If you voted for Trump with on the basis of public access.....you were dead WRONG!!

[rammac]

...You can hunt in monuments. Most monuments have it in their proclamation that you can hunt in them.

More ignorant propaganda from the misinformed.

There are 117 National Monuments. These monuments are managed by at least 7 government agencies and hunting/ fishing will be controlled in accordance with the managing agency's rules. If the monument is managed by the National Park Service then no hunting or fishing will be allowed. The National Park Service is the sole manager of 78 monuments, that leaves just 39 monuments that might allow hunting and fishing. Also, most monuments do not expressly permit hunting and fishing, they simply imply that hunting and fishing is allowed since the agency that manages the monument typically allows those kinds of recreation (the Forest Service, BLM, etc.). I found a list of 17 Western National Monuments that explained that only two of those monument proclamations expressly authorized hunting and fishing, the rest only implied that it was allowed since the proclamations didn't specifically prohibit it.

So no, most of the proclamations do not specifically state that you can hunt and fish on monument land. That means that the managing agencies can change the rules any time that they want, that's hardly a guarantee of continued public land use policies.

 

[HighWildFree]

More ignorant propaganda from the misinformed.
If the monument is managed by the National Park Service then no hunting or fishing will be allowed.

What?!?! That is just blatantly false.

 

[Ben Lamb]

Point for specificity over obtuseness, but how many people are dying to hunt The Charles Young Buffalo Soldier National Monument?

Or the Fort McHenry? Since we're going to be so specific, here's the list of National Monuments, let us know which ones that don't allow hunting should be opened. Personally, I can't wait to go hunting at the Military Working Dogs National Monument.

Most modern monuments have specified that hunting and fishing are still to be administered by the states, and that lands w/in the Monuments are left to managing agencies to decide it it matches with specific areas or the intent of the designation (As outlined under FLPMA). In the case of Bears Ears, Rio Grande Del Norte, etc it's part and parcel of the record of decision, the public process and yes, in the proclamation. So in essence, not that far off of your usual, typical use mandate. In fact, pretty much the same thing, with the added prescription that if other uses are going to damage the resource, they may be curtailed. Oh wait, that's just like uncategorized public land as well!

Also, I'm sure NPS would be shocked at the number of people fishing in RMNP, YNP, etc. I bet they had no idea they didn't allow fishing!

Or that we hunt elk in Grand Teton NP

Or Roosevelt NP

 

[rtraverdavis]

I found a list of 17 Western National Monuments that explained that only two of those monument proclamations expressly authorized hunting and fishing, the rest only implied that it was allowed since the proclamations didn't specifically prohibit it.

Is this what you’re talking about?

https://headwaterseconomics.org/wp-content/uploads/NatlMon_Permitted_Uses.pdf

How shaky are those “Implied Usage” rules though? The privilege to hunt on those monuments don’t seem to be in any greater danger than our privilege to hunt in general.

 

[Keeptrying]

What's really interesting are the individual restrictions that are in place at each parks and monuments.

Who doesn't want to hunt audad with a bow?

Did you know hunting is allowed in the Badlands National Park? Neither did I. That's because it is only allowed for native Americans. Same for millions upon millions of acres in Alaska open only to "subsistence" hunting. And if memory serves me correctly it was during the last administration that "subsistence" regulations were moved forward on these lands.

I think it's cool that these areas are open to hunting, but a closer look at the transition from monument to park and the incremental application of more restrictive regulations over time is a very real issue.

The pro-monument people do themselves a disservice by not addressing it.

 

[Bugle 'Em In]

GB has made it easy for you to understand everything you need to know. He even pulled the chalk board back out LOL Thank goodness he's jumped into the fight (I didn't even know he was still working).

http://www.theblaze.com/video/heres...rumps-decision-to-shrink-2-national-monuments

 

[Keeptrying]

GB has made it easy for you to understand everything you need to know. He even pulled the chalk board back out LOL Thank goodness he's jumped into the fight (I didn't even know he was still working).

http://www.theblaze.com/video/heres...rumps-decision-to-shrink-2-national-monuments

Incorrect information right out of the gate. That doesn't help either.

 

[Bugle 'Em In]

Incorrect information right out of the gate. That doesn't help either.

I guess my post wasn't heavy enough with sarcasm. My bad.

 

[u1299]

All we could do until Trump signed the proclamation to reduce the size was to just stand on the road and look at it? Holy shit, I need to wake up from this nightmare I’m in.

 

[Keeptrying]

I guess my post wasn't heavy enough with sarcasm. My bad.

Upon rereading your post I see it now.

 

[fwagner]

Randy had a live video on youtube last night, everyone was asking him to address it. I didn't watch the whole thing but I never got brought up.....wish it would have.

 

[mixedbag]

Man,I missed alot.I was busy buying oil stocks.

 

[fwagner]

Rinella 100% nailed it! Can't argue with this...

http://www.themeateater.com/2017/st...grand-staircase-escalante-national-monuments/

 

[Northwoods Labs]

Rinella 100% nailed it! Can't argue with this...

http://www.themeateater.com/2017/st...grand-staircase-escalante-national-monuments/

It was a reasonable response. He was obviously trying very hard to take some sort of middle ground. I posted earlier that you need to look at those who stand the most to gain and those who pushed the hardest for this. Most of their backgrounds come from the land transfer (and just general anti-public land) crowd. Rinella really didn't address this which I thought was kind of weak

 

[Zach]

Rinella 100% nailed it! Can't argue with this...

http://www.themeateater.com/2017/st...grand-staircase-escalante-national-monuments/

Doesn't your opening salvo with this thread do just that?

 

[375H&H]

How many hysterias does the left wing media have to create that never come true before everyone finally tunes them out? Trump was supposed to be a racist, misogynist, sell all public lands, bring anti semites in the white house and the list goes on. Um, last I checked none of those hysterias have come even close to being true. Matter of fact NONE of the hysterias in the last few decades have come true that the left has created. This really gets old thinking the sky is falling at every turn, but if the right could harness the power of hysterias the way the left has, then watch out, because chit would actually get done.

 

[tjones]

Kinda like Obama was coming for our guns.

 

[375H&H]

Tjones, yes kind of like that. Except that hysteria was not plastered on every news channel, preached at universities, and as divisive as all of the other hysterias.

 

[u1299]

How many hysterias does the left wing media have to create that never come true before everyone finally tunes them out? Trump was supposed to be a racist, misogynist, sell all public lands, bring anti semites in the white house and the list goes on. Um, last I checked none of those hysterias have come even close to being true. Matter of fact NONE of the hysterias in the last few decades have come true that the left has created. This really gets old thinking the sky is falling at every turn, but if the right could harness the power of hysterias the way the left has, then watch out, because chit would actually get done.

Where do you get your news on a daily basis, somewhere other than from the media? From the POTUS himself because that’s real and everything else fake?

 

[375H&H]

Where do you get your news on a daily basis, somewhere other than from the media? From the POTUS himself because that’s real and everything else fake?

Nope, I get my news from the media...just not from the left wing hysteria media. I kinda think that is where "fake news" came from?