A Navy Veteran’s perspective on racism

[Dougfirtree]

Prior to getting 86’d, Mudder did a wonderful job of displaying the attitude of, “its okay to be different, just don’t do it in a way that makes me uncomfortable “. He then doubled down and made the analogy of slipping through a crowd unseen.

The ignorance is stunning, but honestly he did a far more effective job of driving home the reality than I ever could. Our society fears people who are different.

My family took part in a small BLM support protest in our tiny, peaceful town in the Adirondacks, the other day. Leading up to it, there was a lot of talk from residents about why we would need to do something like this in our nice little town. 'That's big-city stuff'. 'There's no hate here.' It was a very peaceful affair, the local sherriff spoke for a few minutes about his support for peaceful protest and his recognition of the problem we were there to address. About a hundred people showed up, mostly white folks. Not 3 minutes into it, I'm standing right next to my 10 year old son on one side and a young black man on the other side and a car drives by, a woman leans out the window, gives us the finger and yells, "F%^k N&^%$#rs" as loud as she can. My son gave me this look and you could see the wheels turning for him, like, "whoah, that's what we're here about."

I read the article that started this thread as well and found it pretty disturbing. I have to say though, that reading this thread and seeing so many of you listening to the writer's experiences, thinking about them and responding in the way you have has driven home one of the reasons I like this forum so much. It's heartening and only amplified by the intelligent oversight from Big Fin.

 

[Europe]

Cheyenne, his loss

Big Fin, Remember several days ago when you told me you were afraid someone would do exactly what Mudder did. You saw it happening even before this thread was started---and--you ended it quickly when it happened. Thank you

 

[MTLabrador]

Wow, that escalated quickly. Thanks for posting JLS. Good read and very thought provoking.

 

[mountainlaurel3]

Cheyenne, his loss

Big Fin, Remember several days ago when you told me you were afraid someone would do exactly what Mudder did. You saw it happening even before this thread was started---and--you ended it quickly when it happened. Thank you

+1
Compared to most places on the internet, this forum is heartening.

 

[Deleted member 38069]

I typically avoid these hot topic threads but I felt compelled to type my simplistic approach.

I served active duty in the Air Force, and there were no division of races. Some of my best friends were/are minorities. They busted their asses and climbed the ladder. My first point is, we didn't have time to fight each other due to differences because we had shit to do. I wish that would resonate more in law enforcement camaraderie and extend to citizens!

My second point, is if you listen/read what Jesus said in that we are ALL God's children and we will be judged based off of how we love others, the world would be a little better place.
Same point without religion embedded, if you have any sort of heart, you would never perform that act on Mr. Floyd. Or let it happen! It takes a strong person to be positive and a weak one to be negative all the time!

I wish I had Chad's phone number to go fishing with him! Stay positive HT, it has a ripple effect and it can start with you!

 

[MTelkHuntress]

I'm not sure if I just dont see it, but I feel like I rarely saw minorities in outdoor media before all this, and when I did it was like some special occasion. I think it needs to be more normalized as well as their stories being told.
I've had so many discussions like this with my friends that I dont even know where to start. I think Vikingsguy mentioned above how good people dont want to get into politics because of the mess and I really think he hit the nail on the head. The whole "cancel culture" has just gotten out of hand. People make mistakes, but people can also change and learn from them (if they choose to do so). It opens up a conversation, which is exactly what we need.
For years I kept hearing people talk about how racism doesnt exist anymore, and this always made me really angry. My mom gets told to go back to her country all the time and it's so frustrating. She always told me how lucky I was that I could pass for white. Every summer she would put ridiculous amounts of sunscreen on me to make sure I wouldn't get dark, because that's when I would "look the most Mexican".
My parents own a business and one day a woman called in and started complaining that she couldnt understand my mom's accent. My mom has a very subtle accent and the conversation escalated to the woman yelling at my mom very horrible profanities and telling my mom to go back to her country. The woman later left a horrible review about their business (not mentioning how racist she was) and it was so frustrating because we couldnt really respond about how unreasonable and racist she was.
I would get called names all the time in school and I even stopped speaking Spanish because I didnt want to be Mexican. I didnt want to be alienated.

When I meet people in the hunting community, I'm always a little apprehensive because sometimes once I say my name, the conversation of where the name comes from is initiated and it sometimes doesnt have the best outcome. It's so silly that humans have put up these divides that dont mean anything. I just really hope real change comes from all of this. I have noticed some minority groups being unsure of the BLM movement, but I think the younger generation is stepping up and showing solidarity while educating others.

Great article and I'm glad we are having this conversation because I honestly didnt really expect to see it here.

 

[rwc101]

These threads have a way of both expanding and contracting my ignored members list.

 

[Irrelevant]

I typically avoid these hot topic threads but I felt compelled to type my simplistic approach.

