Griz attack

MoGreen said:
Imagine how bad it would be without bear spray?

They should outlaw bear spray and then incorporate your rule - any bear that kills is exterminated. At the rate they're going, they'll all be dead in just a few years.
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Bea spray is very effective. I am really wondering if the stuff he had was expired. I got into a conversation with a doctor in Cody a year or so ago. He said that after three years, you had better replace it. It should have at least slowed her. A pistol will just piss her off, unless you are some kind of Wyatt Earp. His pistol did him zero good. Grizzlies react very quickly and few people can shoot a pistol well enough to matter.

I would still put my trust in bear spray (new), over a pistol.
 
Here is a video with an expired can of bear spray (at the bottom after discussing the other two attacks)
http://www.spokesman.com/blogs/outd...tana-bowhunters-injured-grizzly-bear-attacks/

And this lady in Canada (last month) was attacked with two children with her. She had spray but it was expired and it barely worked (shot out a weak stream). But worked enough nonetheless.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/grizzly-bear-attack-kootenays-1.3744936

So for gods sakes - make sure your bear spray isn't expired!
 
MoGreen,

I'll avoid any humor or sarcasm as I offended you last time with it. However, I would ask you to take note at how many folks that are speaking in support of the great bears actually live in and hunt in grizzly country. It's an intangible that some of us embrace.

Hunting bears won't make them more afraid of us. My uncle was hunting in the Brooks Range of Alaska years ago, and they saw a grizzly from a distance of about 400 yards. When the bear saw them, it immediately began loping towards them. They finally turned it at a distance of about 60 yards with several shots in the dirt with rifles.

I for one don't want my wilderness sterile. I enjoy and embrace being able to step off the grid into an area where I have no human contact, no technology, no guarantee of survival, and I know that I'm not the biggest and baddest creature on the block. If you don't, then there are plenty of areas for you to hunt where that isn't the case.

The danger is not nearly as grave as you would make it out to be. I've spent hundreds of days in grizzly country with only one negative encounter, and that was completely my fault. They are bears, doing what bears do, and part of what makes the wilderness experience what it is in my opinion.

YMMV.
 
MoGreen said:
When you consider there are only ~1000 of them in the lower 48 and then look at the number of deaths this decade (7 so far) and the number of attacks, they are far more dangerous than people give them credit for. Hell, death wise that is one death for every 142 grizzlies. If we factor in attacks then where would be? One attack for every 25 grizzlies? Every 10?

Hard to say. But it is a lot. And for me, that's enough evidence to suggest you are in grave danger any time you are around them. It's not just a "once in a while" thing. And it's not just "part of the adventure". Almost every week someone is posting griz attacks on here.
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Bison are the most dangerous land animal in the Yellowstone ecosystem.

I think I would rather take my chances in Grizzly Country, than be on top of a mountain in Nevada during lightning season.

I would be a lot more likely to be struck by lightning.

The numbers are really low considering all the recreation in that area. If Grizzly Bears were out to get us, then there would be more attacks.
 
MoGreen said:
You see. There it is again - Wyoming. For the low number of griz, it is an epidemic.

Thank God there were other Hunters around to help him.
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Grizzly numbers are not as low as you think they are, hence the push to delist them. While grizzly populations are not huge from an overall perspective, they are relatively condensed into two prime areas of habitat. Odds are pretty good that there are a couple thousand grizzly bears in the lower 48.

The grave danger/epidemic mantra you are stating is grossly over exaggerated. I've spent hundreds of hours in grizzly country, with ONE negative experience that was entirely of my own fault.
 
Show me plenty of people hunted and attacked by grizzly bears.

Show me the evidence that a sow and cubs will travel to an elk call or a gun shot.

2 of these recent attacks were a sow with cubs and the other is undetermined.

There is so much unjustified fear mongering with Bears, but I haven't seen anything that suggests they should be feared.

They should definitely by respected, but no feared - especially to the point of 'killing them all.'
 
I never said "hunting people" so I don't know where that's coming from. That's been stated a couple times on here and I never said any such thing. You're the ones exaggerating. I'm just simply giving facts. And if you don't think from the number of attacks that have been happening in the last few years that they're becoming a problem, then that's your business. Good luck hunting. Be safe. I won't be where they are and that sucks for the communities around there that rely on hunting season to make it through the year.

And for the record, I've lived out west for a few years and I've gone out with the hunt for over 20 years. The fact I'm from Back East has nothing to do with this. The "nothing to worry about" demeanor towards grizzly bears does not match the facts.
 
I live, hunt & work in grizz country. Would be damned lonesome out there without them.

Glad he's okay. Everyone stay alert & stick to your hunt buddy.
 
