Fronting the tag fee argument is silly. So you trade off "conservation" dollars for the animal you want to hunt for better odds?
Does the guy with $125 deserve a tag more than the guy without, for an animal held in trust for the people? Why not make it a $1,000 or $5000? A poached sheep is worth $30k, so we know they are worth at least that much to Montana. Lets weed out the riffraff and raise some real conservation dollars.
I was curious to see the difference in totals of fronting the money vs application fees and did some quick math. I couldn't find my old MSG regs from the 90s/early 2000s to see how many apps there was. I do remember applying for the best odds in the 90s pre points and it was like 7% for a few units, but most were still stupid low. I remember writing $75 checks, and getting $68 back. My $7 conservation dollars were put to work!
F&G has stats from 2006 to current. In 2006 the department netted about $22 per application including tag sales, point fees, and application fees, etc. once added up. After dropping the requirement and raising all the fees, the department received about $52 per applicant in 2022. Your odds are worse because there is 134 fewer sheep tags issued in the drawing now than there was in 2006. I won't get into draw odds, much, but for draw tag odds (ewe and rams) in 2006 is was 1.6% (total draw tags/total apps) in 2022 it was 0.6%. If you were putting and keeping sheep on the mountain and using 2006 tag numbers and 2022 applicants your odds were just over 1%. Fronting the money didn't really do much for your odds. They are astronomical any way you look at it. Even limiting NR to the units they could apply for didn't change much.
One thing that's clear is the "conservation" dollars and effort spent on the big three sure haven't resulted in more animals on the mountain. As a matter of fact if its a metric, its having a negative effect. I think there is fewer sheep tags issued this year (same as last) than there was in 1984. BTW, MT killed the fewest number of rams last year (98) in a really long time. Worrying about who gets a tag to shoot the scraps should be the least thing to worry about. I'd do goats and moose but its the exact same story, maybe worse.
Good luck in the draws!
Does the guy with $125 deserve a tag more than the guy without, for an animal held in trust for the people? Why not make it a $1,000 or $5000? A poached sheep is worth $30k, so we know they are worth at least that much to Montana. Lets weed out the riffraff and raise some real conservation dollars.
I was curious to see the difference in totals of fronting the money vs application fees and did some quick math. I couldn't find my old MSG regs from the 90s/early 2000s to see how many apps there was. I do remember applying for the best odds in the 90s pre points and it was like 7% for a few units, but most were still stupid low. I remember writing $75 checks, and getting $68 back. My $7 conservation dollars were put to work!
F&G has stats from 2006 to current. In 2006 the department netted about $22 per application including tag sales, point fees, and application fees, etc. once added up. After dropping the requirement and raising all the fees, the department received about $52 per applicant in 2022. Your odds are worse because there is 134 fewer sheep tags issued in the drawing now than there was in 2006. I won't get into draw odds, much, but for draw tag odds (ewe and rams) in 2006 is was 1.6% (total draw tags/total apps) in 2022 it was 0.6%. If you were putting and keeping sheep on the mountain and using 2006 tag numbers and 2022 applicants your odds were just over 1%. Fronting the money didn't really do much for your odds. They are astronomical any way you look at it. Even limiting NR to the units they could apply for didn't change much.
One thing that's clear is the "conservation" dollars and effort spent on the big three sure haven't resulted in more animals on the mountain. As a matter of fact if its a metric, its having a negative effect. I think there is fewer sheep tags issued this year (same as last) than there was in 1984. BTW, MT killed the fewest number of rams last year (98) in a really long time. Worrying about who gets a tag to shoot the scraps should be the least thing to worry about. I'd do goats and moose but its the exact same story, maybe worse.
Good luck in the draws!
