Corner crossing the 10th ruling

[KingOfTagSoup]

Chalk one up for the good guys...

Appeals court backs corner crossers in Wyoming public lands case - WyoFile

Federal three-judge panel supports decision that corner crossing in Wyoming’s checkerboard area is not trespassing as long as private land is not touched.

wyofile.com

Well done. Is there any hint on whether they will appeal to SCOTUS?

 

[ClearCreek]

Let’s see how the landowners react. Are they going to intimidate, block or claim some didn’t cross exactly at the corner and touched their property?

On property corners where there is NO "brass cap" I believe both parties will have to prove where the person accessing the land actually stepped.

This may be very difficult without a land survey pinpointing the exact corner.

It is my understanding that courts will not accept the accessing persons GPS coordinates as proof of the legal crossing point. So, conversly the court should not accept the landowners GPS coordinates as proof of where the tresspass occured.

This could become interesting.


ClearCreek

 

[Labman]

I believe both parties will have to prove …

This is America. The citizen doesn’t have to prove innocence, that’s a presumption. It’s all on the govt to prove you broke the law, you should never try to prove you didn’t.

Google “why you should never talk to the police” and watch the 46 min video that comes up as the first result. It would be well worth your time.

 

[Elky Welky]

Well done. Is there any hint on whether they will appeal to SCOTUS?

They could, but I predict SCOTUS won't take it. SCOTUS only hears about 1% of the cases filed every year.

 

[Elky Welky]

This is America. The citizen doesn’t have to prove innocence, that’s a presumption. It’s all on the govt to prove you broke the law, you should never try to prove you didn’t.

Google “why you should never talk to the police” and watch the 46 min video that comes up as the first result. It would be well worth your time.

In a civil suit, as this was, both parties will be expected to argue the facts. There's no presumption of innocence in a civil suit.

 

[NY_BLUES]

This is America. The citizen doesn’t have to prove innocence, that’s a presumption. It’s all on the govt to prove you broke the law, you should never try to prove you didn’t.

Google “why you should never talk to the police” and watch the 46 min video that comes up as the first result. It would be well worth your time.

Don't want to talk to cops? Fine, don't call them when someone messes with your stuff. It's a 2 way road.

 

[NY_BLUES]

In a civil suit, as this was, both parties will be expected to argue the facts. There's no presumption of innocence in a civil suit.

Correct. Civil suits are based on "a perponderance of evidence" or more likely to have happened than not. Justice scales are tipped at 51%, which is not the same as beyond a reasonable doubt. Case and point, OJ Simpson. Found not guilty of 2 counts of murder, but was found liable in the wrongful death suits that followed.

 

[Labman]

Don't want to talk to cops? Fine, don't call them when someone messes with your stuff. It's a 2 way road.

Did you watch the video? I love most cops, have a few buddies that are in LE, one warden too. I’ve asked them all to watch that video, and they all say it’s spot on. My GW bud said he would have only written about 10% of the tickets he wrote if people would have taken the advice in that video.

 

[bowhuntmontana]

Anyone else wondering if there are plans to initiate cases like this in other circuits/states that aren't part of the 10th? Seems like that has been a legal strategy for other issues.

 

[BuzzH]

Anyone else wondering if there are plans to initiate cases like this in other circuits/states that aren't part of the 10th? Seems like that has been a legal strategy for other issues.

Go for it.

 

[NY_BLUES]

Did you watch the video? I love most cops, have a few buddies that are in LE, one warden too. I’ve asked them all to watch that video, and they all say it’s spot on. My GW bud said he would have only written about 10% of the tickets he wrote if people would have taken the advice in that video.

I did watch the video. I work in LE. That video is spot on, and yes I agree that many people give us information that we wouldn't otherwise know if they didn't tell us. People talk themselves into handcuffs and tickets all time.
I stand by my statement though, if you don't want to talk to me ever, fine. But ever is a long time with very broad circumstances.

 

[Addicting]

Go for it.

 

[Sheltowee]

View attachment 364827

Don't think I'd try my luck asserting UICA to a state-owned chunk.

 

[JM77]

Don't want to talk to cops? Fine, don't call them when someone messes with your stuff. It's a 2 way road.

This statement tells me what kind of LEO you are. I have family and friends in LO and they are nothing like you.

 

[NR_Hunter]

Don't want to talk to cops? Fine, don't call them when someone messes with your stuff. It's a 2 way road.

"Incriminate yourself at our behest or we will refuse to be a professional police force."

It's that pesky 5th Amendment always getting in the way!

 

[NY_BLUES]

This statement tells me what kind of LEO you are. I have family and friends in LO and they are nothing like you.

You don't know anything about me.

 

[NY_BLUES]

"Incriminate yourself at our behest or we will refuse to be a professional police force."

It's that pesky 5th Amendment always getting in the way!

Not what I said. I don't need you to tell me everything that you have ever done. The video that was referenced was done by a defense attorney, who's job it is to keep people from being found guilty of crimes. I also said that the video was spot on. The post that I referenced that you quote tells of a video where the guy is saying not to speak to the police ever, for any reason. So, with that advice from that attorney, that would also be to report a crime, because the nasty, scary police could use that 911 call against you.

This has gone way off the corner crossing topic.

 

[NR_Hunter]

Not what I said. I don't need you to tell me everything that you have ever done. The video that was referenced was done by a defense attorney, who's job it is to keep people from being found guilty of crimes. I also said that the video was spot on. The post that I referenced that you quote tells of a video where the guy is saying not to speak to the police ever, for any reason. So, with that advice from that attorney, that would also be to report a crime, because the nasty, scary police could use that 911 call against you.

This has gone way off the corner crossing topic.

Okay, well in that case I won't take that attorney's advice not to report a crime against my property. It's not against the law to not talk to the police. It's not against the law to report a crime. In a free society, we should be able to depend on a professional police force to uphold the law, not pick and choose who they are willing to help, because that's how your post came across. It also came across to me like sour grapes if a citizen feels like exercising their civil rights.

 

[NY_BLUES]

Okay, well in that case I won't take that attorney's advice not to report a crime against my property. It's not against the law to not talk to the police. It's not against the law to report a crime. In a free society, we should be able to depend on a professional police force to uphold the law, not pick and choose who they are willing to help, because that's how your post came across. It also came across to me like sour grapes if a citizen if a citizen feels like exercising their civil rights.

I watched the video as the poster asked. It's well done, and I stated 2 times that it is correct. People who give statements to police about their involvement, or non involvement in crimes tend to get charged more than people that don't. My statement was sarcastic in nature, but definitely has not been taken that way.
However, the video States that even your 911 call can be used as evidence in criminal proceedings, so if attorney advise is to never talk to cops, then don't call 911, so that your statements to the dispatchers can't be used. I can see how my statement looks, however my intention was never to say that i wouldn't help someone because they won't talk to me.
I also think it's easy for people who have never been cops, to bash us based on what they see or hear. I also think that the longer someone is in law enforcement, the more cynical they become, which leads to statements like mine, and in the context of this conversation, can be taken a multitude of ways.

 

[Carl 9.3x62]

So, who's going to be hunting Elk Mountain this fall?