Horses in elk country
- Thread starter Buckskinbob
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RoughCountry
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Hunting on horseback to me is the only way to go if you know how to ride. We will leave camp early and ride until we hear some bugles then tie them up and start hunting.
A good mountain horse will stand tied to a tree for hours. If we kill an elk we pack out on the horses and just lead them or field dress them, hang the 1/4’s in a tree for the night and come back in the morning with some pack horses.
If you are an experienced rider and know how to control a horse it is the way to go. If you are just starting out a horse has a way of testing you. If you get in really steep, thick, nasty terrain you might have to get off and lead him.
Horse hunting is a great way to get in where most people won’t or can’t go but it really makes a big difference if you know how to ride a horse before you get back in there on one. Too many good horses around to be riding a bad one!
A good mountain horse will stand tied to a tree for hours. If we kill an elk we pack out on the horses and just lead them or field dress them, hang the 1/4’s in a tree for the night and come back in the morning with some pack horses.
If you are an experienced rider and know how to control a horse it is the way to go. If you are just starting out a horse has a way of testing you. If you get in really steep, thick, nasty terrain you might have to get off and lead him.
Horse hunting is a great way to get in where most people won’t or can’t go but it really makes a big difference if you know how to ride a horse before you get back in there on one. Too many good horses around to be riding a bad one!
Salmonchaser
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I enjoy it when there's a wrangler. Hell, the daughter rode her own horse into the Eagle Caps when she was three. For some reason she's not interested in wrangling for us. Something about only thing worse than smelly boys is really old smelly boys.
OntarioHunter
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Have you seen Whites loggers? Their "spring heel" is pretty much the same as a riding heel on cowboy boots. I don't think you'll find a thicker sole on any hiking boot! I probably put hundreds of miles in the saddle with those boots and stirrups without once coming close to having my boot go through. I don't think it's possible.
I wear a 15 narrow, never wore the Packer style boot either, I also wore logging style boots that I could hike all day in if necessary. I bought oversized stirrups for my saddle , which fit my winter boots mo better!
Salmonchaser
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As noted by several on this thread, horse wrecks can ruin a weekend or a hunting season, wrecks are more common it seams this time of year. We are out of town this week but we're still notified via group page for our search and rescue team of a horse wreck 8 miles from the trail head. Came in at 1700 hours. Long way for the team to go. Be a long night for the injured.
Buckskinbob
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Hopefully they are gonna be alright
ida homer
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Haha, you gotta REALLY like horses to hunt with em. You gotta like arena riding, you gotta like doing ground work in a round pen, you gotta enjoy trail riding and you gotta not lose your shit when one won’t get in the trailer at midnight in the dark. I’ve only had horses for 3 years, I did not grow up with them. But boy have I learned some phucking lessons in 3 short years.
Google Carson James. He’s the most no bullshit and the best at explaining the way equines think.
There is never an “all of a sudden” (Unless you jump a cat or a grizzly). 99% of all wrecks are preventable. Wrecks happen because the horse wasn’t “sure” and you pushed him past his sureness level.
It’s okay to do that if and only if, you’re a confident rider that isn’t afraid to square up with one that’s being a shithead and ride out a buck or handle a bolt, etc. If you’re a beginner, like me, you are best served spending good money on stock that are really damn “sure” about a lot of things. Don’t try to push a mule beyond what he’s sure about, you’ll lose. Do not buy a $500 horse if you’re a beginner.
Horses do not, under any circumstance, lie. They are as honest as anything put on this earth, so it’s mandatory that you learn to read their body language and avoid picking fights that part time, half ass cowboys like us, damn sure aren’t gonna win. That’s what I love so much about equines. They’re honest. They’re as honest as the day is long. They will tell you in no uncertain terms where they are sure, what they are okay with and what they are not okay with. So once you learn to toe that line and recognize their level of “sureness” about something (elk blood, fly spray, tarps, creek crossings, bear hydes, a crouper, etc), you will avoid nearly every wreck long before it happens and they will start to trust you.
I’ve logged about 125 trail miles since May. My mule is legged up, but I’m damn sure not with this dad bod
Google Carson James. He’s the most no bullshit and the best at explaining the way equines think.
There is never an “all of a sudden” (Unless you jump a cat or a grizzly). 99% of all wrecks are preventable. Wrecks happen because the horse wasn’t “sure” and you pushed him past his sureness level.
