I should apologize to Randy for this

[hank4elk]

It's a combination of those factors, not any one thing on their own. Obviously owning guns and body armor doesn't make you a serial killer. I'm wearing body armor and carrying a gun as we speak.

LEO? Or just normal everyday suitup?

 

[DouglasR]

I would be interested to see the stats on how many of these shooters had a father figure in there life or a shitty one for that matter.

I don’t think you should apologize for starting this thread. I think we should talk about these things because they are an issue that isn’t just going away but we should keep it civil so it doesn’t become a problem for Randy. I’ve found Dr. Jordan Petersons research into this subject interesting.

A great example of Rogan quoting some sort of doctor:
“The only thing that really ****s kids up is knowing that no one gives a shit about them”
It hard for me to imagine the mentality of a person who never had a mother or father love them and or were never taught the concept of love.
Sometimes it’s like not even that the parents are shit bags as much as it’s just that biology is cruel.
My mom has worked on and off in a children’s home for troubled youth and has reiterated Rogans quote.
It’s not their fault.
They just just weren’t taught morals or love and they’re essentially just a feral predator.
Super sad.
How do you solve it

 

[pabearhunter]

I was just saying this. Al these kids claim depression or anxiety for every excuse.

I had anxiety at times growing up. It was right between getting caught doing exactly what I was told not to do and getting by butt whipped. It left a depression on my ass every time. God my dad was cool. I thank him he taught me to grow up, respect elders and women and be a man.

My dad was the DOUBEST person on earth after the first month of boot camp he SURE got a lot SMARTER.

 

[Redmt]

I don't understand this mental health crisis. What is it? When did it start? Granted that I'm older than most of you but not as old as some. Growing up we never had or rather never heard of mental health issues. I do see nowadays that kids have an entirely different way of dealing with their social problems. How did a simple ass kicking after school turn into a little kid shooting and killing kids and teachers? I also think that the news people are partially to blame for the spread of these shootings. They need to stop publishing the names and pictures of these kids. Quit giving them fame. I'll bet there are quite a few of us older generations that purposely raised hell to either get attention or to become the popular clown. Where did we go wrong in putting into a kids head that school shootings were a good thing?

 

[kwyeewyk]

I think there is a much larger scale societal response to population and environmental pressures occurring that combined with our Hollywood/video game culture and easy access to advanced weapons, has led to a copycat scenario where this has become the preferred method of lashing out. Put enough monkeys in a cage and they will kill each other.

We have so much knowledge about mental health that is never applied as a society; unless you pay a psychologist you may never learn. Why aren't we doing real work to heal trauma at a young age? Unfortunately I think the left/right ideology is used as a wedge for profiteers and results in distrust of mental health approaches and unwillingness to allow children proper counseling at school or otherwise.

I had pretty mellow parents as far as discipline, but a severely abusive older brother. I can assure you a regular ass whooping does nothing to cure this, and could well be the cause in many cases. I had a fairly serious plan to take out my brother with the 20 gauge around 10th grade. I'd known and practiced safe gun handling all my life, my grandpa would smack any kid he saw pointing toy guns or even finger guns at people, and I knew it was wrong, but seemed the only solution. Then I met the girl who eventually would be my wife and mother of my children, and realized there was so much more to live for.

I think @gouch nailed it, we need to work with facts, but nobody truly wants to do that.

 

[VikingsGuy]

Well when children are not taught RIGHT from WRONG and RESPECT. That is what you get.

I agree fully - we need to teach all children it is WRONG to treat others as less because of their gender, race, religion, etc., that it is RIGHT to go out of their way to help those who have not had the same advantages, and that they need to set aside their own biases and RESPECT that others know their own self better than a distant stranger.

 

[VikingsGuy]

I was just saying this. Al these kids claim depression or anxiety for every excuse.

I had anxiety at times growing up. It was right between getting caught doing exactly what I was told not to do and getting by butt whipped. It left a depression on my ass every time. God my dad was cool. I thank him he taught me to grow up, respect elders and women and be a man.

