Fixing social security

[Derek44]

I wish for starters, that there was a better distinction between SS and SSI. I believe there is a lot of confusion between the two. I’m not too sure that SS and Medicare can be defrauded quite the same as SSI yet I think there is a lot of individuals that don’t see the difference and lump it together. No one likes seeing fraud and social systems being taken advantage of and it’s easy to say get rid of it all when the line is gray on the differences.

 

[mevertsen]

Exactly, well said. Everyone is a bootstrapper until Medicare kicks in.

If it weren't for Medicare I'd be dead or living in a card board box right now due to my disease. A disease I was born with and which I have no control over. I worked for my entire life, then BOOM, December 5 last year I was retired... at 40.

I do have my small pension and some money I saved, my wife had already returned to school and will be finishing that soon, so that will help.

I don't think people fully realize how expensive stuff is (medical wise), until you are living it.

I'm hoping I can return to work in the near future, but that really depends on how well I can do.

People also seem to paint with a very broad brush and assume all people on welfare, Medicare, etc are rats and not fit for society.

Tell that line to my wife and daughter.

 

[F250]

You are never done paying into the Federal government ! For 2023, withholdings from my Social Security check totaled over $5,500.00 in Federal income tax and $2000.00 in Medicare. So we pay a tax on a tax we already paid !!!

 

[Straight Arrow]

You are never done paying into the Federal government ! For 2023, withholdings from my Social Security check totaled over $5,500.00 in Federal income tax and $2000.00 in Medicare. So we pay a tax on a tax we already paid !!!

As a retiree leading the good life ... I thank you!

'Sorry for your tax-anguish ... but please keep working.

 

[Treeshark]

Tell that line to my wife and daughter.

@meversten, I hope my post you replied to was clear- I made it in support of those who find themselves in exactly your type your position, not a criticism.

 

[hank4elk]

Full boomer on SS and a small pension. Medicare.
Stage 4 cancer.
I'm glad I have it.
The SS and pension.

 

[SAJ-99]

You are never done paying into the Federal government ! For 2023, withholdings from my Social Security check totaled over $5,500.00 in Federal income tax and $2000.00 in Medicare. So we pay a tax on a tax we already paid !!!

If you are retired on SS, income limits on taxation still apply. You have to be doing pretty well. It is essentially a means-test, without being called such.

 

[mevertsen]

@meversten, I hope my post you replied to was clear- I made it in support of those who find themselves in exactly your type your position, not a criticism.

I think I read it wrong after looking back at other replies, however it does seem people in this forum have that sentiment, I just replied to the wrong quote. All good.

 

[Dave N]

2 small pensions, enough in a 401 for a small monthly disbursement and SS that is above the average. We're doing good but hopefully nothing bad happens. With no or a greatly reduced SS payment things could go south quick with me not being able to get a job. I worked hard, TRIED saving what I could, was getting fairly well squared away and then shit happened. No fault of mine but thanks to the SS check I get we're not out on the street.

I also live in a state that doesn't tax SS or pension payments. Big win!

 

[Straight Arrow]

then shit happened. No fault of mine

Kids and grandkids need basics and also it's nice to give them frills if possible. And shit does happen ... new freezer, plumbing goes haywire, car needs a new battery, truck needs two new batteries, tires, etc. Then ... heaven help you if you need a new truck or even a newer used truck. There goes that savings net you have been slowly growing and a loan keeps you awake at night.

Plus as you get more-retired, the medical maintenance and repairs get more concerning and more costly. That's life! Suck it up, Straight!

 

[4ohSick]

Big thanks to the real-world examples chiming in of working hard and still needing help from the system. Do people get money that shouldn't sometimes? Absolutely. But I think there are a lot more stories like yours that people might have a hard time seeing from their perches way up on those high horses.

 

[BuzzH]

So, to live and thrive I have to support people who have no intention on contributing to society? That doesn't sound like a fair deal to me.

Too many people are taking advantage of things with 0 contribution to society. Where did everyone's bootstraps go?

What do you do with people who physically and mentally can't work?

You live in fantasyland, as a society, we are not going to put the old, mentally challenged, and physically broken people out in the streets.

 

[rjthehunter]

What do you do with people who physically and mentally can't work?

You live in fantasyland, as a society, we are not going to put the old, mentally challenged, and physically broken people out in the streets.

I don't think anyone wants to put the old, mentally challenged, or physically broken people on the streets.

You're living in fantasyland if you don't think the current welfare system needs an overhaul. There is far too many lazy people not working because they can easily get gov. assistance.

At this rate, the lazy people are going to ruin the system for the people who are actually disabled.

