Do you guys really believe that all ATV riders break the law?

[JoseCuervo]

280,
No way.... I was right all along.... You gotta check with the owner/manager of the land. You can't just drive your fat-ass anywhere you want....

Speaking of gettin' schooled, how come you won't show us any big ass Elk you are planning on killing???

 

[280]

casper owns gunner and I am not planning on killing another bull this year

 

[JoseCuervo]

280,
You expecting us to believe you already filled a spike tag this year???

Where's the pics???

 

[Ten Bears]

EG wont admit the obvious.

EG, you got schooled. Face it.

Just show me where it says I can't load dead critters on my ATV in AZ at all.

 

[280]

belive what you want, you asked I told, and I don`t HAVE to prove anything, also you can`t shoot spikes in the area I hunt,,, brow tined bulls only


gunner has been schooled

 

[JoseCuervo]

280, Well at least let us all drool over the success you have had.... We know what Moosie's spike will look like....

 

[Ten Bears]

EG;

Just show me where it says I can't load dead critters on my ATV in AZ at all.

 

[AKHighmark]

HEY EG....Want to start over somewhere? I'm game.

 

[Ten Bears]

EG;

Just show me where it says I can't load dead critters on my ATV in AZ at all.

 

[Nemont]

I think this clearly points out that the ATV either cannot or will not police themselves. Therefore all of you guys are suspect for breaking the law. I can't imagine any circumstance where this problem will be taken care of by the ATV crowd as there is a vast majority of riders who do not want any restrictions placed upon them and where they can ride.

Protect forests from ATV damage

Knight Ridder/Tribune News Service


(KRT) - The following editorial appeared in the Kansas City Star on Tuesday, Sept. 7:

X X X

ATVs and other off-road vehicles are bad news for the forest primeval - and for people's enjoyment of nature at its most beautiful. ATVs carve roads through forest wilderness, crisscross the meadows with muddy paths, tear up the homes of animals, frighten wildlife and destroy sensitive plants.

Americans who like the forests for the quieter pursuits of hiking, camping, photography, fishing and hunting have only until Sept. 13 to let the Forest Service know they want restrictions on the noisy machines.

Some national forests have signs designating off-road vehicle paths, but many do not. It doesn't seem to matter to many vehicle riders if there are signs anyway. All-terrain vehicles can go many places, and the telltale signs in the forest show they often do.

In some areas, "mudbogging'' - in which ATVs churn up mounds of mud - has destroyed wetlands. In others, once-clear streams are cloudy and silt-filled because of ATV-induced erosion. The air often stinks of exhaust fumes.

The federal government should establish well-thought-out ATV paths where they are needed. The most secluded and special areas of the forests should be off limits. And vehicle use on unauthorized trails should carry a strong penalty.

In a perfect world, off-road vehicles would be banned entirely from the forests. However, many Americans enjoy their national lands through this recreational activity, and some hunters and anglers get to favorite spots by driving off-road vehicles. So the Forest Service should resolve this issue in a way that allows all interest groups to enjoy the forests.

The government is headed in the right direction. Proposed rules would require the study of all national forests and the identification of acceptable trails for off-road vehicles. Officials say they hope to get moving on this in the next two years.

The lack of a definite deadline is troubling. So is the lack of a rule against carving new routes through the forests while the studies are pending. Destruction could go on for many years without tougher requirements. The number of off-road vehicles tearing through the forests is growing, and the Forest Service needs to be told to act soon .

The public can send written comments by Sept. 13 to Proposed Rule for Designated Routes and Areas for Motor Vehicle Use, c/o Content Analysis Team, P.O. Box 221150, Salt Lake City, Utah 84122-1150. Or send e-mail to [email protected] or fax to 1-(801 )-517-1014 . To read the proposed rule on the Internet go to www.regulations.gov.

Americans should weigh in on this important forest protection rule.

---

© 2004, The Kansas City Star.

 

[Ten Bears]

The lack of a definite deadline is troubling. So is the lack of a rule against carving new routes through the forests while the studies are pending. Destruction could go on for many years without tougher requirements. The number of off-road vehicles tearing through the forests is growing, and the Forest Service needs to be told to act soon .

Another disturbing thought is the lack of research done in writing this article..... I know of many areas where "carving new routes" is illegal. I now of vast areas where it is illegal to leave the designated roads. The problem in these areas is that nonriders think that all gates mean no motorized vehicles, but in reality they are a designation barrier. Lack of education (or acceptance) by nonriders is just as much a problem.