I served active duty in the Air Force, and there was no division of races. Some of my best friends were/are minorities. They busted their asses and climbed the ladder. My first point is, we didn't have time to fight each other because of differences because we had shit to do. I wish that would resonate more in law enforcement camaraderie and extend to citizens!

My second point, is if you listen/read what Jesus said in that we are ALL God's children and we will be loved based off of how we love others, the world would be a little better place.
Same point without religion embedded, if you have any sort of heart, you would never perform that act on Mr. Mr. Floyd. Or let it happen! It takes a strong person to be positive and a weak one to be negative all the time!

I wish I had Chad's phone number to go fishing with him! Stay positive HT! It has a ripple effect and it can start with you!

Chad Brown - Soul River Runs Deep

Chad Brown M.Sc. – Creative Director/Designer Contact: [email protected] Chad Brown, decorated US Navy veteran who received multiple honors after serving in Desert Storm Gulf War and Operation Restore Hope, Somalia, struggles today with PTSD. The illness nearly drove him to suicide...

soulriverrunsdeep.com

I've tried hard to stay out of conversations about race the last week or so. Social media has been particularly toxic. I simply don't understand our current situation. And what I've read and what I've experienced in my life don't jive.

 

[TheJason]

Chad Brown - Soul River Runs Deep

Chad Brown M.Sc. – Creative Director/Designer Contact: [email protected] Chad Brown, decorated US Navy veteran who received multiple honors after serving in Desert Storm Gulf War and Operation Restore Hope, Somalia, struggles today with PTSD. The illness nearly drove him to suicide...

soulriverrunsdeep.com

I've tried hard to stay out of conversations about race the last week or so. Social media has been particularly toxic. I simply don't understand our current situation. And what I've read and what I've experienced in my life don't jive.

I agree with all of what you said. The reality I remind myself of continually is I can never truly know the struggles black people, and all minorities frankly, face on a daily basis. As a result, I find myself much less likely to be dismissive of their fears, concerns, and frustrations.

 

[Hammsolo]

Good read.

Thoughts on the killing of George Floyd

Wait before you judge. Take a deep breath. Because you can. In the wake of the murder of George Floyd, I’ve seen countless people on social media expressing their rage — not about George’s death or about the underlying problem of inequality in our country — but about looting and physical damage...

www.hatchmag.com

What an amazing article! I grew up in Anaconda, MT in a non-native and non- mining family. My Dad was retired Air Force. He was a psychologist at Montana State prison. My Mom was a highly educated nurse. Why do I tell you this? My family was ostracized for this. My family taught me to be open-minded.

I had a friend move to town, Nate. He was from Belize... I learned what racism was through him. He dealt with events I never came close to in spite of being a huge pain in the A in high school. I constantly drank and fought and was never charged. I nearly killed people... and not proud. I tried hard to defend Nate and push people to open their minds.

The strangest times were when I would hear people railing on “N-words.” I’d confront them about Nate, and they would say he’s different. I’d ask them what other black people they knew and they’d mention the only two other families in town. They liked them too... They’d say the other “n-words” were different... Inspite of not knowing them... so weird.

Look at what you actually know. Look at your own experience. Open your mind, and believe in the greater good. We are so blessed to love in this country, with this public land. We must keep moving forward to learn. Growing pains are hard, but I love this country and want it to continue to improve.

 

[Hammsolo]

GF was not a good person. Career criminal with numerous felonies and multiple convictions and prison terms. His last arrest was for trying to push a counterfeit $20 onto an unsuspecting citizen who was on it. During this guy’s initial contact with the Leo’s he dropped a dime bag of white; obviously racist” powder on to the ground. Oops . His autopsy showed fentanyl, cocaine and mj in his blood. Snap! Yeah this is the guy I’m gonna riot for.

Sources? Did he deserve to die?

 

[LousyResident]

I've had several hard conversations with minority friends over the last couple of weeks. One of the things I told a friend was that I simply didn't want to talk about such a tragic, complicated situation as the murder of George Floyd. And yet, I admitted that I recognized that simply having the opportunity to ignore the conversations gives me a uniquely privileged position in society. If I wanted to, I could probably turn a blind eye to much of this and go on with my life without a hiccup. None of my minority friends really have that option.