 

[BuzzH]

If it weren't for Medicare I'd be dead or living in a card board box right now due to my disease. A disease I was born with and which I have no control over. I worked for my entire life, then BOOM, December 5 last year I was retired... at 40.

I do have my small pension and some money I saved, my wife had already returned to school and will be finishing that soon, so that will help.

I don't think people fully realize how expensive stuff is (medical wise), until you are living it.

I'm hoping I can return to work in the near future, but that really depends on how well I can do.

People also seem to paint with a very broad brush and assume all people on welfare, Medicare, etc are rats and not fit for society.

Tell that line to my wife and daughter.

Right, I think many of the folks whining about SS, SSI, and Medicare think everyone drawing it is living in a mansion, eating steak and lobster every night, driving a BMW, and otherwise living the high life.

It's not true, and I don't envy anyone that is having to scrape by on SS or has medical/physical/mental issues that keep them from working.

I'm perfectly fine with and think its only right to make sure those in that situation have the opportunity to live in some sort of dignity.

IMO, its the price I'm willing to pay for living in a society with some sort of compassion for their fellow man. Troubles me that certain segments of any society would display such discourse for others, sad really.

 

[BuzzH]

I don't think anyone wants to put the old, mentally challenged, or physically broken people on the streets.

You're living in fantasyland if you don't think the current welfare system needs an overhaul. There is far too many lazy people not working because they can easily get gov. assistance.

At this rate, the lazy people are going to ruin the system for the people who are actually disabled.

You're full of crap. You want to trade those on welfare and living on gov. assistance places?

I sure don't.

If you want to have a discussion about welfare and gov assistance, you won't like where that discussion goes. Way bigger fish to fry than a single Mom that had her old man leave the family high and dry getting welfare.

Shore up corporate welfare first and I'll entertain your grievance with lazy people, until then, you're not getting any traction with me.

 

[Derek44]

I don't think anyone wants to put the old, mentally challenged, or physically broken people on the streets.

You're living in fantasyland if you don't think the current welfare system needs an overhaul. There is far too many lazy people not working because they can easily get gov. assistance.

At this rate, the lazy people are going to ruin the system for the people who are actually disabled.

And that is what I’ve been talking about. This thread was originally based on the Social Security base. Social Security is not the “welfare” that some people are confusing it with. Every program in our system could use an overhaul. Or at least a little maintenance. That’s the nature of the beast with a growing society.

 

[rjthehunter]

And that is what I’ve been talking about. This thread was originally based on the Social Security base. Social Security is not the “welfare” that some people are confusing it with. Every program in our system could use an overhaul. Or at least a little maintenance. That’s the nature of the beast with a growing society.

Agreed. I was sort of just following the flow of the thread. The original question was about social security and retirement, not disability.

I still wish SS could be optional.

You're full of crap. You want to trade those on welfare and living on gov. assistance places?

I sure don't.

If you want to have a discussion about welfare and gov assistance, you won't like where that discussion goes. Way bigger fish to fry than a single Mom that had her old man leave the family high and dry getting welfare.

Shore up corporate welfare first and I'll entertain your grievance with lazy people, until then, you're not getting any traction with me.

Did I say I wanted to trade places with someone on assistance?

If you don't think the current systems need help, then you're in dire need of help.

 

[ImBillT]

Between you and your employer, 12.4% is put in SSI on your behalf.

For easy numbers, let’s say you average $100k salary over 40 years.

That’s $12.4k/yr. If invested in Index Funds/ETFs we can say that it will grow 8% annually.

In a 40 year career, you’d have accumulated over $3.7 Million dollars in investments.

It’s considered safe to with draw 4% annually to avoid drawing down the principle.

This would allow you to draw $151k a year and die with that $3.7 million still in your account.

I haven’t checked the SSI calculator for the same $100k income, but it’s not paying you $151k/yr and leaving you with just <$4 million to give to your kids.

View attachment 320141

But you based that on making the same $100k 40 years ago that you do the day you retire. That’s not even close to accurate for most people.

Gonna have to do something. I don’t see any of it as good. I wish we could prosecute the people who squandered all of the money they took from us without any choice in the matter.

 

[Thorn]

I am happy to pay into SS. Folks like Charlie Munger agree.

 

[MTGomer]

But you based that on making the same $100k 40 years ago that you do the day you retire. That’s not even close to accurate for most people.

Gonna have to do something. I don’t see any of it as good. I wish we could prosecute the people who squandered all of the money they took from us without any choice in the matter.

I just used 100k as an average so that it could plug into a simple compounding interest calculator. You’ll see that my SS calculator a few posts later was also based on a high income, greater than the contribution ceiling, to make it an apples-apples comparison.

Most people my age with real jobs will average that. 33 years from now when I’m retirement age, $100k won’t mean much ( not that it does now)