Crossbows and trapping, again

[rwc101]

Anybody actually hunt with a crossbow? My dad has used one the last couple years in MN. He’s taken plenty of big deer with a compound but that’s no longer really an option for him. MN allows crossbows for medical reasons and people over 60. I personally think this is reasonable without needing to open it up to everyone. I could see for young people too. I ask about anybody hunting with one because those SOBs are heavy and super awkward to carry. And that’s just what I’ve seen in mild terrain. Can’t imagine carrying one of those things around in the mountains. I wouldn’t think it would mean much more competition for people getting away from roads. As suggested, maybe the better option would be to allow them during muzzy or create another limited draw for them if allowing them for regular archery isn’t an option

I was given one, but I haven't hunted with it. A bad shoulder and back make hunting with it seem appealing. I might leave it in Virginia where I can occasionally hunt private land. It does seem heavy and awful to carry up and down mountains.

 

[JohnCushman]

I'm all for a crossbow for someone's who's disabled or elderly. To me, there's no reason an able bodied adult needs to use a crossbow. I can understand a crossbow during archery if you are senior or disabled. I see this as a way for any swinging dick to try and get a hunt in the rut without really having to try very hard. It pisses me off to no end seeing young men on TV who are perfectly able to hunt with an upright, but are out there with a crossbow to fulfill a sponsorship and talk about how great and easy it is to hunt with one. Crossbows are allowed in rifle season, so be happy that you get them. If you are truly disabled or a senior, then get a doctor note and come to archery on a limited basis. All crossbows are going to do is brutally raise the number of hunters in the woods to the point that all archery is going to end up being a draw tag. I personally do most of my hunting with a bow. One reason is for the challenge, and another reason is to have little competition in the woods. As torn up as my shoulder is, I could easily get the doctor to get me a crossbow tag, but I won't do that. Add every joe redneck with a crossbow out there that all they have to do is aim through a scope and pull a trigger and we might as well have a new rifle season with the amount of hunters out there. This is hunting, people, not an episode of the walking dead.

 

[AggieHunter]

I would never carry a crossbow elk hunting to bulky and awkward heavy. I lied, I would if I thought it would give a young kid opportunity who could not draw a bow or a older hunter who couldn't do it on their own then a archery season with a bow would be a perfect hunt for them.

A lot of states you can hunt with a crossbow if you have a medical condition. Met a guy in Colorado who had a form and could hunt anywhere with one

 

[Deleted member 28227]

The reason people hate crossbows back east is because the whole difficulty of archery hunting to them is getting your bow drawn. Most shots are within 30yds or less due to not having clear shots so the learning curve for shooting a compound isn't much.

Not only drawing your bow but sometimes your caught sitting when that buck sneaks in and now you have to stand and draw which is even more difficult. Compared to a crossbow where you're sitting, oh there he is, shoulder the bow, then away it goes.

PA it used to be you had to have a medical reason to shoot a crossbow and when they opened it up for everybody it nearly doubled the archery hunters. Terrible decision.

So... I guess we are in full agreement on the topic lol

 

[DouglasR]

What’s the effective range of a crossbow vs a vertical compound?
Those ravins don’t seem like they’d be any harder to carry than your standard compound to me.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

What’s the effective range of a crossbow vs a vertical compound?
Those ravins don’t seem like they’d be any harder to carry than your standard compound to me.

Assuming shooters of equal skill about the same.

But in reality probably 20 yards more on a crossbow because they are easier to get competent at shooting.

 

[AggieHunter]

What’s the effective range of a crossbow vs a vertical compound?
Those ravins don’t seem like they’d be any harder to carry than your standard compound to me.

You will probably get different answers especially regarding the ethics about certain shot lengths that can vary person to person. You can watch all the popular youtube bowhunters take shots at 80+ but that's definitely not the average max distance for most people. I do know there are crossbows out there now that are accurate to 100 yards but don't know about the energy transferred at that distance. On average I think you may get 20-40 yards depending on what your max range was with a bow.

 

[Nick87]

I'm all for a crossbow for someone's who's disabled or elderly. To me, there's no reason an able bodied adult needs to use a crossbow. I can understand a crossbow during archery if you are senior or disabled. I see this as a way for any swinging dick to try and get a hunt in the rut without really having to try very hard. It pisses me off to no end seeing young men on TV who are perfectly able to hunt with an upright, but are out there with a crossbow to fulfill a sponsorship and talk about how great and easy it is to hunt with one. Crossbows are allowed in rifle season, so be happy that you get them. If you are truly disabled or a senior, then get a doctor note and come to archery on a limited basis. All crossbows are going to do is brutally raise the number of hunters in the woods to the point that all archery is going to end up being a draw tag. I personally do most of my hunting with a bow. One reason is for the challenge, and another reason is to have little competition in the woods. As torn up as my shoulder is, I could easily get the doctor to get me a crossbow tag, but I won't do that. Add every joe redneck with a crossbow out there that all they have to do is aim through a scope and pull a trigger and we might as well have a new rifle season with the amount of hunters out there. This is hunting, people, not an episode of the walking dead.

Agreed. I would add also the recruitment of young hunters possibly. At least here in midwest the weather can be much more forgiving during early part of archery season. Dont get me wrong I'm not advocating for 17 or 18 year olds that could shoot a vertical to use them but I'm guessing a lot of younger hunters 10 thru 15 or so have a hard time shooting 40lb draw comfortably.