It’s okay to do that if and only if, you’re a confident rider that isn’t afraid to square up with one that’s being a shithead and ride out a buck or handle a bolt, etc. If you’re a beginner, like me, you are best served spending good money on stock that are really damn “sure” about a lot of things. Don’t try to push a mule beyond what he’s sure about, you’ll lose. Do not buy a $500 horse if you’re a beginner.
Horses do not, under any circumstance, lie. They are as honest as anything put on this earth, so it’s mandatory that you learn to read their body language and avoid picking fights that part time, half ass cowboys like us, damn sure aren’t gonna win. That’s what I love so much about equines. They’re honest. They’re as honest as the day is long. They will tell you in no uncertain terms where they are sure, what they are okay with and what they are not okay with. So once you learn to toe that line and recognize their level of “sureness” about something (elk blood, fly spray, tarps, creek crossings, bear hydes, a crouper, etc), you will avoid nearly every wreck long before it happens and they will start to trust you.
I’ve logged about 125 trail miles since May. My mule is legged up, but I’m damn sure not with this dad bod
bisblue
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I have llamas, horses scare me just being around them doing trail work.
I think Robby Denning talks about lightweight horse packing in his mule deer book.
I think Robby Denning talks about lightweight horse packing in his mule deer book.
I think that as a person gets older it is common to look to horses to extend your range and time in the backcountry. In many cases I believe that they have higher odds of shortening your hunting career than extending it. That being said I am not ready to get rid of mine quite yet, but he really hasn't extended my range. It used to be that there was a great advantage to going deep but now a days the deeper you go the less game there is. In my area at least.
Lately I find myself killing elk where I don't need a horse or often where I can't take a horse because of terrain or blow down, or because you can't get a horse trailer near as close as you can drive a truck. I have had horses off and on for many years and we used to pack some elk out with them. My son and I have had a horse each for the last 5 years and while my family has killed 12 or more elk during that time, 1 horse has packed 1/2 of an elk 1 time. They have packed sheds and have taken us places that we wouldn't have walked though.
Bottom line is horses are not nearly the advantage that they were when I was a kid. You just have to like having them. This is in the area that I hunt, I am sure that there are still places where they are very desirable.
Lately I find myself killing elk where I don't need a horse or often where I can't take a horse because of terrain or blow down, or because you can't get a horse trailer near as close as you can drive a truck. I have had horses off and on for many years and we used to pack some elk out with them. My son and I have had a horse each for the last 5 years and while my family has killed 12 or more elk during that time, 1 horse has packed 1/2 of an elk 1 time. They have packed sheds and have taken us places that we wouldn't have walked though.
Bottom line is horses are not nearly the advantage that they were when I was a kid. You just have to like having them. This is in the area that I hunt, I am sure that there are still places where they are very desirable.
There is a guy from Penna that did a video about 5 friends/people he knew that were very experienced riders that came to tragic ends. All 5 were killed in some type of never anticipated accident. You should try to find that video and watch it carefully. Shtz can happen, no matter what you do.Haha, you gotta REALLY like horses to hunt with em. You gotta like arena riding, you gotta like doing ground work in a round pen, you gotta enjoy trail riding and you gotta not lose your shit when one won’t get in the trailer at midnight in the dark. I’ve only had horses for 3 years, I did not grow up with them. But boy have I learned some phucking lessons in 3 short years.
Google Carson James. He’s the most no bullshit and the best at explaining the way equines think.
There is never an “all of a sudden” (Unless you jump a cat or a grizzly). 99% of all wrecks are preventable. Wrecks happen because the horse wasn’t “sure” and you pushed him past his sureness level.
It’s okay to do that if and only if, you’re a confident rider that isn’t afraid to square up with one that’s being a shithead and ride out a buck or handle a bolt, etc. If you’re a beginner, like me, you are best served spending good money on stock that are really damn “sure” about a lot of things. Don’t try to push a mule beyond what he’s sure about, you’ll lose. Do not buy a $500 horse if you’re a beginner.
