Mechanical broadheads for elk

[Devil Diver Down]

This is going to be my first hunting season with a bow & wondered what you experienced guys thought about Rage broadheads for elk.

When I first talked to the guy at my local shop re: broadheads in the spring when I bought my bow, the consensus was mechanical were okay for mule deer & anything smaller (javelina, turkey, Coues, etc) but that he'd stick with fixed blade for elk due to penetration issues with mechanical heads.

This week, I found out I had a small "in" with a guy who developed the Rage heads and that I could get a bargain. He suggests the 2 blade KE (1.5") for elk to get a little extra penetration. I shoot a Hoyt Turbohawk /60#/30" draw.

Thoughts?

 

[WV Hunter]

There are a few things to worry about with Rage broadheads, this is totally my experience so your mileage may vary. I have been ready to draw back on a deer before and notice that the blades have come loose from the o-ring and is dangling. They will not fly very well like this and won't open up properly. They have come undone from walking with a nocked arrow or simply pulling them from the quiver. Pay attention to the head before you draw back!

The next part has been from seeing pictures and reading the internet so please make your own call on this. Deflection seems to be an issue with Rage heads. I have seen photos of quartering to and quartering away shots that left an animal with a slice across it because of deflection with one blade. The other problem is penetration. They don't necessarily break thru the bone. Maybe the new Titanium $80 heads but not the standard Rage.

Having said that, I have seen plenty of pass thrus on TV shows that left devastating wounds on whitetails. The one deer I shot with a Rage was a gut shot but the guts were completely hanging out of the deer and it only went 40 yards. I really don't think I would chance it with an elk though.

 

[upper deck]

I have had good luck wih the Snypers on Elk. but that was with a fair bit more KE than you will see out of your bow. My suggestion woulld be try to get a fixed blade to fly, if not you can always fall ack on the Rage.

There are some very nice fixed blades made now for faster setups. You see 10 million advertised every day but another one I seen good things out of are the Wasp Boss bullets. They will hold together and pentrate as good or better than anything on the market. And the best part you can get 6 heads for the price of everyone elses three.

 

[BOHNTR]

Elk.....you're asking for trouble, IMO.

 

[SDHNTR]

+1 to BOHNTR. Why risk it when there are so many great flying fixed heads out there today?

 

[D.A.D]

As long as a broadhead is sharp and you put it in the pump house they will all do a great job. I have been working with mechanicals since they came out. My bow shop was the first in the country to sell Punchcutters the original mechanical. We also worked with Paul the owner on the development and field testing. I have shot just about every head on the market and without a doubt the Rage has made bigger holes in critters and preformed better than any other. They also penetrate deeper then the over the top styles. With the use of any mechanical device you need to stay on top of things and make sure they are in working order before using and that goes for fixed also. I have had customers say their head got loose and the blades feel out (satellites). Good luck with your decision thankfully we have a ton of choices.
Remember opinions are like buttholes we all have one and they all stink (accept yours).

 

[Devil Diver Down]

Elk.....you're asking for trouble, IMO.

Asking for trouble because of the KE my set-up produces or with mechanicals on elk in general? Not looking to argue--just looking for specifics.

I'm looking at mechanicals for field tip type accuracy and the deal I'm getting. Not worth any kind of deal to me to shoot questionably suitable equipment but I am looking for parts to the story.

Appreciate the responses so far.

 

[sweetnectar]

Here is a bull shot with a rage two blade. The shot placement was quartering away and too far forward missing the lungs. Yet the broadhead made such a big cut we kept tracking. After bumping this bull 4 times, each time he pushed the blood clot out, and a long day of tracking we found him too weak to run away any more. The point is that dang broadhead made such a large cut that there was just enough non vein blood my buddy got lucky. If you have to use mechanical go rage...I've seen a front deploying broadheads fail.

That said. I use a fixed broadhead and side with what the other guys recommend. Hit em in the boiler and watch that the o-rings on the rage are holding the blades.

 

[SDHNTR]

Asking for trouble because of the KE my set-up produces or with mechanicals on elk in general? Not looking to argue--just looking for specifics.

