flatlander questions

[TLC]

have never hunted elk. never really thought about it. but, times change. so, have a few questions about these critters. are there any similarities between elk and deer? meaning, deer normally use the same trails unless disturbed. do elk do this also? or are they more of a wandering animal? same with food sources. can they be patterned like deer? with deer, decoys are fun to use. especially if you're filming them. can, or has anyone ever used a decoy to try and take an elk? is it even feasible to consider something like that?


and a general question about different states out west. do any of them have what they call OTC tags for elk? for bowhunting. know if they do, probably not in the best locations, but just curious. know wyoming has them for lopes in certain areas.

 

[schmalts]

From one flat lander to another, I say give it a try and you will find WT Deer in the midwest are boring, easy, and a lot of luck and who's land your on compared to elk. I am no means an elk expert but what I do know is some areas that are full of elk one year can be vacant the next. Pattering them is possible, but mainly in the archery season more than rifle because of less pressure and weather is more stable. I have watched big bulls 3-4 days come down the same draw to the same water daily until I spooked them. But once you spook them, they don't go to the next 40 like a buck, they are gone to the next mile, county, mountain....
Sounds crazy to some but I compare Turkey hunting in the spring a bit like elk hunting during bow season. Your on the move, calling, closing in, just plain fun compared to sitting in some stupid stand day after day. But I tell you what, after a week of elk hunting that deer stand is pretty sweet
Just dont fool yourself on how important it is to be in shape for elk hunting. After a couple days it gets pretty taxing on the body.

 

[A-con]

Colorado has some OTC tags, and Idaho has some "first come/first serve" tags that usually sell out shortly before the season starts.
As you have guessed, these areas are not the best, with lots of pressure. Still, if you get off the roads and in to the back country, elk can be found.
During bow season, elk will often use the same trails, food & water sources for days or even weeks in a row, then move elsewhere for no apperent reason. So you can pattern them, just don't count on it.
Lots of people use elk decoys, and like Whitetails, they can (sometimes) be called during the rut.

 

[Bambistew]

then move elsewhere for no apperent reason.

That reason is usually that the feed they were targeting froze, or the last of the green grass has dried up.

There is some good info above.

For archery hunting in Spetember this has been my experience. Rifle hunting is a crap shoot and really depends on knowing where they travel to and from thier bedding areas and feeding areas.

I don't particularly think elk hunting is all that difficult once you understand how they utilize thier habitat. By that I mean that a herd will utilize certain areas for feeding, bedding, and traveling at diffrent times of the year, or even the same time depending on pressure and feed. Their 'core' range could be 10-15 square miles and they may move 2-3 miles between bedding and feeding areas. Key locations to hunt are in the travel corridors, especially in rifle season, and at timber line early in September where the green grass is. They have multiple feeding and bedding areas, and know where they're safe and once spooked they will move to the next one. Like mentioned above thats why you might find a gob of them one year and then very few the next. I've seen this many times as well, but I know that they didn't die off or get eaten by wolves, they're probably in the next drainage over. There are a million diffrent variables and depending on where you hunt its all diffrent.

I've never hunted in the desert, or out of a tree stand over a water hole and never will... thats about as gay as it gets for elk hunting.

If you want to hunt archery season, I would concentrate on the time between the 15th and the 25th or so of September. Weather is the key factor over the moon phase, I have been very sucessful around the full moon and rarely plan any hunting by the moon phase. The evenings tend to be better around the full moon vs the new moon. Changes in weather, specifically low pressure moving in usually triggers rutting activity, once it starts snowing/raining forget about it. They'll shut up and hole up for a few days.

Prepare to be mobile you might be hiking 6-8 miles a day if you want to be successful, however don't blow through areas just because you don't see elk. They very well could be in the area, move slow and keep your head up. I don't know how many elk I've walked up on in the timber, but its a bunch.

If its hot elk will bed near creek bottoms or springs, and on north and east facting slopes in the shade.

Call sparingly. A bull won't usually come charging into a bugle. Call once or twice, if they're around and intersted they'll usually answer, then move in and cow call once you think you're close. Get a cow in estrus or 'hyper hot' cow call and learn how to use it, but don't over use it.

I've never used a decoy, but have heard that they work and might try it in the future, but would NEVER use one in rifle or muzz season.

I wrote this last year on another site about hunting the rut in Colorado...

Elk are similar to deer with thier rutting activity.

They have the pre-rut, the chase, the breeding, and then chase or post rut for the cows that were missed, and its all over... All are seperated by about 7-9 days... Starting about the 3rd-7th of Sept and ending about the 8-14th of Oct

IMO most people call way too much and expect the elk to come running. If the elk give away thier location, take advantage of it and get in close before you try any calling at all. Once you call, the elk are looking for you! I typcally call to locate, then move in, use a bugle and or cow call sparingly, just depends on the situation. I've had very few elk come in farther than 150-200 yards to a call. Remember elk are bugling to find other elk. If you have a partner, set the shooter up in front about 30-40 yards of the caller. Elk will hang up at the distance they can see to where they think they heard the call originate... usually 50-80 yards. 3 hunters works even better... two callers and one shooter. "Hyper hot" or breeding cow calls, and imature bulgles will drive bulls nuts!

The first week of September is generaly pretty slow and hot weather wise. Early and late is about the only time you'll get any kind of response, however its likely the best time to hunt big bulls. They're starting to look for cows who have come into heat early, and know the routine of whats to come. They typically won't be very volcal however, and calling works sporadically... Spot and stalk, with limited cow calling and hunt wallows mid day.

