Williams named Principal Deputy Director, US Fish and Wildlife Service

[Hunting Wife]

Things are happening fast today. Among those named to agency leadership positions in Interior is Martha Williams (former Director of MT Fish, Wildlife and Parks) as Deputy Director of USFWS.

Montana FWP director selected by Biden for USFWS leadership role ~ Missoula Current

 

[Deleted member 28227]

Ep. 199: Big Pieces of the Brain Pie | MeatEater Podcasts

Steven Rinella talks with Director of Montana Fish, Wildlife, and Parks, Martha Williams, Greg Lemon, and Janis Putelis.Topics discussed: A fancy playdate that includes some deer stalking; different names for your fish and game agency; death to blue laws; hunting with an atlatl; regular science...

www.themeateater.com

Here’s Martha Williams on meateater

 

[MTGomer]

What’s the governmental term for this? ‘Failing up’?
I wish her the best. I’m sure her FWP job was a hard one, but I’m glad she’s out of it and hope that the new gentleman can/wants to turn things around.

 

[Ben Lamb]

What’s the governmental term for this? ‘Failing up’?
I wish her the best. I’m sure her FWP job was a hard one, but I’m glad she’s out of it and hope that the new gentleman can/wants to turn things around.

She was the chief legal counsel for the National Parks System under Sally Jewell & I think she did some really transformative work at FWP that's not easily seen until you start looking under the covers. She also oversaw the largest investment of sportsmen dollars in capital expenditures to update, improve and modernize the website, facilities across the state & her leadership saw a massive improvement in how state parks are managed. I think she did well there, all things considered.

This is a good move for westerners. She is a brilliant legal mind, and she is steeped in the wisdom and traditions of western wildlife management, including supporting removing Grizzly Bears from the Endangered Species Lists, and wolves in areas where they are recovered.

This is a good appointment.

 

[MTGomer]

I hope you’re right Ben. From someone on the outside looking in, much more simplistically I’ll admit, wildlife management and public hunting are worse off at the end of her term than they were when she started.
That’s not to say it’s all her fault but these things reflect on leaders regardless.

 

[JLS]

Most folks will fixate on the big on the windshield issues, also assuming the director has complete autonomy to do their job. I’m pretty sure there’s been more than one instance where that wasn’t the case.

All of FWPs problems don’t necessarily lie within FWP.

 

[MTGomer]

Most folks will fixate on the big on the windshield issues, also assuming the director has complete autonomy to do their job. I’m pretty sure there’s been more than one instance where that wasn’t the case.

All of FWPs problems don’t necessarily lie within FWP.

The podcast WLLM posted is worth a listen if you haven’t heard it

 

[Ben Lamb]

I hope you’re right Ben. From someone on the outside looking in, much more simplistically I’ll admit, wildlife management and public hunting are worse off at the end of her term than they were when she started.
That’s not to say it’s all her fault but these things reflect on leaders regardless.

I don't disagree, but it took MT decades to get messed up, and it will take that long to right the ship. Her work helped not only provide a solid foundation for that work, it provided a blue print that new administration won't just be able to walk away from.

FWP also has to live by the rules set in statute by the legislature, let's not forget those 150 biologists who know much more than anyone else.

 

[TOGIE]

given what ben has said, i'm thinking about this through the lense of colorado and the fact that many of my huge gripes with our wildlife management and what's coming down the pipe seems to have more to do with the governor, the voters, and the commission. director prenzlow is valiantly leading the charge in trying to keep sanity in our train wreck from my perspective

 

[JLS]

The podcast WLLM posted is worth a listen if you haven’t heard it

I’ve listened to it.

 

[BuzzH]

I don't disagree, but it took MT decades to get messed up, and it will take that long to right the ship.

Not really...flat not being willing to change anything for 6 decades is how MT got messed up.

Then, Montana doubled down on opportunity, while systematically ignoring science and wildlife biology in the early 2000's. Combine that with bending over backward for every interest group, other than hunters/fishermen and not putting wildlife first...that's how we got here.

It wouldnt take decades to fix either if folks were half serious about fixing it...

 

[Ben Lamb]

Not really...flat not being willing to change anything for 6 decades is how MT got messed up.

