I can't believe they can't fill these positions!

[rogerthat]

I would have took the job but it’s not telework eligible. If I could warden while drinking cocktails in Cabo we would have a deal.

 

[more_cowbell]

I think this was on another thread and may be why there’s an opening or difficulty filling the position:

In a survey conducted by the Legislative Audit Division, half of wardens who responded said they believed they had experienced retaliatory behavior or intimidation from the division chief’s office over the previous five years. The audit also said many wardens complained of what they believed were unfair hiring and promotion practices, and that the department needed to do more to document hirings and ensure proper procedures are followed.

Montana FWP promises action after audit indicated game wardens feared retaliation

On Thursday, Montana Fish, Wildlife and Parks leaders told a legislative committee they’re taking steps to improve the relationship between game wardens and department administrators.

www.ktvh.com

Not surprising theres an alleged disconnect between front line employees and administrators

 

[Bowmannate2000]

Longevity is only way to get a pay raise, takes a certain type person!

Seems to be the opposite to me. A lot of times the only way to get a pay raise is to job hop every couple years. Most employers don't give raises to loyal employees. I think they count on the fact that people don't want to go though the hassle of finding a new job.

 

[4ohSick]

I'll bet it's mostly just picking up roadkill. If you are a true meateater, that might be a decent benefit.

MDT and County Maintenance pick up roadkill. My grandpa was a game warden years ago in Butte and he caught an armed man he’d busted for poaching stalking his house to attack his family. $56k to work 24/7 where nearly every citation you issue is someone who has already committed a crime with a weapon - no thanks.

And teachers are also criminally underpaid, especially when the training now includes wrapping yourself over your students in a corner if an active shooter enters the room.

 

[4ohSick]

Get the unions out of government employment and pay the employees the same wages as private sector. It's a win win all the way around .

Pretty sure wardens aren’t unionized or they’d pay better. More like get the legislature out of the pay structure because they have to approve cost-of-living adjustments.

 

[JLDemo]

It was my dream to be a warden all through my early adulthood. I even went to the first year of school for it last year. But, I work in the Nuclear Missile Field for the Airforce and make almost $40 per hour working 4-10s and having every friday-sunday off... including 4 weeks of vacation I can use whenever I want. Pretty hard to pass that up for a 4 year degree that pays half of what I make now.

Rivet mile?

Same boat here, went to college before the military, interned with the Oklahoma Game & Fish for two semesters. Loved every second. But I'll be damned if every time I would want to be in the field or on the boat, we were working. That was huge factor why I didn't pursue. I still think about it, but i have 14 yrs left before I hit 30 with the feds at age 51.

 

[Wyhunter]

Rivet mile?

Same boat here, went to college before the military, interned with the Oklahoma Game & Fish for two semesters. Loved every second. But I'll be damned if every time I would want to be in the field or on the boat, we were working. That was huge factor why I didn't pursue. I still think about it, but i have 14 yrs left before I hit 30 with the feds at age 51.

Your retirement will be pretty nice at that point, especially if you make it to 61. Yeah, its tough to be working when you want to be having fun in the woods.

I work for civil engineering sites. We are a little division that only works in the missile field. I have my master hvac license, so I take care of all of the MAF's.

 

[BackofBeyond]

It was my dream to be a warden all through my early adulthood. I even went to the first year of school for it last year. But, I work in the Nuclear Missile Field for the Airforce and make almost $40 per hour working 4-10s and having every friday-sunday off... including 4 weeks of vacation I can use whenever I want. Pretty hard to pass that up for a 4 year degree that pays half of what I make now.

I was the same way growing up, then a friend of my dad's who was a C.O. for IDF&G had a long, truthful talk with me. Turns out I was making more as an 18 year old carpenter then he was as a 50 year old. He also dissuaded me because of my temper, but the money part was the biggest thing in my mind.

Will always be grateful to him for having that crucial conversation with me when I was a kid. Saved me a lot of money pursuing the Wildlife Bio degree I was planning on pursuing.

