Good for you Botswana

[Dave N]

I'm not bothered by what you call trophy hunting. It's simply a vague description. Your continued declaration of neck meat and overalls is more of a problem to me. Other people here that have actually done it have claimed otherwise.

I'm out.

 

[Treeshark]

@BuzzH, you really can’t argue against the virtue of trophy hunting if you’ve ever shot a bighorn. Direct conflict of logic.

 

[np307]

I can't believe this thread has gone this long. Theres no need for a back and forth on this. I'm the only one with righteous hunting motives and everyone else is a bloodsucking insect.

 

[SAJ-99]

I would bet the 90/10 rule applies. 90% of the money ends up in about 10% of the pockets involved.

I always wondered what the Africans ate before someone sold their wildlife to out of country hunters who are nice enough to kill it the for the poor local saps.


I am all for trophy hunting, however if we are going to defend it and propagate it we better come up with better strategy.

On the positive, that means at least 10% of the people care enough to conserve a species. The percentage would be the same if the animals were poached and parts sold in a market in China. I’m not sure the result would be better of Nike opened a factory in Botswana.

You all spent 10pages arguing points in which both sides are right. It is trophy hunting and it does help conservation, at least a little. Animal viewing on a “safari” is also big business. Individuals have their own justifications. The question should be more on whether or how much it helps.

 

[BuzzH]

I'm not bothered by what you call trophy hunting. It's simply a vague description. Your continued declaration of neck meat and overalls is more of a problem to me. Other people here that have actually done it have claimed otherwise.

I'm out.

Other people that have done it and be honest about it will tell you the same thing. The meat that's worth money is not handed out to the locals, its sold to markets, that's a fact. Do some research, make a few phone calls, or talk to people that have been there and live there. I get why you're uncomfortable about it, not really the pretty picture many want it to be, reality is like that.

 

[TOGIE]

the reality is a lot of folks that go hunt africa are blood sucking insects.

a lot of folks that hunt inside the US are also blood sucking insects. I think we can all agree on that. shitty people all around and if the laws changed and people didn't have to bring home their elk quarters i think it'd be scary how many hunters would stop bringing home their elk quarters.

and i think we can all recognize many of us on this board are not those types of hunters, and generally most hunters in the US are pretty stand up ethical folks, whether they like to go to africa or not.

kumbaya mfers. kumbaya. let's move on.

 

[BuzzH]

@BuzzH, you really can’t argue against the virtue of trophy hunting if you’ve ever shot a bighorn. Direct conflict of logic.

Nobody is arguing against trophy hunting, only about being honest about it, or more precisely the dishonesty about it.

I've shot a bighorn that was no shot for a trophy...unless you think 9" of horn that's stuffed in the rafters somewhere is a trophy. I also don't look at a raghorn elk, or even a small 6 point and see a trophy. I see a pile of steaks, burger, etc. As for the "trophy" it's another pain in the ass I somehow and for some dumb reason, feel obligated to carry back to hang in the rafters. I'm fixing to sell off a few thousand dollars worth of these "trophies" collecting dust around here.

 

[Treeshark]

Nobody is arguing against trophy hunting, only about being honest about it, or more precisely the dishonesty about it.

I've shot a bighorn that was no shot for a trophy...unless you think 9" of horn that's stuffed in the rafters somewhere is a trophy.

Why did you shoot it then? And what possessed you to keep the horns? You have your s$&@ together, you don’t strike me as a hoarder

Trophies take many forms. Horns, novelty of meat, total amount of meat, fur, pictures, bragging rights etc…

Hunters do themselves no favors by defending themselves against “trophy hunting.” Man has been memorializing successful hunts for tens of thousands of years.

Yes, we all do it. And it’s ok.

 

[Nick87]

If bowfishing for dolphins was legal (and you could keep the meat), would you guys be interested?

Be honest.

Thought about it. Probably not bowfishing but a helicopter with full auto? I'm all in!

 

[BuzzH]

Why did you shoot it then?

Trophies take many forms. Horns, novelty of meat, total amount of meat, fur, pictures, bragging rights etc…

Hunters do themselves no favors by defending themselves against “trophy hunting.” Man has been memorializing successful hunts for tens of thousands of years.

Yes, we all do it. And it’s ok.

Meat, everyone bragged about how great bighorn meat was.

I didn't find it all that great myself, about like mule deer.

