Help me understand these loads

[Addicting]

Sounds like the shoulders aren't bumped back enough.

In not sure what that means.

 

[1_pointer]

Well I just got off the phone with Legendary Arms Works, they asked me to send it back to them and are sending me a shipping label. The problem is that when using the Norma Brass the bold wouldn't cycle cleanly and would get jammed as the back of the casing tries to slide up the bolt face. In a rapid motion it wont jamb but you cannot use the bolt smoothly. I took and ran the Hornady rounds thru it that were tight and it doesn't do it as noticeable but there are fine burrs on the casing. I was wondering if this was just a break in issue. After talking to them about the group size, the feeding issue, and how the rounds come back with burrs, they wanted to go back thru it and possibly rebarrel it. I will ask their Gunsmith to send the lands length measurement back with it.

BTW I measured those two Accubond rounds and surprisingly the good round measured 2.803 and the tight round measured 2.802 for OAL. I double checked, had my neighbor double check and the one we had troubles with was def smaller OAL than the one that cycled fine.

OAL is mostly only important for fitting it your magazine. The info you want is the distance to the ogive, which is why the Stoney Point tool was suggested above. Due to the shape of the pointy end of the bullet, a bullet can have a longer OAL and be farther from the lands.

Shoulders is referring to the fat to skinny junction on the case.

 

[N2TRKYS]

Personally, I would just shoot the Fusions before I went back and forth with handloads that had to be mailed to me.

 

[Addicting]

I'm lost and don't know how this all ties together. How does the shoulder on the casing cause the rim to not slide up onto the bolt all the way? From what I have read Norma Brass is better than Hornady. Plus I am getting burrs on the Hornady rims.

Or is because the shoulder/ ramp in the barrel isn't cut right and it is not guiding the brass in properly to cause too steep of an angle for the rim to slide up the bolt face smoothly.

Just to put some humor to this my buddy called just to tell me with out him here to fix me I am F'd up like a football bat. Thought that was very nice of him.

 

[Addicting]

here is where it jammes up at. here is the round not coming up in the bolt.

 

[Bob Vetter]

Personally, I would just shoot the Fusions before I went back and forth with handloads that had to be mailed to me.

+1 ...

 

[Millsworks]

Can't believe this thread is still in the same situation.
If I had a rifle and a bucket full of high end custom, super duper, don't work wright ammo ,that still can't give at least 1 inch groups at a hundred yards , I'd stop shooting it and find someone to look the whole situation over.

If the factory ammo shoots ok and has no feed or ejection issues then the action is fine.
If I want custom ammo, then I load it myself.
If I didn't reload and wanted custom ammo I'd find a local to load it for me.

Buy some more factory ammo of different brands and run it through to see how it does. Save all the brass.
Look for local help if you think you need more from your ammo and if you think the action has a problem I'd get that looked at too.
Nothing worse than doing the same thing over and over and hoping for different results.
Except maybe shipping a rifle back to a company only to find there is nothing wrong with it.

 

[Addicting]

At this point I tried every thing and combo I was advised to try and then some. This rifle has an issue that I am not smart enough to figure out. Weather it's factory ammo or the hand loads from Choice. It should be laying down consistent sub MOA groups. It's free for me to ship it back and have a master gunsmith go thru it and tune it. I don't believe that is the worst choice I could of made.

 

[Millsworks]

Guess I will have to say that if I were you and had already tried figuring it out best you could, then I would ship it back too.
If there really is a problem with this rifle, I sure would like to hear about it. At the price it cost some quality control would be very expected.
Hope for your sake they can find something out to get you running the way it should.

Good luck.

 

[Addicting]

Well I heard back from them today. The guy told me how dirty it was and that he cleaned it and it shot a 3 shot 1" group after the foul shot with Hornady 143g EDL. He wondered why I sent it back. I asked him if he got the pics I sent about it jamming and said it cycled fine with the Hornady. I expressed interest in shooting the Norma and if spending that much on a rifle it should be able to cycle match grade brass smoothly. They are going to buy some of the ammo and try it and they have some extractor parts they want to change in it that they have had issues with on others.