 

[Wyhunter]

I was the same way growing up, then a friend of my dad's who was a C.O. for IDF&G had a long, truthful talk with me. Turns out I was making more as an 18 year old carpenter then he was as a 50 year old. He also dissuaded me because of my temper, but the money part was the biggest thing in my mind.

Will always be grateful to him for having that crucial conversation with me when I was a kid. Saved me a lot of money pursuing the Wildlife Bio degree I was planning on pursuing.

Those interactions and assets to rely on at an early age are so underrated. Its awesome that you had someones brain to pick and someone who shot straight with you.

 

[TOGIE]

i make a pretty respectable wage sitting in a chair and mostly just dickin around in excel every day.

i spend a lot of time thinking about how many other things i'd be much happier doing for much less money.

and i'm not yet discounting them.

 

[LukeDuke]

Seems to be the opposite to me. A lot of times the only way to get a pay raise is to job hop every couple years. Most employers don't give raises to loyal employees. I think they count on the fact that people don't want to go though the hassle of finding a new job.

When I’m interviewing someone and I see multiple “job hops”, I dig deeper into the reasoning. Could be warranted or it could be a huge red flag.

I’ve been with the same employer for 23 yrs and have received a raise and bonus every yr. Effort, behavior, corp performance(financially and from a safety standpoint) all determine how big the compensation reward is. Being fair and sharing the wealth with the employees goes a long way in creating and maintaining a loyal/winning culture.

I do get your point about not wanting to start over or interview again, especially the deeper you go into ones career. I guess some of that depends on how specialized your role is.

 

[Nick87]

Being fair and sharing the wealth with the employees goes a long way in creating and maintaining a loyal/winning culture.

Those types of employers/managers are hard to come by ime. But yes there are some and it sure made going to work for them a lot easier imo.

 

[atlas]

If you're ready to get on the polygraph and tell them you've never even thought about weed and that you haven't peed outside then you can do it.

 

[nontyp]

Is it me or is this job posting not the most encouraging? I'd probably re-word this if they actually want to hire anyone.

It made me smile.

HELENA – Do you like to be in the Montana outdoors working with hunters, anglers and boaters? Montana Fish, Wildlife & Parks is seeking applicants to fill nine game warden positions.

“It’s one of those jobs where It’s not even a job,” said Region 6 Sergeant FWP Game Warden Andy Matakis. “It’s a way of life. It’s being that person in your community that people can rely on. No two days in this job are the same.”

To watch Matakis at work, click here.

To become a game warden in Montana, applicants must successfully complete the Montana Law Enforcement Academy Basic Course or have equivalent training.

Typically, a game warden is available 24 hours a day, seven days a week to support field staff, respond to the public and address wildlife issues. Job demands are heaviest during weekends and holidays.

Wardens must be in excellent physical health. The position requires frequent climbing, bending, pushing, pulling, dragging and lifting. Duties include working with sick or injured wildlife; removing illegal kills; trapping and relocating animals; backpacking; horseback patrols; and operating boats, snowmobiles and OHVs. Good communication skills are also necessary as use of force incidents can occur. Wardens must be in excellent mental condition as they must deal with all types of personalities and stress levels.

Game wardens can experience potentially dangerous interactions with criminals while enforcing the law and can be subject to assault and encounter hazardous substances. Because of these potential situations, good communication skills and strong mental health are necessary.

“I like to say you earn your badge every day,” Matakis said. “It’s not something I take lightly.”

Women and minorities are under-represented in this job category and are strongly encouraged to apply. Successful applicants will be subject to a full background investigation.

For more information, go to fwp.mt.gov/aboutfwp/enforcement/warden-hiring. To apply, click here. Applications will be accepted through Jan. 1, 2024.

With those requirements it sounds like a job that should be paying $150k+. I bet they’d get some good candidates if the number was even close to that.

