Minimum ages, mentor tags, and other rambling thoughts

Shoots....this has nothing to do with me....or clients....it shows how well you do not know me.
 
I think common sense over the years...or decades, have kind of dictated that as a rule of thumb 12 years of age makes the most sense for having somewhat of a level of maturity to be able to make somewhat good decisions. Obviously this is not always the case, but along with all other things...there are ones that mature faster, and mature slower, but to average I would think 12 is a good age.

I'm not sure how being out in the woods with a gun is any less dangerous than driving a car, smoking a cigarette, or drinking a beer...or for that matter, being left alone at home (which in a lot of states the law says this is 12 years old).

Yet all of these things...the age limits have actually been raised because they've decided even an 18 year old isn't capable of making a smart decision with smokes or booze.
 
JLS said:
Speaking solely for myself, my kids didnt' NEED to kill. They had the opportunity to and wanted to take it. I don't NEED success of my kid in anything. All I hope for is that they all grow up to be moral and ethical people who try to make the world a better place. If they love Jesus while doing so, then so much the better.

Please don't speculate. I would pretty confidently say that I understand what is really important about the hunt as much as anybody on this board.

I can't speak to others, if they have different motives that aren't in the best interests of their children's development into responsible young adults, then shame on them.
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So explain to me the difference between need and opportunity. And please do not speculate my motives of the best interests of my children. mtmuley
 
FWIW, here's a synopsis of what is allowed in Indiana. A hunter born after 1986 must pass Hunter's Ed to be able to purchase a license/tag and hunt it how they wish. Cut and paste on the apprentice license program:
A resident or nonresident can buy an apprentice hunting license without having to take a hunter education class. An individual can purchase up to three apprentice hunting licenses, of any combination, in his/her lifetime before needing to take a DNR-offered hunter education class.

While hunting, the apprentice hunter at all times must be in close proximity to and able to communicate with a hunter who is at least 18 years old and has a valid hunting license (unless exempt from needing a hunting license). The individual who accompanies the apprentice hunter cannot accompany more than two apprentice hunters at one time while afield.

The apprentice resident youth hunt/trap license includes the same licenses and stamps as the regular resident youth hunt/trap license; it only exempts the license holder from needing to take a hunter education class.
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My son hunted this year with an apprentice license. He will do so as well for the next two years and then he'll have to pass hunter's ed if he wants to be able to hunt. He's 7 and already looking forward to his next hunt!
 
mtmuley said:
So explain to me the difference between need and opportunity. And please do not speculate my motives of the best interests of my children. mtmuley
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need

noun \ˈnēd\

: a situation in which someone or something must do or have something

: something that a person must have : something that is needed in order to live or succeed or be happy

: a strong feeling that you must have or do something

vs.

opportunity

noun op·por·tu·ni·ty \ˌä-pər-ˈtü-nə-tē, -ˈtyü-\

: an amount of time or a situation in which something can be done

I haven't once speculated as to anyone's motives here, including yours. As I said with Buzz, I can agree to disagree with some of you and I don't plan to nor intend to change your mind on this. If you feel that is in the best interests of your kids that they wait until an arbitrary age of 12 to hunt, then good on you.

I have read Posewitz's books and think they are wonderful. However, if fully understanding those is a benchmark for hunting then I can make a pretty good guess that 12 is too young. I don't expect a 12 year old hunter to completely understand all of the nuances of the hunt and the North American model of conservation any more than I expect a newlywed couple of 22 years old to fully understand the nuances of marriage, compromise, and selfless love.

However, under proper mentorship they will evolve into this over time. If it was simply a matter of reading the books, we would have eliminated the majority of the idiots from the hunting population that continue to give all of us a black eye.
 
JLS said:
However, under proper mentorship they will evolve into this over time. If it was simply a matter of reading the books, we would have eliminated the majority of the idiots from the hunting population that continue to give all of us a black eye.
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...and unfortunately under improper mentorship...more idiots are being created. I doubt there is a way to factually see what the numbers are on this, only that with this version someone might get hurt or killed...and in the future create more idiots.
 
idfishnhunt said:
...and unfortunately under improper mentorship...more idiots are being created. I doubt there is a way to factually see what the numbers are on this, only that with this version someone might get hurt or killed...and in the future create more idiots.
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Has Idaho seen an increase in young hunter accidents with their Passport program?
 