Horses do not, under any circumstance, lie. They are as honest as anything put on this earth, so it’s mandatory that you learn to read their body language and avoid picking fights that part time, half ass cowboys like us, damn sure aren’t gonna win. That’s what I love so much about equines. They’re honest. They’re as honest as the day is long. They will tell you in no uncertain terms where they are sure, what they are okay with and what they are not okay with. So once you learn to toe that line and recognize their level of “sureness” about something (elk blood, fly spray, tarps, creek crossings, bear hydes, a crouper, etc), you will avoid nearly every wreck long before it happens and they will start to trust you.
I’ve logged about 125 trail miles since May. My mule is legged up, but I’m damn sure not with this dad bod
Well said
2rocky
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I guess for me, horses are one of many parts of the Elk Hunt I treasure most. I like the riding out of camp in the dark, seeing the sparks off the shoes, the thrill of an unanticipated jump over a down tree in the trail, the feel of a horse headed back to camp with that determined stride, as the moon climbs into the sky from the east. Walking back to my mount tied after another setup that didn't pan out and having my mount nicker at me as I come into sight is comforting.
Having my horses alert me to elk on the horizon, or allowing me to camp in a nice flat meadow near water 3 miles from where I want to be at daybreak is a luxury I miss. I feel like I can ride 2x as far on a rough trail as I could endure riding in a SXS. And the pride of packing out your elk you killed on public land, in a place you had never set foot in before, on your own horse is a dream I had from the time I bought my first rifle.
If you don't feel that connection, that pride, then horses aren't for you.
For me, taking horses works depending on the where and why.
When I haul them out there I usually use them for getting deeper in the back country each day. I e-Scout based on knowing I will have a horse and the usual distance I can cover with one in the back country. I use a highline AND hobble during the day. I also have so much blaze orange draped on the animal there is no way someone can accidentally shoot them.
At camp, I prefer to have an area that is a two level hot wire. Sometime, I start at the trailer, go out to a tree, then another two trees and back to the trailer. I leave the trailer ramp open so they can use it as a makeshift barn. If possible, I locate that where there is moving water and some grass for them to graze on. I also supplement with weed free hay and grain as needed.
Wrecks can happen anywhere. I have had wrecks with really, really good roping horses in the box. To minimize the wrecks try to "warm up" your horses - walk them, even trot them behind a truck or on a lunge line for 10 minutes. A little exercise can get them in the right mind quickly.
Someday I will do a full blown pack in of camp, but the way I have it figured that is a requirement of about 4 horses and 2 or 3 mules. My camp has a lot of crap. I could hunt with less, but part of the pleasure of elk camp to me is the comforts, and I am getting old. Sleeping on a pad on the ground sounds like torture.
Good luck and have fun.
When I haul them out there I usually use them for getting deeper in the back country each day. I e-Scout based on knowing I will have a horse and the usual distance I can cover with one in the back country. I use a highline AND hobble during the day. I also have so much blaze orange draped on the animal there is no way someone can accidentally shoot them.
At camp, I prefer to have an area that is a two level hot wire. Sometime, I start at the trailer, go out to a tree, then another two trees and back to the trailer. I leave the trailer ramp open so they can use it as a makeshift barn. If possible, I locate that where there is moving water and some grass for them to graze on. I also supplement with weed free hay and grain as needed.
Wrecks can happen anywhere. I have had wrecks with really, really good roping horses in the box. To minimize the wrecks try to "warm up" your horses - walk them, even trot them behind a truck or on a lunge line for 10 minutes. A little exercise can get them in the right mind quickly.
Someday I will do a full blown pack in of camp, but the way I have it figured that is a requirement of about 4 horses and 2 or 3 mules. My camp has a lot of crap. I could hunt with less, but part of the pleasure of elk camp to me is the comforts, and I am getting old. Sleeping on a pad on the ground sounds like torture.
Good luck and have fun.
ida homer
Well-known member
Brutal. That’s why I said 99% preventable and not 100%. Similar to getting in a car wreck on the way to the trailhead, falling off a cliff, etc. Always risk, no doubt.
As previously mentioned, horses come with inherent risks, but so do most other outdoor activities. Being cognizant of the risks is a huge benefit - almost being 'overly cautious'.
My wife's dad has been a rancher and has used horses his entire life. I lean on him for advice and follow his lead. We regularly use 4 out of the 7 horses we have (we call them the 'A-team'). They are all very experienced and easy going horses. But, they have been cowboyed and used in the summers their entire lives and used regularly hunting. That being said, they can still surprise you, just as any horse can. We always run some of the younger ones in the round pen once they are saddled, especially if they have been sitting for awhile. Helps blow some air out and get any jitters before we load them in the trailer.