 

[Bowmannate2000]

When I’m interviewing someone and I see multiple “job hops”, I dig deeper into the reasoning. Could be warranted or it could be a huge red flag.

I’ve been with the same employer for 23 yrs and have received a raise and bonus every yr. Effort, behavior, corp performance(financially and from a safety standpoint) all determine how big the compensation reward is. Being fair and sharing the wealth with the employees goes a long way in creating and maintaining a loyal/winning culture.

I do get your point about not wanting to start over or interview again, especially the deeper you go into ones career. I guess some of that depends on how specialized your role is.

Yeah, I'd love to find an employer like that. I have worked for 3 employers in 20 years. Two in the last 6 years since moving into the IT field. I think I need to find a larger employer with room to move up. I've been working in smaller companies in IT and they don't usually have a lot of positions to move up in the company.

In my career, I think staying in one place too long has been to my own financial detriment.

 

[WanderWoman]

Pretty sure wardens aren’t unionized or they’d pay better. More like get the legislature out of the pay structure because they have to approve cost-of-living adjustments.

There is a warden union in MT

 

[WanderWoman]

They would get more applicants if they dropped the B.A requirement

Wholeheartedly disagree with the idea of dropping the degree requirement. In talking with most wardens, they think it’s important too. As a group of people on here who care deeply about the resource and hunting, why on earth would we want less-qualified applicants?

Warden jobs are so much more diverse than a typical officer’s or deputy’s. They fill the roles of patrolling, investigating, bringing cases, helping with resource management, etc. They don’t have the same amount of help that perhaps other members of law enforcement in the community have, so they need to be better at everything to account for it.

The solution is simple—pay them more.

 

[SAJ-99]

Wholeheartedly disagree with the idea of dropping the degree requirement. In talking with most wardens, they think it’s important too. As a group of people on here who care deeply about the resource and hunting, why on earth would we want less-qualified applicants?

Warden jobs are so much more diverse than a typical officer’s or deputy’s. They fill the roles of patrolling, investigating, bringing cases, helping with resource management, etc. They don’t have the same amount of help that perhaps other members of law enforcement in the community have, so they need to be better at everything to account for it.

The solution is simple—pay them more.

Exactly. I also notice that all the people on here with public-sector jobs know when they can retire, almost to the day. I mean, I don;t blame them, but it ain't exactly a selling point to new applicants.

"Young people just don't want to work anymore" says 55yo guy working for the state knowing he can retire with full benefits in 1747days.

 

[TheTone]

Exactly. I also notice that all the people on here with public-sector jobs know when they can retire, almost to the day. I mean, I don;t blame them, but it ain't exactly a selling point to new applicants.

"Young people just don't want to work anymore" says 55yo guy working for the state knowing he can retire with full benefits in 1747days.

I’ve worked with people I always thought were pretty responsible that also waited close to a decade before they even thought about investing into a differed comp system. They just kinda thought the state retirement system would be more than enough I guess?

 

[Ben Lamb]

Exactly. I also notice that all the people on here with public-sector jobs know when they can retire, almost to the day. I mean, I don;t blame them, but it ain't exactly a selling point to new applicants.

"Young people just don't want to work anymore" says 55yo guy working for the state knowing he can retire with full benefits in 1747days.

I'd disagree. Quality of life also means knowing your retirement is going to be taken care of. Public Service jobs are some of the few left that offer pensions for retirees. That's a massive selling point in terms of getting quality professionals to sign up to serve in Gov't. So is the healthcare package. Most folks moving into service, or wanting to, are thinking about those issues as well.

@WanderWoman nailed it in both posts. Reducing requirements means reducing quality. Pay them more. Wages are not competitive any where in state gov't. In MT, as elsewhere, you have appropriators who are more interested in reducing gov't spending at all costs rather than investing wisely in small gov't. The Warden's Union also serves the Highway Patrol troopers & Prison guards as well, IIRC.

When you compare FWP's vacancies to other states or even other agencies within MT, their troubles are not singular.

Legislators need to make these jobs competitive again.