RobG
Well-known member
Maybe this round, but what’s to say it won’t happen with the next governor?
Competition grows to auction off coveted hunting tags
- Thread starter Oak
- Start date
BigHornRam
Well-known member
Who should get to decide then?
Nameless Range
Well-known member
I could imagine some sort of scoring criteria - much the same as hiring a state employee or a public entity awarding a contract. It seemed the commissioners weren't even sure what considerations dictate who they choose.
Some I would include, the weight of each would need to be figured:
-Amount they will potentially raise
-From Montana
-Past role in conservation
etc.
Maybe it is just a threshold, and from there is an element of lottery for the lottery. For example, if ten groups meet the criteria for receiving a single auction/raffle tag they are pursuing, then those ten groups would be placed in a pool and the recipient randomly drawn.
I think there are a lot of fair and effective ways to do this and at the least, the commissioners should know what criteria merits their decisions.
RobG
Well-known member
Good question. Therein lies my problem with these tags that are auctioned by NGOs.
RobG
Well-known member
re past role in conservation... my memory of Idaho is the commission thought predator control was conservation. And isn't Utah in love with SFW? I could be wrong, but to me, the whole idea of any organization getting a windfall is a bad one.
BigHornRam
Well-known member
Sounds to to me that is already being used. Some of the commisioners wanted to try something new with the mule deer tag, especially since it has not been bringing in a lot of revenue lately.
Nameless Range
Well-known member
I guess I missed where "what is already being used" is explicitly mentioned. I don't think it is.
From the article:
“If we’re going to continue to get more and more competitors, if you will, for each license, it would feel a lot more comfortable to this commissioner if we had more specific criteria that we’re trying to achieve,” said Commissioner Patrick Tabor, of Whitefish. “Because I don’t know if the goal is accruing the maximum amount of return to the department, so now we’re trying to figure which auction or which lottery will get us the most amount of money, or if there’s criteria we should be looking at in terms of the behavior of the association with their money.”
SAJ-99
Well-known member
Yes. Seemed odd when I heard of the result too, but there is no dedicated Moose conservation org. At least DU doubled the money through the federal PR funding and used it on actual conservation projects. This year from MOGEI we get something like “Moose Awareness Week”.
These sales provide valuable funds for conservation projects. Ended them would be bad, but a more transparent selection process could help resolve many questions.
BigHornRam
Well-known member
He said he wants "more" specific criteria. That means he had criteria to make a decision. My interpretation reading the article, is Tabor wanted to find a reason not to select the BHA proposal. 3 other Commisioners out weighed his vote. Ultimately 5 people get to interpret that criteria, and sometimes they will interpret it differently.
If you want to work to come up with a better system, by all means try. I've said my thoughts and am done splitting hairs.
Last edited:
100% on board with your last paragraph.
You aren't getting "moose awareness week," you're getting 90% of the funding going to the agency for projects like this: https://fwp.mt.gov/conservation/wil...fe,relative importance of factors influencing
The 10% is essentially for the marketing to sell the license.
RobG
Well-known member
Why can't FWP auction them directly?
Nameless Range
Well-known member
This is a great question. Whether it is an auction or a raffle, seems we could skip the middle man.
They are not allowed per statute, iirc.
And I think if the agency starts auctioning them off, then the politicians start licking their lips even more. Remember this gem?
BigHornRam
Well-known member
Really? Then we would have to hire 5 more FWP employees to run this auction that would undoubtedly turn into a SS and would bring in a fraction of what is currently being raised. That makes a hell of a lot of sense!
RobG
Well-known member
I am so burned out from politics I don't, but I don't see how an auction is going to cause any more problems because it comes from FWP instead of an NGO.
Nameless Range
Well-known member
I could imagine them contracting out the administration of an auction, at which all the tags would be auctioned. Be interesting to see how effective such a thing would be. The state runs auctions all the time already for surplus equipment and vehicles.
Seems moot though, as Ben linked to above.
Last edited:
SAJ-99
Well-known member
What if one of GG’s acquaintances “won” the tag?
Tongue in cheek. As I pointed out, having 10% to recoup the cost of the auction makes a larger organization more attractive because they have efficiencies of scale having run auctions before, and it made DU even more attractive because they doubled the money through PR funds.
Even Tabor discussed the commission focus to figure a better means to identify best method for the selection process - whether to maintain local (MT) ties or open it for national, etc.
Hopefully, WE share our thoughts and they take into account the brighter ideas presented and move forward. sometimes though, fixing a wheel that rolls makes more problems... Seems $ has been raised. I'd like to see it stay with Montana conservation organizations.
Blah, off to send my commissioner (honcho Tabor) an email sharing my thoughts. Hopefully others are doing the same with your commissioner. AND hopefully transparency, disregard other State organization attempts as @Schaaf shared, etc...
fwp.mt.gov
Hopefully, WE share our thoughts and they take into account the brighter ideas presented and move forward. sometimes though, fixing a wheel that rolls makes more problems... Seems $ has been raised. I'd like to see it stay with Montana conservation organizations.
Blah, off to send my commissioner (honcho Tabor) an email sharing my thoughts. Hopefully others are doing the same with your commissioner. AND hopefully transparency, disregard other State organization attempts as @Schaaf shared, etc...
Fish And Wildlife Commission Members | Montana FWP
The Commission sets fish and wildlife regulations, approves property acquisitions, and approves certain rules and activities of the Fish, Wildlife & Parks Department as provided by statute.
fwp.mt.gov
Elky Welky
Well-known member
Perhaps one of the simplest fixes is not allowing these tags to go to the same groups year after year, but awarding them to different orgs and not allowing a group to reapply for a period of time. Spread the wealth around.
As you might expect, I'm elated MT-BHA gets to run a raffle and a lucky member of the public will get to hunt mule deer anywhere in MT for the cost of only a $20 ticket, instead of an individual with $30k to spare.
As you might expect, I'm elated MT-BHA gets to run a raffle and a lucky member of the public will get to hunt mule deer anywhere in MT for the cost of only a $20 ticket, instead of an individual with $30k to spare.
If one puts this in the context of the Public Trust Doctrine, one of the operating principles of appointed/elected officials, it's a pretty easy answer - The Trustee should award the use of an asset that is part of Trust Corpus to the group or individual who can obtain the greatest return the Trust, all within the sideboards of what is legally allowed.
I understand there is a lot more that enters these discussions than just the Public Trust responsibilities of the Trustee. Not that I am a Commissioner or Trustee, but if I were, I would ask for legal clarification of who are qualified by statute, then select the organization deemed most likely to obtain the greatest return for the Tag/Trust Corpus.
The Trustee is being asked, in this case, legally mandated, to part with Trust Corpus represented by this statewide tag. Trustees' fiduciary duties require obtaining the greatest return on any Trust Corpus being allocated away from the Trust.
I'm sure I'd get flamed by some groups for approaching it that way. But, if we are going down this path by statute, then the Trustees have guidance under the PTD of how they should decide.
I understand there is a lot more that enters these discussions than just the Public Trust responsibilities of the Trustee. Not that I am a Commissioner or Trustee, but if I were, I would ask for legal clarification of who are qualified by statute, then select the organization deemed most likely to obtain the greatest return for the Tag/Trust Corpus.
The Trustee is being asked, in this case, legally mandated, to part with Trust Corpus represented by this statewide tag. Trustees' fiduciary duties require obtaining the greatest return on any Trust Corpus being allocated away from the Trust.
I'm sure I'd get flamed by some groups for approaching it that way. But, if we are going down this path by statute, then the Trustees have guidance under the PTD of how they should decide.
Similar threads
