good hunting buddy or scab outfitter?

[2rocky]

Re; Jail time for Wyoming poacher thread

This was clearly a case of illegal outfitting/poaching, no question. How ever I'm curious where the line is when folks from out of state show up to hunt with someone in state.

I'm aware of the Resident guide affidavit process for residents accompanying non residents in wilderness areas. I'm sure we have members in Wyoming who have done swap hunts with out of state buddies.

Let's say the in state guy lines up stock, and does the grocery shopping, and tells the local meat processing guy to bill him for all the critters cut and wrap, then settles up with his buddies at the end of the hunt. They each cut him a check for say, 900 bucks to cover costs.

How soon before the outfitter in the area starts calling the good hunting buddy a SCAB outfitter?

How do we as OYO hunters defend ourselves against harassment by vindictive parties in this case?

Curious on folks viewpoint, and if they can give it without throwing the whole professional outfitting group in the fire...

Anyone been in this situation?

 

[sreekers]

I have never been in the situation, but any of my friends that have asked for help from me for hunting Wy from out of state find out pretty quick that I won't be doing it all for them.

They have to take care of the application process, and they have to take care of the meat. I would help them pack it, but it is their responsibility to transport it legally.

As far as wilderness areas go, I don't want to do paperwork like that for a hunt and know of good areas that aren't designated that.

There are plenty of outfitters in the areas that I hunt, but I never seem to run into them. Maybe I'm just not that good of a hunter but I doubt I would be bugged by them much.

 

[shoots-straight]

Re; Jail time for Wyoming poacher thread

This was clearly a case of illegal outfitting/poaching, no question. How ever I'm curious where the line is when folks from out of state show up to hunt with someone in state.

I'm aware of the Resident guide affidavit process for residents accompanying non residents in wilderness areas. I'm sure we have members in Wyoming who have done swap hunts with out of state buddies.

Let's say the in state guy lines up stock, and does the grocery shopping, and tells the local meat processing guy to bill him for all the critters cut and wrap, then settles up with his buddies at the end of the hunt. They each cut him a check for say, 900 bucks to cover costs.

How soon before the outfitter in the area starts calling the good hunting buddy a SCAB outfitter?

How do we as OYO hunters defend ourselves against harassment by vindictive parties in this case?

Curious on folks viewpoint, and if they can give it without throwing the whole professional outfitting group in the fire...

Anyone been in this situation?

I would say, you have the answers to your own question. Don't do those things you feel could put you in a bad light.

 

[Deleted member 20812]

Re; Jail time for Wyoming poacher thread

This was clearly a case of illegal outfitting/poaching, no question. How ever I'm curious where the line is when folks from out of state show up to hunt with someone in state.

I'm aware of the Resident guide affidavit process for residents accompanying non residents in wilderness areas. I'm sure we have members in Wyoming who have done swap hunts with out of state buddies.

Let's say the in state guy lines up stock, and does the grocery shopping, and tells the local meat processing guy to bill him for all the critters cut and wrap, then settles up with his buddies at the end of the hunt. They each cut him a check for say, 900 bucks to cover costs.

How soon before the outfitter in the area starts calling the good hunting buddy a SCAB outfitter?

How do we as OYO hunters defend ourselves against harassment by vindictive parties in this case?

Curious on folks viewpoint, and if they can give it without throwing the whole professional outfitting group in the fire...

Anyone been in this situation?

OYO hunters can defend themselves by never putting themselves in precarious situations. Why would you have the local cutter bill you? Have each person take care of their own bill. If you're throwing money into a kitty for costs, I'd probably keep your receipts if you're worried about it.

I used to have a good friend come hunt with me in MT from out of state. I would buy all of the feed, groceries, etc, and he'd pay me half. However, he brought his own stock so that reduces the illusion of any possible rogue outfitting. He put the meat cutter bills and taxidermist bills under his own name, I only recommended places for him. I did not pre arrange any of it.

Some states consider swapping hunts as compensation, which in turn can make it outfitting. How good of friends are you talking? You hardly know the guy, and he takes you out halibut fishing, or is it you college roommate. Whatever it is, it's gotta pass the sniff test. Keep in mind, the more stuff you do and arrange for the friends, the more it's going to appear that you are rendering services.

 

[2rocky]

JLS, I was trying to imagine the most extreme case.

I had a friend in another state that had the Outfitters board investigator walk into his office and go through his receipts from his annual hunt with his buddies. He had to show that HE paid into the kitty too before they backed off.