 

[Nemont]

Ten Bears,
What science needs to be applied to a situation such as mud bogging in stream beds? Curious what other solution would be out there other then banning the machines?

What do you mean by locked gates only mean a designation barrier? Most trails have markers which clearly tell what the trail can be used for. They even have little pictures on them so that illerate or non native speakers of english can understand what the marker means.

A gate which is locked with a marker saying riding beyond this point is not just a designation barrier it is a barrier meant to stop vehicles. I don't understand why that is so difficult for people on ATV's to understand.

There is ample evidence that riders go around gates, illegally, and carve out new trails in areas where off road travel is un authorized. It has very little to do with non riders and everything to with the inability of the ATV crowd to put up or shut up when it comes to policing their own ranks.

Nemont

 

[Ten Bears]

It has plenty to do with nonriders thinking that EVERY GATE means NO MOTORIZED travel, when in fact that isn't the case. I agree most every gate has a placard, but most nonriders seem to ignore that and complain that ATVs are riding on gated roads, never mind many of those roads are open to ATV travel. A designation barrier is just that, a barrier that lists accepted uses and nonaccepted uses (designates). Mud bogging isn't an ATV event around here, but rather a JEEP & 4X4 truck activity. I do not dispute that ATV's are used illegally, and that there is a need for more enforcement. How can you make something that is already illegal more illegal? Can you show that other motor vehicles are not used to break laws? Can you show that all game animals are taken legally by hunters, and that no illegal animal was ever been tagged to "make it legal"? I've yet to see all the antipoaching programs put an end to poaching; Therefore, using your own logic, hunting must be banned because of the obvious inability of hunters to police their own ranks.....

 

[cjcj]

According to some who post here You can`t go offroad anywhere [legally] So until you enforce the laws that "apply" then you have "nothing" you can ban all you want...but what good does it do if you make it illegal if you don`t enforce the laws/regs?

 

[Ten Bears]

CJCJ;

According to some who post here You can`t go offroad anywhere [legally]....

That is the very "misguided" train of thought that I was referring to.......

NEMONT, I think the science you are looking for is called psychology (possibly sociology).

 

[JoseCuervo]

Originally posted by Ten Bears:
Lack of education (or acceptance) by nonriders is just as much a problem.

That might be the funniest post I have ever read. I truly believe we have now seen the lamest excuse ever provided by the Fat-Assed ATV crowd. According to Ten, it is the lack of edcuation by nonriders that is causing the Fat-Assed ATV crowd to break the law...

UnFriggin' Believable.....

 

[Ten Bears]

Nice twist EG, to quote you, "UnFriggin' Believable..... " I see you still have a knack for either taking a statement out of context (or truly do have a comprehension problem ). Read the rest of the statement....

Here, let me explain (feel read to read slowly as I am typing slowly for you). There are those (nonriders) who see gated roads as closed to all motorized vehicles, regardless of the postings at the gate. They therefore see all use by ATVs of those roads as illegal, even if the road is OPEN for ATV travel. Hence the statement that a lack of education, or level of comprehension, on the issue can and will only elevate the perception of violations..... Was that slow enough for you?

 

[BuzzH]

Ten,

While you're busy arguing, atv's are being restricted more and more each year...keep that in mind.

The good guys are winning this one, and thats all there is to it.

 

[Ten Bears]

BUZZ, what you see as restrictions (negative conotation) I see as designations (positive conotation). While you see more areas being restricted to use by ATVs (and you dance in the merriment of control over others, you really must do something about that little man syndrome. New meds not working?), I see more areas designated / clearly labeled for ATV use.

Outbursts and proclamations of winning are usually made by those who fear losing. Should we revisit the psychology of the matter again? If I remember correctly it has something to do with levels of personal psychological security. Shall we?

 

[BuzzH]

Ten,

Time to wake up and face reality. I can name you hundreds of thousands of acres that were once open to ATV use that are now closed.

Every NF in the country is limiting them more and more. Idaho has outlawed them in many hunting units during hunting season. The BLM has made more restrictions. State lands are being closed to atv's more and more.

Live in denial if you choose, but its hard to ignore the facts.

The restrictions are not over, we're just seeing the start of it.

I'm getting what I want, and thats more restrictions on them. I'm seeing vast acreages being closed, so, yep I'll have to say I'm winning this one.

Hey Ten, dont feel bad, someone has to be a loser, may as well be you.