Seeing these other threads on here with 6.5 man bun and hipster rifles shooting better for a $1000 less has me thinking I might of been better off saviving that extra money and putting it into a reloading set up.

 

[Jaeger Fischer]

I don't know is the problem. Each has its pluses and minus.

I like that the Fusions are cheap and fly good but don't like that type of bullet. The only reason I bought them was for barrel break in. I never would of thought they would shoot the tightest.

I really like the Accubonds for down range energy, penetration, and performance, but that could just be in my head. The post on here with all the critters and stories kind of sold me.

The Berger's appeal to me for distance shooting over the fall and summer. I have a large expanse of field that some coyotes need to learn lessons on if they think about crossing. Those field give me up to 1500 yards of wide open terrain. I will probably never get good enough to shoot that far but my equipment is good enough.

Personally, I would avoid the Berger for elk. I don't think they're a very sturdy bullet. I hunted one season with Bergers (.30/168gr.), shot a muley at 300 yards and the bullet came apart. The deer died, but I couldn't find a piece of that bullet bigger than a bb.

 

[Don Fischer]

Just a though but I'd check the bedding on that rifle. The group's all string horizontally a bit. Just a bit and if it was just one or two big deal. But it's every group. I'd look for a tight spot in the side of the barrel channel. may not be but I'd look just the same.

 

[Don Fischer]

Personally, I would avoid the Berger for elk. I don't think they're a very sturdy bullet. I hunted one season with Bergers (.30/168gr.), shot a muley at 300 yards and the bullet came apart. The deer died, but I couldn't find a piece of that bullet bigger than a bb.

Good run of the mill cup and core to try would be the Speer 140 gr hot core.It is a premium bullet at a non premium price!

 

[TheJason]

When you're testing new and DIFFERENT loads, how do you determine when accuracy is beginning to suffer?

You periodically shoot a control group of a load you have known and repeatable results with.

 

[TheJason]

A few thoughts:

What are you cleaning with? Is it a good solvent that will remove copper? I use Wipe Out almost exclusively, but I also only clean every 50 to 100 rounds too.

What sort of rest are you using? Front and rear sandbag?

Have you had anyone else shoot the gun to see if the results are repeatable?

 

[Addicting]

I used Hopps bore cleaner the first time and let it soak. Brushed it with a 270 brush then I ran patches thru until clean. I then used Rem oil on the bore to clean out any remaining solvent. Then patched until I didn't see any sign of oil. I didn't really care for the Rod set up I had so I ordered a Montana Extreme rod and 6.5 brush set up with some Bore Tech Eliminator solvent for future cleaning. It had those 20 rounds down it without cleaning when I sent it in to them.

I used a lead sled and sand bags/ loaded bipod from the prone. No, I have not had anyone else shoot it, besides the guy at the factory.

 

[TheJason]

Yeah, shit can the Hoppes. I haven't used the Bore Tech, but you should be able to look in the bore and see how clean it's getting. Are you shooting a fouling shot or two?

Shit can the lead sled. Bags only. Make sure you're not "leaning on the gun" from the prone.

What is the twist rate on the barrel? It should be 1:8" or so. If it's not, that might be why it's not liking the 140 grainers. I think if you went with an 130-140 grain Accubond or Scirrocco you could easily kill anything that walks in North America.

 

[Addicting]

That was the plan to ditch the lead sled. I read that article about squaring up with the rifle in your post. I picked up a leather rabbit ear rear bag and was going to use the sand bags. I was leaning towards ditching Choice Ammo and just running the Norma 130g. Prob then was it wouldn't cycle that brass, that's ultimately why I sent it back. It should cycle all brass especially match grade. Hopefully when they replace the extractor and do some testing with it they can figure what it is hanging up on.

 

[mtmuley]

Sell it. mtmuley

 

[TheJason]

Sell it. mtmuley

That would be my next step if it's not right when it comes back.