I think most progress is accomplished in private conversations with people that you genuinely love and care about. Their personal experiences with racism can be very eye opening. But I will say this which I've been mulling over for several days:

When I was younger I used to be very pro death penalty. I took a hard line approach that some offenses were simply punishable by death. Even the bible says something about "if you shed a man's blood then by man shall your blood be shed." But over the years I have softened on that approach a lot, partially due to becoming a father, getting older and hopefully wiser, and also by seeing men on death row get proven innocent by things like improved DNA technology. The more I think about it, the more I realize that I the instances where it is reasonable to take someone's life are extraordinarily few. Don't get me wrong, if I wake up in the middle of the night to someone in my home, threatening my family, I will do whatever it takes to protect my family. However, if the situations where is is reasonable to take someone's life in general are extraordinarily rare, then it should be even more extraordinarily rare for one person to reasonably be the judge, jury, and executioner of another human being. Criminal or not, Mr. Floyd's actions/record certainly wouldn't have warranted a death penalty conviction. Even more so, his actions/record certainly didn't warrant a small group of police officers acting as judges, jury, and executioners that tragic day.

God forbid I, or any other, ever take the life of any of God's children out of hate, negligence, malice, racism, or any other sinful heart condition.

 

[mdeerjunkie]

I've had several hard conversations with minority friends over the last couple of weeks. One of the things I told a friend was that I simply didn't want to talk about such a tragic, complicated situation as the murder of George Floyd. And yet, I admitted that I recognized that simply having the opportunity to ignore the conversations gives me a uniquely privileged position in society. If I wanted to, I could probably turn a blind eye to much of this and go on with my life without a hiccup. None of my minority friends really have that option.

I think most progress is accomplished in private conversations with people that you genuinely love and care about. Their personal experiences with racism can be very eye opening. But I will say this which I've been mulling over for several days:

When I was younger I used to be very pro death penalty. I took a hard line approach that some offenses were simply punishable by death. Even the bible says something about "if you shed a man's blood then by man shall your blood be shed." But over the years I have softened on that approach a lot, partially due to becoming a father, getting older and hopefully wiser, and also by seeing men on death row get proven innocent by things like improved DNA technology. The more I think about it, the more I realize that I the instances where it is reasonable to take someone's life are extraordinarily few. Don't get me wrong, if I wake up in the middle of the night to someone in my home, threatening my family, I will do whatever it takes to protect my family. However, if the situations where is is reasonable to take someone's life in general are extraordinarily rare, then it should be even more extraordinarily rare for one person to reasonably be the judge, jury, and executioner of another human being. Criminal or not, Mr. Floyd's actions/record certainly wouldn't have warranted a death penalty conviction. Even more so, his actions/record certainly didn't warrant a small group of police officers acting as judges, jury, and executioners that tragic day.

God forbid I, or any other, ever take the life of any of God's children out of hate, negligence, malice, racism, or any other sinful heart condition.

Very well said.

 

[TheJason]

@ajricketts the Central Park 5 come to mind, no?

 

[Scott85]

I will always treat everyone like I want to be treated and treat everyone with respect. There is a new bluegrass song that has a line in it that everyone should always remember. “The thing about kindness is that is doesn’t cost a thing.”

 

[glass eye]

I have a hunting buddy who is black as night and we travel all over the continent together. He gets ridiculed by his black friends for doing "white sh_t".
I also see his uneasiness when we travel through certain areas.
Too much Black & White

 

[Deleted member 38069]

Not as simple but I've always said, people could learn a lot from dogs!

 

[TwistedSage]

I think this last round of protests have brought the very uncomfortable truth to the forefront yet again and this time it is not going to be swept back under the rug.

The protests bring the awareness to the issue as a catalyst to vote for change. Our options to vote for are awful and I have no idea how there can be legislation against systemic racism. It's all going to come down to individuals and hoping we can support each other and come together before the politicians tear the country apart.

What is someone to do that hasn't taken part in discrimination or someone that this is a non issue for in them and thier peers in daily life? Listen and understand that this is a real issue in other parts of this great big country and people are hurting and this has been going on for generations.

 

[Hammsolo]

I’m glad you commented.

Chad Brown - Soul River Runs Deep

Chad Brown M.Sc. – Creative Director/Designer Contact: [email protected] Chad Brown, decorated US Navy veteran who received multiple honors after serving in Desert Storm Gulf War and Operation Restore Hope, Somalia, struggles today with PTSD. The illness nearly drove him to suicide...

soulriverrunsdeep.com

I've tried hard to stay out of conversations about race the last week or so. Social media has been particularly toxic. I simply don't understand our current situation. And what I've read and what I've experienced in my life don't jive.

I’m glad you commented. My personal life is very sheltered, but I’m a teacher and see it all the time. The first step is to open our eyes to learning, and accepting we all see our world through different binos. I can be sitting right next to my brother on a hillside and he spots a deer I cannot see...

 

[glass eye]

On a lighter note. One time when my friend and I were taking our seats together on a plane to Alaska, a flight attendant asked us if we were traveling together. She seemed concerned that an old grey bearded white man and a large black dude would be seated together. When we said " Yes, we are traveling together" then you could see her face change and now she saw us as an inter-racial gay couple. Why else would black & white mix. LOL