The second week... things are heating up. Bulls are pretty active and respond well to calls, but they might not commit, however they make the mistake and give themselvs away, move in close 150 or less and break out that cow call, wallows also can be productive.

The third week... Hot and heavy, don't expect to kill a big bull very easily however, they've got thier girls rounded up, while they typically will respond to bugles, they won't come in, rather they are trying to figure out where you (and other bulls) are. Call too much and he'll round em up and leave the country! IF you can get between him and his cows use your bugle and he'll probably come looking for a fight. Calling will work VERY well for smaller satallite bulls and you'll have action all week long possibly all day long! We've killed and got into bulls at all time of the day during this week. Mater of fact the first bull I shot in archery season 15 years ago was at 1 PM as a snow squal rolled in. This is my favorite time to go.

The last week or end of septembe is starting to wind down, but bulls will still respond to cow calls. If you locate a bull move in close and use your cow call sparingly. If you bugle you might scare him off. They typcally aren't looking to pick a fight, rather just an easy piece of tail.

Weather plays a bigger roll than the moon phase IMO, if its a full moon hunt the evenings more than the mornings. The elk will be active all night long during a full moon, you'll hear lots of bugles especially if its during the end of the 2nd or during the 3rd week. They'll lay up and rest in the mornings but will get active again late in the day and evening.

If a front is rolling through, look out things can get crazy! But once it starts storming it pretty much shuts them up for a couple days. Snow on the ground usually doesn't bode well for a good hunt.

Also for all the guys that insist on putting a chuckle/grunt on the end of your bugle... thanks, keep doing that it helps verify that you are infact a hunter and not an elk. very few bulls will bugle and chuckle... its usually one or the other.

To answer your original question... don't worry about the muzzy hunters. Elk are stupid in the rut, even if they get spooked by a hunter in the morning, they'll soon be looking for love again. I'd hunt between the 15th-28th of September! Muzzy season in CO this year should be outstanding. I can't wait!

As it turned out, the hunt was outstanding... It also turned out to be exactly how I described above, spotty rutting the first 3-4 days and heated up as the week went on, and I ended up killing a really nice bull 2-3 days after the full moon.

 

[TLC]

thanj you guys. appreciate the info. but after reading bambistew, might have to rethink these points I'm buying for wyoming elk.


"you might be hiking 6-8 miles a day" - bambi, have you been drinking? not sure I could ride a bike that far in a day. can I use my 4-wheeler? that should piss some people off.


sounds like this might be a fun hunt to try. and would definately be a sept hunt during the rut period if possible. looks like this will be expensive. but, have to replace everything after the house just burnt down,:BLEEP: so what the hell. at least now I have a reason to do it.

 

[Big Fin]

........ but, have to replace everything after the house just burnt down,:BLEEP: so what the hell. at least now I have a reason to do it.

TLC:

That is a major bummer. Very sorry to hear that. Anyone who has ever had a house burn down, or a family member who has went through it, knows what a traumatic event it is.

Glad you are OK, and hope all others are OK.

Let us know if we can help in any way. I know I have lots of stuff I don't use very often, in the event you were needing something.

Hang in there.

Damn.

 

[IDHunters]

TLC I sent you a PM

 

[TLC]

IDHunter, got it, and thanks. sure will have some more as I get closer to the time.


BigFin, thanks. right now, still in a holding pattern due to the insurance company. once they decide to pay the claim, then I will know what I may or may not need. FYI, none of the mounts I got from your wife were damaged. had them at the farm done south.

 

[Bambistew]

"you might be hiking 6-8 miles a day" - bambi, have you been drinking?

6-8 miles is round trip, and really not that far especially in flat country like most of Colorado. If you want to kill one you have to be in shape and put in the time and miles. Wimp out and you'll be an unsucessful 'statistic'. I've lucked out and killed a few easy elk, but they're far and few between for me. Some people are luckier (or better hunters) than me, maybe I have to get in that far to find one dumb enough that I can kill it? Its seemed to work so far.

Talk to people who kill elk on a regular basis and you'll hear the same. You have to be in shape and be able to chase em if you need to. The chase might be dropping 800-1000 vertical and gaining it again in a mile or less across a canyon. Being in shape and the mental desire to get it done are #1 and #2 on the list of killing elk IMO. What gun/bow/bullet you use is about number 40.

I've mentioned it a few other times. I would much rather hunt the rut than hunt post rut rifle season. You'll likely see more elk, the odds of killing one might be a little lower due to useing primitive weapons, but you'll get more opportunity at more animals.

Sorry to hear about your house, that sucks.

 

[TLC]

"6-8 miles is round trip, and really not that far especially in flat country like most of Colorado." - gotta say bambi, that makes me feel sooo much better.

have to do something. this is whats left of the computer, books, magazines, and that nasty thing in the middle is the form from one of my deer heads. that hurt. guess I'll have to hunt more this year to replace the lost ones.


http://i241.photobucket.com/albums/ff199/tlchi/PICT0124.jpg

 

[noharleyyet]

Too bad about the hard luck. You gonna build it back y'self though right? Good luck with your insurance provider.

....go elk hunting & get hooked.

 

[brymoore]

6 to 8 mile hike is nothing. The work starts once one is down.

 

[Ultrahunter]

6 to 8 mile hike is nothing. The work starts once one is down.

I agree with that for sure!

 

[baltz526]

oregon has OTC elk tags, bow and rifle

 

[sturge]

If you can go on short notice, there are usually some NewMexico LO tags available due to canelations and such. There have been the last 2 years anyway, and they were reasonably priced.