Then, Montana doubled down on opportunity, while systematically ignoring science and wildlife biology in the early 2000's. Combine that with bending over backward for every interest group, other than hunters/fishermen and not putting wildlife first...that's how we got here.

It wouldnt take decades to fix either if folks were half serious about fixing it...

I'm not talking about just the hunting opportunities. I'm talking about the agency as an entity.

1.) A former parks director hid millions of dollars in the hopes of establishing a new state agency only for parks. That led to massive underfunding of maintenance needs across all state parks. It also created a ton of animosity from the legislature because of the lies that went around on why the money did or didn't get spent.

2.) That agency is legally mandated to manage deer, elk, pronghorn and other species at or below objective. I don't know of any other state that makes it illegal to have an overabundance of wildlife. The legislative interference in how Montana manages wildlife cannot be under-stated. We've handed wildlife management over to the drunks at the Buckhorn.

3.) That agency suffers from loss of institutional history, short-timer's syndrome & being battered by the legislature. They're like abused kids. When you look at Fisheries, Parks, Con Ed, etc, those divisions all shine. It's wildlife & enforcement where the controversy comes from. That's part of the job, to be sure, but it's because that's where politicians make the most hay. There are some truly talented & amazing wildlife managers in that agency, and they don't all work on cornerstone species like elk & deer. The bird program, grizzly program, wolf program, fisheries, etc, are all top notch.

4.) Legislators who think they understand PR funding messed with warden pay so bad we had wardens doing fence work on WMA's, rather than looking for poachers & helping enforce the law.

There's a lot more to worry about at FWP than just season setting & license allocation. Martha saw that and tried to change the culture. I think she was pretty successful.

 

[JLS]

@Ben Lamb

 

[BuzzH]

Ben,

Some of that I agree with, some of it not so much. You are right, I probably don't give them enough credit for fixing your items 1 and 4 on your list.

We will have to agree to disagree on fisheries management and that it "shines". It shines so bright there isn't a fishery at all in Flathead lake for kokanee anymore, same with Holter and Hauser. The trout fisheries in both are a shell of their formal self.

The chain lakes in the Seeley/Swan are a joke. Used to be quality fisheries there for cutthroat, bull trout, kokanee, etc. Not anymore.

Rivers are great if you like catching trout that resemble eels more than what a healthy trout should look like. There's a price to pay for catering to the fly-fishing/fishing guides that want 2K fish a mile, catch and release, or limits so restrictive there's no use in anyone keeping a fish anymore.

I should dig out some pictures of what the rivers, lakes, and reservoirs used to produce...most wouldnt believe it.

In fairness, the east side fisheries management is much better than the West.

While its great to fix things like game wardens doing their jobs, fixing the parks,...it seems pretty short sighted to ignore the wildlife portion of FISH, WILDIFE, and parks.

 

[BuzzH]

I'm not talking about just the hunting opportunities. I'm talking about the agency as an entity.

1.) A former parks director hid millions of dollars in the hopes of establishing a new state agency only for parks. That led to massive underfunding of maintenance needs across all state parks. It also created a ton of animosity from the legislature because of the lies that went around on why the money did or didn't get spent.

2.) That agency is legally mandated to manage deer, elk, pronghorn and other species at or below objective. I don't know of any other state that makes it illegal to have an overabundance of wildlife. The legislative interference in how Montana manages wildlife cannot be under-stated. We've handed wildlife management over to the drunks at the Buckhorn.

3.) That agency suffers from loss of institutional history, short-timer's syndrome & being battered by the legislature. They're like abused kids. When you look at Fisheries, Parks, Con Ed, etc, those divisions all shine. It's wildlife & enforcement where the controversy comes from. That's part of the job, to be sure, but it's because that's where politicians make the most hay. There are some truly talented & amazing wildlife managers in that agency, and they don't all work on cornerstone species like elk & deer. The bird program, grizzly program, wolf program, fisheries, etc, are all top notch.

4.) Legislators who think they understand PR funding messed with warden pay so bad we had wardens doing fence work on WMA's, rather than looking for poachers & helping enforce the law.

There's a lot more to worry about at FWP than just season setting & license allocation. Martha saw that and tried to change the culture. I think she was pretty successful.