Sure its ok to trophy hunt, as long as you're honest about it.

 

[Trial153]

On the positive, that means at least 10% of the people care enough to conserve a species. The percentage would be the same if the animals were poached and parts sold in a market in China. I’m not sure the result would be better of Nike opened a factory in Botswana.

You all spent 10pages arguing points in which both sides are right. It is trophy hunting and it does help conservation, at least a little. Animal viewing on a “safari” is also big business. Individuals have their own justifications. The question should be more on whether or how much it helps.

I think a better question has to do with making it palatable to 99% of the people in countries that don’t hunt yet have a say in how their laws are passed.

There is not a lot of commonality to be found between Joe public and Joe trophy hunter who is spending more disposable income on week long hunt then Joe public sees in a handful of years. Your not garnering any sympathy from them when you say, if can’t bring back XYZ……the locals will starve.

We need a better approach then the Fat wallet model

 

[TOGIE]

If bowfishing for dolphins was legal (and you could keep the meat), would you guys be interested?

Be honest.

now these kind of hypotheticals are what the internet is for! let's turn this thread around

my honest answer, i would definitely be interested. but the same way i'm interested in speargun fishing, sounds super cool and super fun and a great way to procure lots of awesome meat, but probably never gonna do it. lot of logistics and money for something that's too far away and that i'm a noob at.

but if i lived on the coast in florida or california and owned a boat it would probably actually be in my rotation of hunting activities. big meat haul and sounds super fun.

 

[SAJ-99]

I think a better question has to do with making it palatable to 99% of the people in countries that don’t hunt yet have a say in how their laws are passed.

There is not a lot of commonality to be found between Joe public and Joe trophy hunter who is spending more disposable income on week long hunt then Joe public sees in a handful of years. Your not garnering any sympathy from them when you say, if can’t bring back XYZ……the locals will starve.

We need a better approach then the Fat wallet model

Fat wallet model is a problem in a lot of things. I don’t mind if the meat get sold at market prices to locals if it means one fewer animal gets shot and the meat gets put to use. I hate the poaching more than anything. Consequently I will accept some fat-wallet guy telling himself he is also “doing good” on that trophy hunt, if it helps him sleep at night.

 

[BuzzH]

Fat wallet model is a problem in a lot of things.

That changed in AZ. Fat wallet may not be the winner and has to compete with the thin wallet guys. It's only a problem if its allowed to happen.

One of my best friends enjoyed the feeling 3 times of telling a fat wallet guy to pound sand, a truly wonderful, heart warming story.

 

[noharleyyet]

I've certainly benefitted from Buzz's generous schooling the past couple of days. I'm sure he would've preferred expending PTO more enjoyably.

 

[MTGomer]

The motivations of the hunter are far less important than the impact. I personally don’t care if somebody wants to bring back ivory, so they can put it in their texas mansion they purchased with oil money hang it up, drink bourbon they convince themselves doesn’t taste like shit because it’s expensive, smoke cigars, stroke their dicks and brag to their sweaty, obese friends, about what big bad ass white hunters they are.
I’m sure there are alright people that hunt elephants. But let’s be honest, most that do probably don’t have much in common with people on this page.

If it’s conserving wildlife habitat from ranching and poaching, while feeding otherwise starving people, that is far more important than the motivations of somebody that will be dead soon anyway.

There doesn’t seem to be an alternative in Africa outside of the handful of national parks safe and sterilized enough for ecotourism.

 

[Nick87]

Maybe of the Minnesota guys on here need to do a welfare check on @rjthehunter seems. This thread seems like something he normally wouldn't miss out on...maybe he and @The Hedgehog (God dammit that took me a while to find the right name!) Are busy putting together a spring bear hunt?

 

[SAJ-99]

That changed in AZ. Fat wallet may not be the winner and has to compete with the thin wallet guys. It's only a problem if its allowed to happen.

One of my best friends enjoyed the feeling 3 times of telling a fat wallet guy to pound sand, a truly wonderful, heart warming story.

People with principles that can’t be bought are few and far between these days. I’m sure that was a great feeling for him and enjoy just thinking about it. lol.

 

[WildWill]

Thought about it. Probably not bowfishing but a helicopter with full auto? I'm all in!

Interesting I like your style. I think I'll go full contact though seems a bit more sporting.

 

[Hilljackoutlaw]

Buzz is following me around today!