I spend a considerable time in the GYE much of it alone. I rate the hazards in this order.

Car accident to or from trailhead- about 135 killed on MT roads ytd

Lightning- if you've ever laid in an aluminum pole tent above tree line in a Beartooth storm, you know what I mean.

Other weather- freak summer wet snow, wind, heavy fog, etc. I'm prepared for anything but every year people die from this.

Falling- watched my partner catch himself with iceax seconds from death or serious injury two weeks ago on a sheep hunt

Then other humans and/or bears.

Don't get me wrong, it can be spooky and you have to be alert but there is not a grizzly waiting to kill you around every tree. My hunting partner jumped one in the brush a week ago today and it ram as fast as possible away from him.
 
Seven dead in a decade is not that many. Less than one person per year. Rather than look at low bear numbers and say that is high, look at high people numbers and say that is low. I was taught in school that the food chain is a pyramid and the further up on it a species was, the fewer individual members there should be. Yet we are at the top and there is a metric shit ton of us in the woods. Bass ackwards.

We have the ability to kill everything. And I mean everything. Maybe we should stand down a little bit and learn to walk with respect.

And before I hear it, I'd just like to say that "How would like it if . . ." is not a logical argument. Of course I wouldn't like it if it happened to me or mine. But that doesn't mean I outlaw guns, smooth out all those dangerous cliffs, have the widow-makers cut down in the forest, etc.

I've patrolled at night, in grizzly country, without light or night vision cheaters. I've found bear and even trailed them for a bit. The whole skill set to hone is to not be noticed. It's the grey man directive, but in the forest. If you fail, well, it's the risk. But it will really improve your hunting. I do carry Counter Assault but I've only used it once, on two young black bear, on my front porch, at home, buck naked, in the middle of the night. I thought seeing me naked would scare them off but it didn't. They were chowing down on some garbage I left on the porch. The spray worked like a charm, although they ripped a whole in wire fence trying to get away.
 
jryoung said:
Hundreds of thousands of acres and hundreds of thousands of visits to grizzly country and you think it's an epidemic? You're just trolling now.
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Millions. Millions of visitors. Glacier sees about 2 million & Yellowstone about 3. That doesn't take in to account public lands. So, prolly like 7 million per year.

7 deaths per 70 million is pretty good odds.
 
Ben Lamb said:
Millions. Millions of visitors. Glacier sees about 2 million & Yellowstone about 3. That doesn't take in to account public lands. So, prolly like 7 million per year.

7 deaths per 70 million is pretty good odds.
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I agree with you 100%. Just playing devils advocate though, most of those folks don't get out of the damn car. Probably a good thing. :confused:
 
Ben Lamb said:
Millions. Millions of visitors. Glacier sees about 2 million & Yellowstone about 3. That doesn't take in to account public lands. So, prolly like 7 million per year.

7 deaths per 70 million is pretty good odds.
Click to expand...

Those people are not hunting and you have no idea how many of those people ever Venture off the road or ever Venture off the road very far. 70 million people that visited those parks you have no idea how many of those people ever got off of asphalt. It's also kind of hard to walk around hunting with bear bells on Yelling "hey bear" the whole time.
 
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James Riley said:
Seven dead in a decade is not that many. Less than one person per year. Rather than look at low bear numbers and say that is high, look at high people numbers and say that is low. I was taught in school that the food chain is a pyramid and the further up on it a species was, the fewer individual members there should be. Yet we are at the top and there is a metric shit ton of us in the woods. Bass ackwards.

We have the ability to kill everything. And I mean everything. Maybe we should stand down a little bit and learn to walk with respect.

And before I hear it, I'd just like to say that "How would like it if . . ." is not a logical argument. Of course I wouldn't like it if it happened to me or mine. But that doesn't mean I outlaw guns, smooth out all those dangerous cliffs, have the widow-makers cut down in the forest, etc.

I've patrolled at night, in grizzly country, without light or night vision cheaters. I've found bear and even trailed them for a bit. The whole skill set to hone is to not be noticed. It's the grey man directive, but in the forest. If you fail, well, it's the risk. But it will really improve your hunting. I do carry Counter Assault but I've only used it once, on two young black bear, on my front porch, at home, buck naked, in the middle of the night. I thought seeing me naked would scare them off but it didn't. They were chowing down on some garbage I left on the porch. The spray worked like a charm, although they ripped a whole in wire fence trying to get away.
Click to expand...

Thanks James. Good to know. Maybe I will hunt in grizzly country after all. I'll make sure I kill an elk in the afternoon. And then I'll pack it out after dark with no headlamp..... naked.
 
MoGreen,

Out of curiosity, did you comment on the proposed grizzly bear delisting? What exactly would you like to see done?
 
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