For example, the bad: even using 'dead-broke' trail horses, I watched one buck my wife's friend off, she got hung up in the stirrup, and the horse kicked her out. Had to be flown to Salt Lake with some broken ribs and a detached spleen. The horse she was on was one the ranch owned and was an ex-dude ranch horse...one of the ranch hands jumped on him after the wreck, did everything he could to see if the horse would blow up again, and it just wouldn't. We think he might have gotten stung by a bee or something random like that. I mean, anything can happen...but I wouldn't let that deter you from using horses.
Also, small things can cause issues, like using headlamps around them or being saddled/loaded in the dark. Just small things to keep in mind. Also, check out trailheads/roads without the horses beforehand, to make sure you can even get a trailer to the trailhead in the first place.
They are a huge benefit, if their demeanor and experience is right, to packing in and having a really enjoyable time in the mountains.
For example, the good, maybe even slightly reckless: My father-in-law killed his WY ram 5 years ago, and we often use saddle panniers to carry game out after riding in. He loaded his ram onto the saddle panniers on my horse, and then got on her (she's a 1/2 draft, has carried up to 400+lbs with ease, before, and is just a solid mountain horse) and rode her down to camp. Quite a sight to see. FYI - I wouldn't advise anyone to ever do that, but he did because he knows her and has had her since she was 2, and it was fine. I think she actually liked it
but again, that's not a recommendation at all. Just a story.
More good : I haven't camped nearly as comfortably backpacking on foot, as I have with horses. The photo below shows what a guy can bring in on a 12mi ride into the wilderness.
If you can get your hands on experienced horses, they are amazing. But just know their limitations, and yours as a rider.
To answer some of your questions:
We usually set up a base camp, somewhere with good water and grass, if you can find it. I'd rather have good grass and good water close by than the 'ideal' tent spot.
First thing we do, if camping, is unload the horses and set up camp. We usually bring a brush to clean them off after they roll before we re-saddle them.
We also hunt from them, if the country lends itself to that, but also hunt on foot. Just depends on the location and the country you are in.
We just tie them up, unsaddled, if staying the night. I have never use hobbles personally.
ALWAYS keep your horses above you if you are letting them graze without tending the lead rope. I've seen guys tie a branch up over the trail with bailing twine in a tighter section of trail, deterring any attempts to make a break for the trailer. Reason they should be above you is you can see them and hopefully the trail is below. I've seen them try to run off for home before...that'd be no bueno.
My wife's dad has been a rancher and has used horses his entire life. I lean on him for advice and follow his lead. We regularly use 4 out of the 7 horses we have (we call them the 'A-team'). They are all very experienced and easy going horses. But, they have been cowboyed and used in the summers their entire lives and used regularly hunting. That being said, they can still surprise you, just as any horse can. We always run some of the younger ones in the round pen once they are saddled, especially if they have been sitting for awhile. Helps blow some air out and get any jitters before we load them in the trailer.
For example, the bad: even using 'dead-broke' trail horses, I watched one buck my wife's friend off, she got hung up in the stirrup, and the horse kicked her out. Had to be flown to Salt Lake with some broken ribs and a detached spleen. The horse she was on was one the ranch owned and was an ex-dude ranch horse...one of the ranch hands jumped on him after the wreck, did everything he could to see if the horse would blow up again, and it just wouldn't. We think he might have gotten stung by a bee or something random like that. I mean, anything can happen...but I wouldn't let that deter you from using horses.
Also, small things can cause issues, like using headlamps around them or being saddled/loaded in the dark. Just small things to keep in mind. Also, check out trailheads/roads without the horses beforehand, to make sure you can even get a trailer to the trailhead in the first place.
They are a huge benefit, if their demeanor and experience is right, to packing in and having a really enjoyable time in the mountains.