This thinking is part of the problem. My best friend (who happens to also be a cousin) showed clear signs of several mental health challenges growing up, but his mom said psychiatrists and meds were for the weak and did nothing to get him help. Even in his twenties, his mother's judgement kept him from seeking services. Finally as he reached the bottom in his 30s he sought counseling. He was transformed and was much more successful as a husband, father and small business owner. Yet to this day his mom will still openly mock him for this in front of others. There can be no question professional counseling and appropriate meds are more effective than spanking and shame for a significant portion of our fellow humans.

 

[jt13]

LEO? Or just normal everyday suitup?

EDC... you can never be too safe





Just kidding, it's for work

 

[88man]

The devil is always waiting for his opportunity and he doesn't come wearing a red cape and a hood when he convinces the soul.

 

[glass eye]

Never forget when the shop teacher was struggling trying to open a box and looked at a bunch of us and said "which one of you has a knife?" About 8 of us pulled our knives out of our pockets. lol He just grabbed the closest one and he was shaking his head smiling while he was opening the box up. Folded up the knife and handed it back to the one kid.

In the late 70s my shop teacher caught me making a pipe bomb. When he asked me what I was making I said "a pipe bomb" because it was obvious what it was. He picks it up after examining it he hands it back and says "nice weld"

 

[Deleted member 18333]

This thinking is part of the problem. My best friend (who happens to also be a cousin) showed clear signs of several mental health challenges growing up, but his mom said psychiatrists and meds were for the weak and did nothing to get him help. Even in his twenties, his mother's judgement kept him from seeking services. Finally as he reached the bottom in his 30s he sought counseling. He was transformed and was much more successful as a husband, father and small business owner. Yet to this day his mom will still openly mock him for this in front of others. There can be no question professional counseling and appropriate meds are more effective than spanking and shame for a significant portion of our fellow humans.

According to CDC data at full 17% of US children age 12-17 and 11% of 5-11 yr olds have received prescription medication or undergone therapy for mental health issues in the last 12 months. But like you have and others have stated, stigma, cost and accessibility cause others to not seek help. If this is true, which I think it most likely is, these percentages should be even higher. As they are they seem staggeringly high.

There is more going on that is leading to these rates than we fully understand. Stigma, cost and access is not the source of the problem. IMO.

 

[geetar]

A great example of Rogan quoting some sort of doctor:
“The only thing that really ****s kids up is knowing that no one gives a shit about them”
It hard for me to imagine the mentality of a person who never had a mother or father love them and or were never taught the concept of love.
Sometimes it’s like not even that the parents are shit bags as much as it’s just that biology is cruel.
My mom has worked on and off in a children’s home for troubled youth and has reiterated Rogans quote.
It’s not their fault.
They just just weren’t taught morals or love and they’re essentially just a feral predator.
Super sad.
How do you solve it

Well I don’t have the answer but I think the first step is looking into all the factors at play like Doctor Peterson does with the idea that these are people who have built up deep resentment for years and get to the point that they are willing to kill others who have the life they want and I think in a way any of us who have either been blessed with good parents or have overcome the struggles of having bad parents and the damage that did sort of have a responsibility to be willing to listen to the problems of troubled youth and let them know someone cares. I mean this is really sad but I have a young guy ( 18 years old ) who works with me and I asked him something the other day about if he liked something ( I don’t even remember what it was ) and his reply was. I don’t have much of an opinion. I learned my opinion didn’t matter when I was in middle school. . I learned not to have an opinion because saying what I thought would have gotten me hurt in the school I went to. He came from an inner city school where he was afraid to say what he thought for fear of being beat up and I just said man your opinion does matter. You have a right to say what you think. It seems so simple to take the time to let someone know they do matter but it wasn’t happening in his life. He’s a pretty good kid but he literally thought no one cared and I think just being there on a daily basis for some of these kids before it gets to the point of shooting up schools is a good place to start. It’s terribly sad how many are out there that literally think the world is a meaningless place where no one cares and nothing matters. I can’t shoulder it all by any means but I hope to be a small light of meaning and purpose when I can.

