Utah's Spyder bull past history?

[havgunwilltravel]

Hi guys,

I don't normally post these discussion type threads, but i have wondered for a while now about Utah's Spyder bull. I can't really find any answers to what i am searching for, so thought the HT members might have some information.

Has there ever been cast antlers, or past video, photographs or trail cam pics of this bull prior to the season it was harvested? I would assume a bull that pushed out to near on 500 B & C points was above 400 for maybe 2-3 years? Normally a lot of these monster bulls are tracked pretty heavily and followed from summer feeding grounds to hunting seasons and if they survive down on the winter range where their cast antlers are eagerly sought, especially the giant bulls.

Surely this monster bull couldn't have escaped hunter attention for all these years, especially with such a unique set of antlers, which i assume he probably had similar configuration or close to it over the last couple of sets and would have been easily identifiable.

I see on instagram a guy taking pics of massive elk in an elk farm and he commented on it being the next spyder bull, it had similar antler configuration.

Was the general consensus on this bull is he might have been an escapee from an elk farm or is it possible he slipped under the radar for all those years. I've watched the mossback dvd a few times on this bull and looking at how visual and how easily videod he was in velvet, i am surprised there was no footage by them of him prior to the year he was taken. Its not very often 500 in bulls just turn up. No doubt he was taken in the wild, i'm just interested to hear if anybody knows a bit more.

Sorry its an old subject, but be good to hear more from guys better informed then myself.

Thanks
hgwt

 

[bigeasygator]

"But investigations by the state of Utah and B&C confirmed the animal was wild, was taken on public land, and was killed legally, which qualified it for the record.

"We are confident it was not a farmed elk," said Terry Menlove, director of the animal industry division of the Utah Department of Agriculture. "We keep an inventory and there were no missing animals and it had none of the required markings for an elk on a farm.""

http://www.sltrib.com/outdoors/ci_11380830

"Along with measurements that honor the quality of the animal, Boone and Crockett Club records also honor fair-chase hunting," said Eldon Buckner, chairman of the Club’s Records of North American Big Game committee. "Through our entry process, signed affidavits and follow-up interviews with the hunter, his guides, and state and federal officials, we were satisfied that this bull was indeed a wild, free-ranging trophy and that the tenets of fair chase were used in the harvest."

http://www.boone-crockett.org/news/featured_story.asp?area=news&ID=36

My guess is that the research was done. I don't think that B&C would take matters like this lightly.

 

[noharleyyet]

My guess is that the research was done. I don't think that B&C would take matters like this lightly.

I personally don't give a scintilla of a crap about anyone buying trophies but owing to the supposed high minded strictures of B&C, this and similar methodology needs a spotter posse any season asterisk..

 

[AZBridger]

i find it hard to believe that a bull of that size, in such a high traffic area would not have been seen previously by someone. no sheds, no photographs, nothing. That elk seemed almost tame and for a bull of that size and with such a unique set of headgear, to go unseen for the amount of time it took to grow that rack would require it to reside in some deep, dark canyon WAAAAAY off the roads. The spider bull was a local campground bull when it showed up. Maybe i'm just envious, but the whole deal seems really fishy to me

 

[Gr8bawana]

Seems strange that there is no past history of this bull like sightings or shed antlers. A bull that big would need a few years worth of sheds and nobody ever found any. That's unlikley.

 

[.280 Remington]

I don't know much about they Spider Bull, but I will say this: critters will surprise you.

For example, a radio collared elk from MT wandered all the way down to Nebraska or something, IIRC. I read a story on it in a magazine quite a few years ago.

I'm NOT saying there wasn't something fishy with the bull, as I haven't studied up on it.

But, in my view, the people who point to lack of previous sightings as evidence of foul play are making basic assumptions about the bull that if wrong, would completely undermine their theories.

 

[ric]

There were many people aware of this bull, and hunters were aware of him. It just took a huge amount of money to buy the resources to find the bull and get the killer to it fast enough. I say killer, because there was no hunting involved, by the killer. It was bought and paid for.

 

[bigeasygator]

http://blog.kingsoutdoorworld.com/2...l-legit-a-look-back-at-this-world-record-elk/

More reading on what you are asking about.

And I agree with you NHY, fair chase is an awfully subjective term when it comes to hunts under the circumstances the Spider Bull was shot under.

 

[havgunwilltravel]

There were many people aware of this bull, and hunters were aware of him. It just took a huge amount of money to buy the resources to find the bull and get the killer to it fast enough. I say killer, because there was no hunting involved, by the killer. It was bought and paid for.