For example, the good, maybe even slightly reckless: My father-in-law killed his WY ram 5 years ago, and we often use saddle panniers to carry game out after riding in. He loaded his ram onto the saddle panniers on my horse, and then got on her (she's a 1/2 draft, has carried up to 400+lbs with ease, before, and is just a solid mountain horse) and rode her down to camp. Quite a sight to see. FYI - I wouldn't advise anyone to ever do that, but he did because he knows her and has had her since she was 2, and it was fine. I think she actually liked it
but again, that's not a recommendation at all. Just a story.More good : I haven't camped nearly as comfortably backpacking on foot, as I have with horses. The photo below shows what a guy can bring in on a 12mi ride into the wilderness.
If you can get your hands on experienced horses, they are amazing. But just know their limitations, and yours as a rider.
To answer some of your questions:
We usually set up a base camp, somewhere with good water and grass, if you can find it. I'd rather have good grass and good water close by than the 'ideal' tent spot.
First thing we do, if camping, is unload the horses and set up camp. We usually bring a brush to clean them off after they roll before we re-saddle them.
We also hunt from them, if the country lends itself to that, but also hunt on foot. Just depends on the location and the country you are in.
We just tie them up, unsaddled, if staying the night. I have never use hobbles personally.
ALWAYS keep your horses above you if you are letting them graze without tending the lead rope. I've seen guys tie a branch up over the trail with bailing twine in a tighter section of trail, deterring any attempts to make a break for the trailer. Reason they should be above you is you can see them and hopefully the trail is below. I've seen them try to run off for home before...that'd be no bueno.
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Mallardsx2
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I don't do horses.
Dangerous at both ends and crafty in the middle.
No thanks.
Dangerous at both ends and crafty in the middle.
No thanks.
OntarioHunter
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Horses have personality, like all living things. 4x4 and SxS are just inanimate machines. Personally, I am attracted to experiencing life with personality. It's why I prefer hunting rather than watching a movie. Real life rather than artificial creations. I never know what will happen when I'm hunting, and yes, to some extent when riding a horse. Maybe I don't know what the end of the movie will be, but does it matter? No. I'm not saying one should dress in black pajamas and jog on the interstate at night, but don't be afraid to experience the variety of life just because there's a teeny bit of risk involved.
Adventurous Alex
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I love using horses for hunting. They do come with the added work around camp, but better meals can make up for that! I primarily use them for getting in to deeper country, then I leave them at camp and hunt on foot from there. With elk, they are a game changer for getting meat out! I do not mind backpacking hunting for mule deer, but nobody wants to backpack an elk out 10 miles or more unless you have 7 great buddies willing to help you do it. They test my patience at times, but maybe it will improve my character. That's how I look at it. Happy Hunting!
Well, I'll know in a few days if Butter Bean is sold. If not, I got him at a new trainer that is really good. He has a great temperament. No bad barn behaviors, loves to be groomed, really loves to jump in the arena, gets along with the other horses, loads easily, and loves the kids. He about 9 yrs old now. His show name is Lucky With Ladies. I will miss him when he's gone. I think that when I got him he was suffering from mistreatment. He was from a Texas ranch, and apparently cowboys can be pretty rough and so he was very spooky; any movement around his face made him crazy. Not anymore. I think the fact that he's being treated so well the past 9 months and gotten lots of love by me and Maddie has paid dividends big time. But talk about the expenses!! It's tough when you're not riding them, and I don't have kids. This horse will be great as a school horse. I wish I had had more experience. I think my trainer also dropped the ball in guiding me.
Update on Butter Bean: Mr. Bean was being worked out in the round pen late yesterday afternoon and he decided to try and jump the 5' or so fence to go have a beer with his buddy (another quarterhorse in the next stall). He only got his front legs over, and ended ups with a big gash. Nothing life threatening. Got the Vet bill this morning for $721, and have contacted his insurance company. Yikes. So Orlando Equine has 3-5 gorgeous young Vets servicing horses. All of them highly qualified. You young guys need to pay these very attractive ladies a visit. Butter Bean was in good hands.
Update on Butter Bean: Mr. Bean was being worked out in the round pen late yesterday afternoon and he decided to try and jump the 5' or so fence to go have a beer with his buddy (another quarterhorse in the next stall). He only got his front legs over, and ended ups with a big gash. Nothing life threatening. Got the Vet bill this morning for $721, and have contacted his insurance company. Yikes. So Orlando Equine has 3-5 gorgeous young Vets servicing horses. All of them highly qualified. You young guys need to pay these very attractive ladies a visit. Butter Bean was in good hands.
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