 

[cwitherow]

Part of the problem is, just like this thread, we all sit around in our ignorance and give our ignorant view of what the problem is. We need in depth studies by people who really want to solve the problem (not prove they are right) in order to come up with the facts of what is causing or contributing to the problem. Then we must all accept those facts, even when they disagree with our socio-political world view and take the steps necessary to eliminate the problem. That last sentence is the hard, maybe impossible, part.

Bullets are now the number one cause of death for people under the age of 18. As much as it hurts, we cannot continue to insist that guns are not a big part of the equation.

I can't like this comment big enough. I'm so tired of being bombarded by "my side is right" and then we just move on...until it happens again and the cycle continues. I love teaching. I don't have an answer....but for the love of all that is holy, can we agree to do SOMETHING!

 

[CRJR45]

I think the problem is too random , what sets one shooter off is not the same thing as the next one . There is no one answer for all the crazies .
Kids raising kids is a big part of it , I hate when I see parents arguing with their kids .
But , stupid people raise stupid kids . And stupid is the problem , half the country is dumber than dirt right , IMO .
But , I also wonder if this is really a new problem or if it has been going on forever , but it just wasn't sensationalized like it today ?

 

[Gellar]

Obviously if the solution was easy it would have been fixed by now.

There is no doubt we have a mental health crisis in the United States. But what is causing it? We’ve had threads on the impact of social media, video games, tablets and phones on our kids. But is that the sole reason for mass shootings and suicide? I believe that the decline of firearms education, families having traditions based around the outdoors like deer camp, fishing trips etc, pushing kids to the brink with endless activities all year round, broken families, and even something as simple not sitting down for a family meal together have a severe negative impact on our well-being.

Is the Ease of access to firearms the problem? Yes I believe so. But before you get your panties in a bunch let me explain. I don’t think it’s a problem we can go to a gun shop and in less than an hour have a firearm if we pass a background check. But I do think it’s a problem that parents have improperly stored firearms and ammunition in their house and if someone has enough money and wants a firearm they can walk down to a certain part of town and buy a gun that is untraceable.

I worked late last night so when I got home the kids were already in bed. My wife warned me our daughter might ask me questions about school shootings because my wife had asked our daughter if they had drills or talked about active shooter scenarios at school. My daughter said they do not. My daughter is in 2nd grade. At her school 2nd grade is all the higher they go and next year she will be in a different building so I do not know if that is the case at all of the buildings in the district. But one thing I have seen from multiple sources was complimenting the staff at the Tennessee school on how calm and collected they were in a time of crisis. There is only one thing that can cause that calmness and focus. PRACTICE! Practice from law enforcement, school staff, students, and parents. I have no doubt that with practice and training we could have selected teachers armed in schools who would not be known to other staff, students or the public but no doubt would deter some, not all school shooters.

I also believe that todays political climate has a very negative impact on any thing that could be done legislatively to prevent mass shootings even though the safety of our schools, teachers, and students should be unanimous.

I started writing this thought early this morning and I have been sidetracked multiple times. I apologize if any of these thoughts have been said already. And I am by no means an expert on this or anything so please don’t chastise me for my thoughts. I will no doubt take your thoughts and points and use them to be open minded and change my thoughts as I see fit.

 

[okie archer]

God has been kicked out of our country, government, schools, homes, and even many so called churches. Now we are suffering the results.
What ever happened to family prayer and Bible reading? Not only Bible reading but Bible following.
Fact: If everyone obeyed the word of God there wouldn't be much if any of the following.
Broken homes
Divorce courts
Jails, prisons, or juvenile detentions
Alcoholics Anonymous
Drug rehabs
Counseling for abused children
Fetal alcohol syndrome
Bullying
Spouse abuse or battered women's shelters
Death row
Murder trials
Drunk driver deaths
Overdoses
Security guards at schools
Home security systems
Sexually Transmitted diseases
Prostitution
Embezzlement
Etc. Etc.