Granted, if I saw the same guy in my area with different groups of folks, I'd sure think he was scabbing.

 

[npaden]

I've hunted the last several years in designated wilderness area with a buddy who is a Wyoming resident. I've known him for 15 years and hunted with him the last 4 years.

The paperwork isn't tough, just a single page that you sign swearing that you aren't getting any form of compensation and you need a copy of the nonresident's hunting license.

We hunt an area that has a couple outfitters we see on a regular basis, but it is just me and my buddy each year so they haven't ever given us any problems that I know of. We have met a game warden once and he checked my license and my buddy's resident guide license and we were good.

We've never really kept very good track of who buys what though. I think I come out on the better end of things more often than not. No stock to worry about and we process our own meat so nothing on that side either. Still stinks that they have that rule though.

 

[Frenchy]

I organized a waterfowl trip last season for some resident buddies, and a co-workers two out of state brothers. Rented a place for the weekend, had two boats and a ton of gear. We had boat/trailer troubles one morning, and I was barking orders out trying to get people lined out to be on the water before light. Some college kid was also getting ready to launch and asked one of the guys if I was a guide. Got a good chuckle out of that one!

But I definately did the lions share of the work and planning, but also invested way more money into the deal than anyone else too given the boat expenses. It was just fun to get guys involved in hunting. Some might of thought it looked like an outfitted trip, but I came out way in the hole on that one.

 

[Topgun 30-06]

Wyoming doesn't even require a bunch like the Carters in TenSleep to be licensed as outfitters/guides because they were on their own private property and are exempt under the statute. I hunt near there every year and locals knew the family were a bunch of scoundrels for a long time and from what I'm hearing from my friends out there, most are happy the whole family finally got busted. The couple that has a small ranch that I hunt on sometimes even caught one of the Carter boys rustling some of their cattle on BLM land they had a grazing lease on and decided not to press charges because of the costs and time that they didn't have! The way I hear they are out West with their cattle, it's surprising they just didn't shoot the SOB! I'm not sure which one of the boys it was, but it happened one summer in the last few years.

 

[BuzzH]

I've signed off for a few hunttalkers/friends to hunt wilderness areas with me. Its not a big deal.

No money/compensation is exchanged and the resident guide license is even free.

I think that keeping all expenses seperate is the best bet. Also, unless checked by a Warden, I wouldnt let another Resident get much information out of me...none of their business if I'm legal.

 

[huntme]

the way i look at it,im not guilty of nothing,untill it goes to court,and a jurry finds me guilty of the crime.

 

[Topgun 30-06]

"the way i look at it,im not guilty of nothing,untill it goes to court,and a jury finds me guilty of the crime."

Yea, you and a jillion others have that kind of attitude on various laws on the books and that's why America is in deep shit! Great ethics you are showing there with one short sentence!!!

 

[oregonhunt]

I was living in Washington State at the time. Which is a very tightly controlled state when it comes to rules. I called fish and game to get a read on it. They said as long as no money changed hands or anything was traded for the hunt then everything else was fine. Case made was that guys will offer to do things or bring things in a regular hunt group, same can go for a swap. Bottom line I got was as long as you are not taking any sort of payment for a promised service you are fine. I did get a call back from a fishing guide though. I was swapping a salmon fishing trip on my boat for a hunt. He said I could not do that as it was illegal. I called fish and game and they said fine and then I called the Coast Guard and they said fine too. The guide had seen my advertisement on a swap hunt forum. I think he just didn't want this type thing catching on, bad for business.

Re; Jail time for Wyoming poacher thread

This was clearly a case of illegal outfitting/poaching, no question. How ever I'm curious where the line is when folks from out of state show up to hunt with someone in state.

I'm aware of the Resident guide affidavit process for residents accompanying non residents in wilderness areas. I'm sure we have members in Wyoming who have done swap hunts with out of state buddies.

Let's say the in state guy lines up stock, and does the grocery shopping, and tells the local meat processing guy to bill him for all the critters cut and wrap, then settles up with his buddies at the end of the hunt. They each cut him a check for say, 900 bucks to cover costs.

How soon before the outfitter in the area starts calling the good hunting buddy a SCAB outfitter?

How do we as OYO hunters defend ourselves against harassment by vindictive parties in this case?

Curious on folks viewpoint, and if they can give it without throwing the whole professional outfitting group in the fire...

Anyone been in this situation?