Dont worry about the student loan forgiveness

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Hem said:
Great point.
I think there is a deep pool of kids that given some training could have a good jump on a career in the trades. As it is, learning on the run takes determination and dedication. Kids are jumping from one job to the next based on " this weeks" pay and not really learning much.
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Bingo.....
 
TheNorthStar said:
Right after you point out my posts on this site regarding negativity towards student loan forgiveness. They call that a strawman, you know, and they're pretty easy to burn.
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Responding to a rebut of a whataboutism with a whataboutism is a bad take.
 
jabber said:
No student loan debt and no stimulus checks. I must be doing something wrong. At least I get to help pay for everybody else's misfortune. Total bullshit.
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Don’t feel bad. I got no stimulus checks either. No personal student debt but I pay my girls undergrad.
 
schmalts said:
From Mike Rowe (Dirty jobs guy)
I work hard on this page, (not as hard as I could, perhaps, but pretty hard), to avoid the politics of the moment, and comment only on topics that impact the foundation I’m proud to run – a foundation that awards work-ethic scholarships to individuals who choose to forego an expensive, four-year education in favor of a skilled trade. When I do weigh in, I try to acknowledge both sides of the argument, and make my points with as much respect as I can muster. Today, however, I can see only one side. Today, I can find nothing to respect in the President’s decision to transfer billions of dollars in outstanding student loans onto the backs of those people my foundation tries to assist - the same people I’ve spent the last twenty years profiling on Dirty Jobs.
With that in mind, I’m not going to write the piece I just sat down to write. Instead, I’m going to share the attached article from Charlie Cooke, who writes better than I do, and shares my disdain for what just happened. If you share our disdain, then please, share this post as well. It is without question, the biggest pre-Labor Day slap in the face I've ever seen.
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BIDEN'S STUDENT-DEBT BONFIRE IS A CLASSIST MESSAGE TO THE UNCREDENTIALED: SCREW 'EM
By Charlie Cooke
A few moments before I sat down to write this piece, I opened the door to six guys in blue shirts who had come to my house to replace our air-conditioning units. The Florida weather being what it is, I’ve seen some of these guys work on our air conditioners before, and they’re as skilled and knowledgeable and conscientious and hard-working as you might expect. The company they work for, which is local to North Florida, was started by a guy who chose to forgo college in favor of taking out a small-business loan to strike out on his own. Most of the technicians who work for him didn’t go to college, either. They took a different path. And, well . . . what absolute chumps the president has just made of them for that!
Squirm if you like, but that’s the truth of the matter: As of today, the six air-conditioning technicians in my house are on the hook for college loans that were signed for, spent, and enjoyed by other people. Confirming the measure today, President Biden announced that any American who has both college debt they vowed to repay and an individual yearly income under $125,000 (or a family yearly income under $250,000) will be given up to $20,000 by the Treasury — which means by you, and by me, and by everyone else who pays taxes in America.
Why? Well, that’s the question.
The answer can’t be, “because that’s what the relevant law anticipates or requires.” As of yet, Congress has provided no authorization for the executive branch to arbitrarily write off some of the money that borrowers owe to taxpayers. As of yet, Congress has passed no rules that allow down-on-their-luck presidents to throw money at people for political gain. As of yet, Congress has given no instruction that if the president’s friends might like a little more cash, he can raid the Treasury to give it to them. Certainly, Congress has set up a loan program. But the deal there is rather simple, all told: First you borrow, and then you pay back what you borrowed. There is no mention of “forgiveness” days or of “help” or of rolling Chekhovian jubilees, and by pretending otherwise, President Biden is making a mockery of his oath to uphold the Constitution.
Another answer that won’t fly is, “To lower the cost of education.” As President Biden made clear today, this is a one-time deal, a lottery, a lightning strike. People who paid off their loans last week aren’t covered. People who will take out new loans after the policy has run its course aren’t covered. The problems in the system aren’t addressed. The colleges, and their endowments, are left unmolested. American culture’s increasingly credentialist presumptions aren’t altered. Within four years, overall debt will return to its present level. With the stroke of a pen, the already-fake deficit savings within the Inflation Reduction Act will be wiped out. This isn’t a reform. It’s not even pretending to be reform. It’s a contemptuous, abusive, unbelievably expensive shot in the dark — the net effect of which will be that fewer people correctly calibrate whether college is worth it, fewer colleges change their offerings to meet market demand, and, because this sort of executive giveaway will now loom large as a possibility, fewer people feel the need to save for college.
It seems so arbitrary. Why does Biden not want to do the same thing for loans on trucks owned by plumbers? Why not for mortgages — which, given how heavily it subsidizes them, the federal government clearly thinks are worthwhile? Why not for credit cards or auto payments or mom-and-pop credit lines? The answer, I’m afraid to say, is disgustingly classist: Because Joe Biden and his party believe that college students are better than everyone else. Because Joe Biden and his party believe that college students are of a finer cut. Because Joe Biden and his party prefer college students to you, and they think that those students ought to be rewarded for that by being handed enormous gobs of your money.
Electricians, store managers, deli workers, landscapers, waitresses, mechanics, entrepreneurs? Screw ’em. Sure, college graduates make more money than non-graduates, and their unemployment rate is lower, too. But non-graduates don’t have access to the president, so they don’t matter. They’re tradesmen, the riff-raff, the great unwashed. They’re background noise, dirty-handed types, second-classers. They don’t deserve $10,000 in debt reduction. What would they even do with it? Go hunting? Give it to their church? Their role is to subsidize the superior people, and the superior people go to college.
Why did Joe Biden do all this? That’s why. Why was this what Joe Biden chose to break his oath to achieve? That’s why. When it came down to it, good ol’ Scranton Joe sent cash from the sort of people he cynically pretends to care about to the sort of people he actually cares about: the privileged, accredited, self-dealing clerisy that his ever-dwindling political party now calls its base.
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I respect your point. plumbers, electricians, hvac techs etc all are very respectable jobs and everyone one of those professionals should be proud of the work they do.