I'm looking at mechanicals for field tip type accuracy and the deal I'm getting. Not worth any kind of deal to me to shoot questionably suitable equipment but I am looking for parts to the story.

Appreciate the responses so far.

I shoot a high KE set up and I wouldn't use a mech. I just don't see the need. There are so many good flying fixed blade broadheads these days that I don't see the advantage. Sure you might get a bigger cut, but that comes at the expense of penetration. I'd much rather have two 1 1/8" holes for bloodtrailing than one 2" hole.

 

[BOHNTR]

As long as you're confident with them (Rage), then by all means have fun. Some obviously have success with them which is awesome. However, elk are big and heavy boned animals that require as much penetration as you can get, IMO. Use the heaviest bow you can with adequate arrow weight......60 lbs is not enough, IMO.

I know four different friends that have lost elk using Rage due to lack of adequate penetration. Luckily one was recovered the next morning after a follow-up shot was completed. The original arrow failed to penetrate enough after hitting a rib squarely. All have been doing this bowhunting stuff for well over 30 years a piece...........using heavier weight bows (65-70) with heavy arrows. Lastly, there are FAR too many heads that fly just as well and are much more reliable.

Here's a response on the Rage expandables that really puts it in perspective. Again, just my opinion, but that's what was asked for here.

"I bet Randy Ulmer would love to take back his 100 yard shot challenge with a rage at the ATA a few years back. You know the one where the rage deployed mid flight, sailed 25 yards, and buried into the carpet. It only cost him $5,000. Understand when one shoots and expandable there greater inherent risks than shooting a fixed blade. Expandables have killed tons of game, but they don't work 100% time and so I will stay with a fixed blade and work on my bow tune. Today there are plenty of solid, well built, fixed blade broadheads (far superior in quality and strength) that fly like darts. My tune has me dialed into 80 yards, no need to change. Then it just becomes a matter of placement.

The worst thing Chuck Adams could have said on TV was "It's like hitting an animal with an Axe!" It made novice archers believe that wound channel was superior than penetration, when we all the know the inverse is true: Penetration should always be put before wound channel. Many medium to light poundage set ups do not perform with the Rage. I know they came out with a "Low KE" version, but many would have still been better served with better performing fixed than the "Low KE" version.

Expandables are not for novices, but those who understand the inherent risks of shooting with them. When a rage does perform as intended with sufficient KE and poundage, it is devastating. But don't fool yourself that there are no risks involved. There is no free lunch when one opts for an expandable. The risk of early deployment is too great for me and since I now mainly elk hunt that throws a whole new set of variables (thick brush, dead fall climbing, small window of opportunity) into the mix. (The chance of a pre-deployed expandable in my quiver is almost absolute under those conditions) A Fully deployed, fixed blade is really the only logical option for the situation and game I am hunting.

Expandables are for those who understand their equipment and the game they are hunting. It is a decision that has to be weighed carefully, and definitely not in a 30 second commercial."

 

[Hoggetter]

I use fixed blades meself.
SlickTrick 100gr magnums and easton axis arrows with blazer vanes.
They fly like darts out to 80yds. The slicktricks have a all steel body and have four blades.

Good luck!

 

[Dinkshooter]

I saw a picture of my buddies dead bull last fall with at least 2/3 of the arrow still sticking out. The shot was only 18 yards. He shoots 70lbs. You can't argue with dead, but no thanks, that is why I spent $150 in new heavier arrows this summer. I want my arrow laying in the grass on the other side.

There is a reason some states ban them for larger game.

If legal would you hunt grizz with expandables?

 

[Big Fin]

As long as you're confident with them (Rage), then by all means have fun. Some obviously have success with them which is awesome. However, elk are big and heavy boned animals that require as much penetration as you can get, IMO. Use the heaviest bow you can with adequate arrow weight......60 lbs is not enough, IMO.

I know four different friends that have lost elk using Rage due to lack of adequate penetration. Luckily one was recovered the next morning after a follow-up shot was completed. The original arrow failed to penetrate enough after hitting a rib squarely. All have been doing this bowhunting stuff for well over 30 years a piece...........using heavier weight bows (65-70) with heavy arrows. Lastly, there are FAR too many heads that fly just as well and are much more reliable.