 

[teej89]

So... I guess we are in full agreement on the topic lol

100% ✓

 

[cedahm]

I'm guessing a lot of younger hunters 10 thru 15 or so have a hard time shooting 40lb draw comfortably.

Then they should not be hunting deer sized critters with archery tackle in an archery season.

Disclaimer: Not ragging your post @nick87 , your agreement was with Cush’s statements on senior/disabled access and I am on board with that.

I get the recruitment angle, I have an 11yo boy. I took him turkey hunting tonight and let him carry the empty gun downhill back to the truck for practice in handling a firearm in mountainous terrain. But - IMO, if a kid can’t shoot a bow accurately at an appropriate draw weight, then they should be in the position of a helper/observer/mentee, not behind the release of a more effective weapon in a weapon-restricted season just because they are young.

My take on the main point - if we are going to have primitive weapon seasons (that basically allow an enormous amount of participation given low success rates), then keep them primitive. Otherwise they will just reduce tags to match the new efficacy and we might as well allow rifles from September to December and have super low tag numbers and high costs to offset the efficacy and the balance sheet.

 

[F250]

I have hunted with a crossbow for the past seven years. I have had surgeries to both of my shoulders and my back. While I can run a chain saw all day, I don't have the range of motion to use a vertical bow. I have taken around 2 dozen deer with it. I have the Excalibur 380 Matrix ( 260 lb. recurve, 380 fps.). I shoot 100 gr. Grim Reaper mechanicals. I @#)(# it with the rope system that it comes with. From the bench, it will "Robin Hood" arrows at 50 yards. For me, even with this upper end speed-wise rig, a crossbow is a 35 -40 yard weapon. It is heavy, clumsy, and noisy to carry. I have hunted western states : Colorado, New Mexico, Wyoming, Utah. There is no way I would try to hunt out there with one of these things !!! Lugging one of these things around in the mountains is simply not feasible. I don't believe they are much of a threat to an elk, unless you can set up in a blind or treestand near a waterhole, or agriculture field.

 

[Nick87]

Then they should not be hunting deer sized critters with archery tackle in an archery season.

Disclaimer: Not ragging your post @nick87 , your agreement was with Cush’s statements on senior/disabled access and I am on board with that.

I get the recruitment angle, I have an 11yo boy. I took him turkey hunting tonight and let him carry the empty gun downhill back to the truck for practice in handling a firearm in mountainous terrain. But - IMO, if a kid can’t shoot a bow accurately at an appropriate draw weight, then they should be in the position of a helper/observer/mentee, not behind the release of a more effective weapon in a weapon-restricted season just because they are young.

My take on the main point - if we are going to have primitive weapon seasons (that basically allow an enormous amount of participation given low success rates), then keep them primitive. Otherwise they will just reduce tags to match the new efficacy and we might as well allow rifles from September to December and have super low tag numbers and high costs to offset the efficacy and the balance sheet.

Every kid is different, some kids that are smaller build may be a lot more mature than others that are bigger, older etc. I dont think upper body strength should be the determining factor of when each kid should be able to start hunting. I know there is youth firearm season etc. Sometimes tags aren't drawn or other reasons that early archery season might just work better for taking them out. The last thing I'm going to do is discriminate any kid from wanting to participate as long as he/she is mature enough mentally to do it safely. Unfortunately that too paints a broad stroke for what age kids start hunting which should be determined more by the parent however I know that's not always the case. I agree with your point on primitive weapon season staying primitive also.

 

[Northwoods Labs]

Crossbows are a huge advantage in the east because you don't have to draw on a deer (anyone who doesn't think this is a big advantage hasn't hunted whitetails in the east).

I'd just say be careful what you wish for, because once crossbows are allowed for everyone there is no going back. The crowd on HuntTalk really doesn't represent the broad hunting community. Sadly, there are substantial amounts of hunters that are pro-"anything that makes it easier." Crossbows make it easier to harvest deer, so they will get a lot of support

 

[Shangobango]

As someone who bought a crossbow last year because of my bum right drawing shoulder, I wish that crossbows were limited to elderly and those with medical conditions.

I am working very hard toward being able to use my Matthews again. I am too darn young not to be able to bow hunt.

The trapping laws In Colorado and many other States are already ridiculous. Taking away cage and box traps is just absurd. What States with such laws are saying in my opinion is” don’t touch the State’s furbearers”. So much for public ownership of wildlife.

 

[jlmatthew]

Let the hate begin!

 

[Oak]

Let the hate begin!

Why hate? Sounds like most are advocating for something that you've clearly shown is already in place.

 

[Pelican]

The petition to ban trapping (what’s left of it) in Colorado was withdrawn by the petitioner. Crossbow petition was unanimously rejected.

 

[Wildabeest]

I’d probably side with not allowing crossbows during archery for reasons stated previously. But I can’t understand why a crossbow would not be allow during special muzzleloader season in states like mine that have that. I think that’s the more appropriate place for them. Where I grew up they called it “primitive weapons season” and allowed bow, crossbow and muzzleloader during that season - which went from Sept to January. But the technology of those weapons has come A LONG way since then! I wouldn’t consider any of those “primitive” these days unless you’re using a long bow or flint lock!

 

[wyoelkfan15]

Speaking from Wyoming where they are already legal in archery season. The several guys I know who hunt with them outright tell me it's cheating when compared to even a compound bow. Apparently they feel comfortable out to 100-125 yards.

Now, how much that has damaged the resource? Hard to say.

 

[cur dog]

100-125 yds. B.S.
These guys are idiots.
Crossbows have been legal in Wyoming for 40 years. Their elk herd is outstanding.