My point was getting at jobs like my own where I would not have gotten even an interview without a bachelors of science degree, but yet almost all of what I do daily I never took a college class to learn. they are skills I have learned through experience in life and on the job by starting at a entry level job, working my way through the ranks with an open mind and a willingness to learn. Something we do not see anymore. Everyone thinks they are entitled to be a manager, a foreman, a ceo.
 
This student loan forgiveness, paying for a war in Ukraine, 20 years fighting goat herders, and commies like Buzz wanting subsides will bankrupt our country and future generations.

We have taught multiple generations that being a pipeliner, carpenter, mechanic, or any other trade as second class. People are dumber than #*^@#* sometimes
 
TheNorthStar said:
The bad take was arguing with a fence post bridled with a heap of assumed student loan debt. It's not whataboutism to point out that neither exists, but you go ahead and have the last laugh. I think I'll take my own advice.
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Let me know when you want to respond in coherent English. That should have been taught well before college.
 
woods89 said:
I agree, but we really don't need that many ditch diggers. We have machines for that. What we need are people who are willing to learn somewhat complex skills and execute them professionally. In other words, we need the guy who can lay the pipe in the ditch and handle the tie in on either end.
I think a 1-2 year system, with buy-in from both the high school system and parents would do wonders for my industry.
What we need to change is the idea that someone who has remodeled houses for 10 years, and has a basic knowledge of concrete, framing, plumbing, electrical, drywall, tile, etc, is somehow less educated than someone who has been mailing it in, hung over half the time, for 4 years at some college.
Alright, off my soapbox..... 😆
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See my response to schmalts
 
Pagosa said:
This student loan forgiveness, paying for a war in Ukraine, 20 years fighting goat herders, and commies like Buzz wanting subsides will bankrupt our country and future generations.

We have taught multiple generations that being a pipeliner, carpenter, mechanic, or any other trade as second class. People are dumber than #*^@#* sometimes
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You don't even know the definition of communism...you shouldn't use words you don't understand.

By the way I don't want the sides of a sub.

Don't think you have a lot of room claiming others are "dumber than #$_&$".

Also, people may want to think carpenters and plumbers are second class...right until they open the bill. Pretty sure that thought leaves the room as fast as the cash out of their wallets.

I think you're defensive about your imagination and pretend outrage.
 
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What we need is a required financial literacy class in high school. Most kids or their parents for that matter, don’t have a damn clue how finances work or how interest accrues.

There should be no option for a kid to take out a student loan to live on. It should pay for their tuition/books/boarding. It’s not my responsibility to pay for someone who took out a shitload of money so they could drink PBR 6 nights a week. Go get a job while you’re in school and use that money to live.

Student loans are a choice. You don’t have to have them. If you want them then plan on paying them back yourself. However, we should have classes in HS to prepare kids to make better decisions.
 
Carnage2011 said:
What we need is a required financial literacy class in high school. Most kids or their parents for that matter, don’t have a damn clue how finances work or how interest accrues.

There should be no option for a kid to take out a student loan to live on. It should pay for their tuition/books/boarding. It’s not my responsibility to pay for someone who took out a shitload of money so they could drink PBR 6 nights a week. Go get a job while you’re in school and use that money to live.

Student loans are a choice. You don’t have to have them. If you want them then plan on paying them back yourself. However, we should have classes in HS to prepare kids to make better decisions.
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Financial literacy needs to start in grade school...and there should be a financial app installed permanently on every smart phone.
 
This is absolutely ridiculous and a pure attempt at buying votes that I believe will completely backfire. I paid for most of my undergrad by working my butt off building houses every summer, and my wife paid for 100% of hers. AND we've been working hard to pay off her med school loans for the last 7 years by ourselves with no assistance, and no, we don't want any loan forgiveness because as consenting adults we read the paperwork before we signed it. People need to grow up.
 
schmalts said:
Side question.... Is this Biden vote buying even legal?? At least the covid garbage went through congress. I would not be surprised if this gets challenged in court.
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Side question back...is it legal to send a letter from the president with a stimulus check buying votes?
 
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