JLS said:
need
noun \ˈnēd\

: a situation in which someone or something must do or have something

: something that a person must have : something that is needed in order to live or succeed or be happy

: a strong feeling that you must have or do something
Click to expand...

Not concerned about all this silly youth crap, but I do NEED a MT bighorn sheep permit.
 
JLS said:
Has Idaho seen an increase in young hunter accidents with their Passport program?
Click to expand...

I haven't seen any documentation to support or discount any...but when dad is filling the tag for them...there probably won't be. :rolleyes: ...and that is just one step of idiots creating more idiots as you mentioned, or should I say...teaching ethics and values to a young child in hopes of them becoming a model sportsman.

Once again...not all are applied to this, I'm sure most of those that needed to fling up a picture of their kids are easily on the side of ones that are well on the right path. Those hiding and lurking in the shadows...can't wait to act like tool bags again this fall.
 
Funny how so many of us want less Government intrusion in our lives and yet now when the Legislators appear to be trying to do that to allow the parent to make a decision between a 10 and 12 year old going hunting there are so many bent out of shape! The argument seems to be that the mentors of these 10 year old kids are idiots and cheaters and, therefore, the kid needs to wait until 12. How will that solve anything, other than just adding 2 years to wait for those idiots to start teaching all the illegal practices they are involved in? Some should probably be happy they aren't in other states like Illinois, of all places, where a kid can pass a Hunters Ed Course at ANY age, get their FOID card through the State Police that Illinois requires for any gun owner with no minimum age requirement, and then they can hunt anything by themselves. I started carrying and killing game at 6 years old in IN back in the 50s, but even as knowledgeable and safe as I was I'd bet that my Dad would have never gone for that and I can't believe it's allowed at any age with no mentor, especially in a state like ILL where they just passed a right to carry recently to the dismay of a large segment of the population. Go figure!
 
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Topgun 30-06 said:
Funny how so many of us want less Government intrusion in our lives and yet now when the Legislators appear to be trying to do that to allow the parent to make a decision between a 10 and 12 year old going hunting there are so many bent out of shape! The argument seems to be that the mentors of these 10 year old kids are idiots and cheaters and, therefore, the kid needs to wait until 12. How will that solve anything, other than just adding 2 years to wait for those idiots to start teaching all the illegal practices they are involved in? Some should probably be happy they aren't in other states like Illinois, of all places, where a kid can pass a Hunters Ed Course at ANY age, get their FOID card through the State Police that Illinois requires for any gun owner with no minimum age requirement, and then they can hunt anything by themselves. I started carrying and killing game at 6 years old in IN back in the 50s, but even as knowledgeable and safe as I was I'd bet that my Dad would have never gone for that and I can't believe it's allowed at any age with no mentor, especially in a state like ILL where they just passed a right to carry recently to the dismay of a large segment of the population.
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You must not have read the bill. The bill says any kid 11-17 can hunt for two years with a mentor that is least 21 years old, before taking Hunters Safety.

And as far as "idiot and cheater mentors", well,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

http://ravallirepublic.com/news/state-and-regional/article_15ae9490-923a-5997-8970-fff9ab0a31eb.html
 
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tjones said:
You must not have read the bill. The bill says any kid 10-17 can hunt for two years with a mentor that is least 21 years old, before taking Hunters Safety.

And as far as "idiot and cheater mentors", well,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

http://ravallirepublic.com/news/state-and-regional/article_15ae9490-923a-5997-8970-fff9ab0a31eb.html
Click to expand...

I read the Bill and did not mention anything in it, but rather what a state like Illinois allows. Would you allow a kid that's 5 or 6 to go out on their own to hunt by themselves even if they had passed a course like Illinois allows? At least the MT Bill requires a mentor even though the kid hasn't taken the course, but he has to be 10, and that's what most of the 35 states are allowing if you look at their laws and there have been no problems. As high as I am on getting kids started young and deciding when they can actually hunt and not just accompany a mentor, I can't believe that Illinois, or any state as far as that goes, would pass a Bill like that.
 
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Montana isn't Illinois. Just sayin,,,,,,,,,,,,
 
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