Oh, and the bolded part...you sure about deer and pronghorn? What other species have to be managed at or below objective by law?

For some reason I thought Debbie's bill was specific to the EMP...and elk.

 

[Ben Lamb]

Ben,

Some of that I agree with, some of it not so much. You are right, I probably don't give them enough credit for fixing your items 1 and 4 on your list.

We will have to agree to disagree on fisheries management and that it "shines". It shines so bright there isn't a fishery at all in Flathead lake for kokanee anymore, same with Holter and Hauser. The trout fisheries in both are a shell of their formal self.

The chain lakes in the Seeley/Swan are a joke. Used to be quality fisheries there for cutthroat, bull trout, kokanee, etc. Not anymore.

Rivers are great if you like catching trout that resemble eels more than what a healthy trout should look like. There's a price to pay for catering to the fly-fishing/fishing guides that want 2K fish a mile, catch and release, or limits so restrictive there's no use in anyone keeping a fish anymore.

I should dig out some pictures of what the rivers, lakes, and reservoirs used to produce...most wouldnt believe it.

In fairness, the east side fisheries management is much better than the West.

While its great to fix things like game wardens doing their jobs, fixing the parks,...it seems pretty short sighted to ignore the wildlife portion of FISH, WILDIFE, and parks.

I've had some of the best days of my life fishing SW & NW MT streams. I'm not much of a lake fisherman, but I do see my friends pulling in limits of big perch, pike & bass out of western MT lakes. Fisheries are cyclical, right? Some of what you describe is a natural down cycle, while some of it is bucket biology and some bad mgt prescriptions, sure.

Remember when FWP decided to try and get rid of walleye in some of those Missouri River Lakes & downstream from Holter? The Walleye guys came unglued, and went to the legislature.

When FWP tried to make fines for bucket biology higher, the legislature demured because they didn't want to put a higher fine on some one just being a good old boy.

Smith River overcrowding & Litter problems? The legislature steadfastly refuses to fund a full time ranger for the Smith.

I agree that wildlife could use a new direction. I've been fairly clear on that, I think. But I don't think you can lay FWP's issues at Martha's feet. She did the best with what she had, where she was. I think she's a great pick for USFWS.

 

[Ben Lamb]

Oh, and the bolded part...you sure about deer and pronghorn? What other species have to be managed at or below objective by law?

For some reason I thought Debbie's bill was specific to the EMP...and elk.

Made me check myself!

It's all three: https://leg.mt.gov/bills/2003/billpdf/HB0042.pdf

 

[JLS]

Made me check myself!

It's all three: https://leg.mt.gov/bills/2003/billpdf/HB0042.pdf

That bill was like a case of herpes-syphillis-gonhorrea to sportsmen and women.

 

[BuzzH]

I've had some of the best days of my life fishing SW & NW MT streams. I'm not much of a lake fisherman, but I do see my friends pulling in limits of big perch, pike & bass out of western MT lakes. Fisheries are cyclical, right? Some of what you describe is a natural down cycle, while some of it is bucket biology and some bad mgt prescriptions, sure.

Remember when FWP decided to try and get rid of walleye in some of those Missouri River Lakes & downstream from Holter? The Walleye guys came unglued, and went to the legislature.

When FWP tried to make fines for bucket biology higher, the legislature demured because they didn't want to put a higher fine on some one just being a good old boy.

Smith River overcrowding & Litter problems? The legislature steadfastly refuses to fund a full time ranger for the Smith.

I agree that wildlife could use a new direction. I've been fairly clear on that, I think. But I don't think you can lay FWP's issues at Martha's feet. She did the best with what she had, where she was. I think she's a great pick for USFWS.

Really, what's the limit on perch and pike in Western Montana?

Yeah, they're cyclical alright...

You think the kokanee fishery in flathead is coming back? When is that cycle coming back?

Do you know how the kokanee fishery in Holter and Hauser happened? Why it doesn't exist anymore?

 

[Ben Lamb]

Really, what's the limit on perch and pike in Western Montana?

Yeah, they're cyclical alright...

You think the kokanee fishery in flathead is coming back? When is that cycle coming back?

Do you know how the kokanee fishery in Holter and Hauser happened? Why it doesn't exist anymore?

How were these the doing of Martha Williams?