Hollywood, video games, anything goes mentality has about ruined our youth.

The Golden Rule. Do unto others as you would have them do to you.

2 Chronicles 7:14 If my people which are called by my , shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, AND WILL HEAL THEIR LAND.

Psalms 9:17 The wicked shall be turned into hell, AND ALL THE NATIONS THAT FORGET GOD.

Proverbs 14:34 Rightousness exalteth a nation: but sin is a reproach to any people.

I have received criticism and harsh insults for these kind of post on this site. So be it. I have also received supportive PM's. Either way this post is not about me it's about truth.

 

[elkduds]

This thinking is part of the problem. My best friend (who happens to also be a cousin) showed clear signs of several mental health challenges growing up, but his mom said psychiatrists and meds were for the weak and did nothing to get him help. Even in his twenties, his mother's judgement kept him from seeking services. Finally as he reached the bottom in his 30s he sought counseling. He was transformed and was much more successful as a husband, father and small business owner. Yet to this day his mom will still openly mock him for this in front of others. There can be no question professional counseling and appropriate meds are more effective than spanking and shame for a significant portion of our fellow humans.

The surest way to make an acute (one time) mental episode into a chronic (ongoing, lifelong) mental illness is to leave it untreated. Bonus points for shaming, stigmatizing people who have such challenges. My job is to help these people in their effort to recover.

 

[corndog1]

Trying to convince every kid that they are victims of even the tiniest of life's problems doesn't help either. I need stead of raising problem solvers we are raising victims

 

[belshawelk]

This thinking is part of the problem. My best friend (who happens to also be a cousin) showed clear signs of several mental health challenges growing up, but his mom said psychiatrists and meds were for the weak and did nothing to get him help. Even in his twenties, his mother's judgement kept him from seeking services. Finally as he reached the bottom in his 30s he sought counseling. He was transformed and was much more successful as a husband, father and small business owner. Yet to this day his mom will still openly mock him for this in front of others. There can be no question professional counseling and appropriate meds are more effective than spanking and shame for a significant portion of our fellow humans.

Let me clarify. I am not saying people do not struggle with depression or anxiety. I am calling out those who use it as an excuse when they do not. Real problems and real victims need real solutions. But there had to be some reality these days. It had be one an excuse which only hurts those in need more. I am just have no sympathy for those who refuse to try and take care of themselves or lazy people.

 

[cwitherow]

God has been kicked out of our country, government, schools, homes, and even many so called churches. Now we are suffering the results.
What ever happened to family prayer and Bible reading? Not only Bible reading but Bible following.
Fact: If everyone obeyed the word of God there wouldn't be much if any of the following.
Broken homes
Divorce courts
Jails, prisons, or juvenile detentions
Alcoholics Anonymous
Drug rehabs
Counseling for abused children
Fetal alcohol syndrome
Bullying
Spouse abuse or battered women's shelters
Death row
Murder trials
Drunk driver deaths
Overdoses
Security guards at schools
Home security systems
Sexually Transmitted diseases
Prostitution
Embezzlement
Etc. Etc.

Hollywood, video games, anything goes mentality has about ruined our youth.

The Golden Rule. Do unto others as you would have them do to you.

2 Chronicles 7:14 If my people which are called by my , shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, AND WILL HEAL THEIR LAND.

Psalms 9:17 The wicked shall be turned into hell, AND ALL THE NATIONS THAT FORGET GOD.

Proverbs 14:34 Rightousness exalteth a nation: but sin is a reproach to any people.

I have received criticism and harsh insults for these kind of post on this site. So be it. I have also received supportive PM's. Either way this post is not about me it's about truth.

And what is your solution for anyone who is not a Christian and does not follow those same teachings?