Here's a response on the Rage expandables that really puts it in perspective. Again, just my opinion, but that's what was asked for here.

"I bet Randy Ulmer would love to take back his 100 yard shot challenge with a rage at the ATA a few years back. You know the one where the rage deployed mid flight, sailed 25 yards, and buried into the carpet. It only cost him $5,000. Understand when one shoots and expandable there greater inherent risks than shooting a fixed blade. Expandables have killed tons of game, but they don't work 100% time and so I will stay with a fixed blade and work on my bow tune. Today there are plenty of solid, well built, fixed blade broadheads (far superior in quality and strength) that fly like darts. My tune has me dialed into 80 yards, no need to change. Then it just becomes a matter of placement.

The worst thing Chuck Adams could have said on TV was "It's like hitting an animal with an Axe!" It made novice archers believe that wound channel was superior than penetration, when we all the know the inverse is true: Penetration should always be put before wound channel. Many medium to light poundage set ups do not perform with the Rage. I know they came out with a "Low KE" version, but many would have still been better served with better performing fixed than the "Low KE" version.

Expandables are not for novices, but those who understand the inherent risks of shooting with them. When a rage does perform as intended with sufficient KE and poundage, it is devastating. But don't fool yourself that there are no risks involved. There is no free lunch when one opts for an expandable. The risk of early deployment is too great for me and since I now mainly elk hunt that throws a whole new set of variables (thick brush, dead fall climbing, small window of opportunity) into the mix. (The chance of a pre-deployed expandable in my quiver is almost absolute under those conditions) A Fully deployed, fixed blade is really the only logical option for the situation and game I am hunting.

Expandables are for those who understand their equipment and the game they are hunting. It is a decision that has to be weighed carefully, and definitely not in a 30 second commercial."

To anyone who is not aware of the years of experience that has just been put to words, take that as some of the best free advice we will ever get.

As some would say, "You can take that to the bank."

 

[Devil Diver Down]

I got to word 5 on BOHNTR's latest post, "confident," and was able to sort this out in short order. If I was confident in them for elk, I would never have posted the question here and AT (someone else posted the same ? on MuleyMadness).

I'll be shooting a G5 Striker for my deer & elk hunts this year and in the off-season I'll be looking at bulking up my set-up, draw weight, arrows, etc. Changing now would certainly erode my confidence.

Thanks to all who shared their opinions on this subject!

 

[SDHNTR]

Good point DDD, if you have to ask, it's probably not the best choice.

 

[taabone]

No Rage!

I have one Rage that broke, yes broke, broadside on an elk rib right in the killzone, 10 yards. Never found him, one lunged and fell out. He bedded coagulated and was gone.

My hunting partner has a 350 dead somewhere for the coyotes from last season and a broken Rage.

Look around and you will start to see the posts. Don't hunt elk with the Rage. You may get lucky as others in the post and slip through between the ribs or bust a rib, but you take the chance of loosing an elk that you would otherwise have killed.

 

[schmalts]

For deer and lope I would never use anything but the 2 blade rage. That being said I worry about using them on elk and always swapped back to a fixed blade like slick trick or muzzy. An elks rib is probably tougher than a deer shoulder blade.

 

[A-con]

You should have put this thread in the fishing session since you opened a big can of worms.

 

[Gerald Martin]

I've shot Nap HellRazors and G5 Montecs for years with great success. Having said that I switched to using an Ulmer Edge last year because I was having some problems with arrow flight and I wasn't confident whether it was my form or my bow being out of tune. I killed my Alberta muley with the Ulmer Edge and it flew great and seemed to penetrate well. However, my buddy missed a nice muley with a Rage. When he drew one of the blades deployed on his 3 blade Rage. and he shot with it open. I can't say for certain that it caused him to miss but I wasn't impressed with that. He connected on another buck later with a 3 blade Rage and I was impressed with the blood trail.
I'm definitely not a mechanical hater, but I'm planning on going back to a fixed blade head this year.

 

[Redwood]

To many horror stories with mechanicals. Rage have a great marketing campaign, unfortunetly I have seen them fail to many times. Confidence is everything. I get a quality fixed blade, lots to pick from, then power tune.