Yes there certainly was, but not a single piece of evidence has surfaced from the years prior, i find that a little strange, especially as normally after a monster trophy dies pics and clips and tc images surface from different people. There has been nothing that i am aware of from this animal prior to the year he was harvested. Even more so in that he was apparently so visible the year he was taken.

http://blog.kingsoutdoorworld.com/2...l-legit-a-look-back-at-this-world-record-elk/

More reading on what you are asking about.

And I agree with you NHY, fair chase is an awfully subjective term when it comes to hunts under the circumstances the Spider Bull was shot under.

Thanks for the link, it was a good read, i'm not sure on the regulations of ear tagging of all game animals in penned conditions as over here in the South Pacific there are plenty of animals behind wire that will never be ear marked and i can only imagine if the bull escaped from a ranch the owners of the ranch would probably not be too forth coming with their stock escaping.

 

[Gerald Martin]

There was an ongoing thread on Bowsite from a guy that drew the Monroe Mountain tag the same year that the Spider Bull was killed. He was aware of the Spider bull's exsistence but did not see the bull. He did run into Doyle Moss and crew during his hunt, but didn't report any negativity or unreasonable competition from them.


I was able to find the thread from Bowsite. Some pretty interesting reading. http://forums.bowsite.com/TF/bgforums/thread.cfm?threadid=355413&forum=5

 

[MinnesotaHunter]

And I agree with you NHY, fair chase is an awfully subjective term when it comes to hunts under the circumstances the Spider Bull was shot under.

I think this topic is interesting. I think it can force people to examine why they hunt and what is really important in the end. I think the fact that B&C is a private organization, that is in most cases is aligned with what is best for hunting, they can make the decision that is best for them . Now when it come to the Mossback crew, I think if I were on the board of B&C I would want to prevent this type of hunting from making it into my book, but I am not sure how they could create an objective judgement that could be applied across all situations. I am sure Doyle, and his crew understand all of the technicalities of the books and ensure their hunter will qualify.

 

[Gerald Martin]

Some summer footage.http://s271.photobucket.com/user/thebonecollector_4/media/Spidermanforwebsite.flv.html

 

[DreaminofMT6X6s]

The only part of the story I remember is the hunter had used an outfitter. He hadn't filled his tag during the week he went hunting early in the season, but had seen the Spider Bull apparently. The outfitter had several of its guides watching for the Spider Bull and when it reappeared later that season they had called the gentlemen and he came back to the outfitter and harvested the bull. The business was loyal to it's customer and helped him out. He paid for their service and they followed through. It would be really nice to have several people looking for an elk for me, but I don't want to pay for it either.

 

[havgunwilltravel]

There was an ongoing thread on Bowsite from a guy that drew the Monroe Mountain tag the same year that the Spider Bull was killed. He was aware of the Spider bull's exsistence but did not see the bull. He did run into Doyle Moss and crew during his hunt, but didn't report any negativity or unreasonable competition from them.


I was able to find the thread from Bowsite. Some pretty interesting reading. http://forums.bowsite.com/TF/bgforums/thread.cfm?threadid=355413&forum=5

Thanks gerald, was an interesting read.

The dvd on the hunt for the spyder bull was interesting as well. With so many deer, and elk hunters around in that region i still find it quite hard to comprehend a bull could go unnoticed until he made it to 500 inches. No doubt it was taken on that unit, but i guess we will never really know.

 

[hank4elk]

They can get bigger and never be seen or sheds found IMHO.
The true monsters NEVER come out in open.
Watched 4 guys try and call a 380 herd bull out,they never saw the huge bull in the thick stuff behind. Like a sat. bull he was taking a few cows at a time. In the frenzy he was a blur.

 

[Killergaurd]

Just ran across this old thread. What a joke. As hard as utah is hunted and how popular shed hunting is, nobody ever had evidence of this before. Huh. Ya a mature bull elk hanging around campgrounds in the summer funny. It's obvious this bull was a game farm bull. Pisses me off as a public land hunter really. There should be 2 different categories public land and private land record books. Spider bull would be under game farm bull.

 

[Heyrrd]

You are correct about the fake , farmed spider Bull. Its a farmed Bull.
If you watch the you tube video, its very obvious. This video has been altered so much it is ridiculous. That Bull was bought and paid for. They are trying to generate hunting business. The guy that shot it is a dink. He gets very defensive when confronted about the farm bull. Watch the video. It has various changing background scenes, and the old guy that shot it . Is not dressed accordingly for the conditions. He doesn't even have a back pack or water or anything. The picture of where it was supposedly killed. Does NOT match the terrain where he poses with the bull. It should not be in the books. The word going around is it was approximately 120k to hunt and kill it. The outfitter said they had been watching it for a long time. No way . Just check it out . Its farmed, and shrouded in secrecy. Needs to be investigated. It even shows up on some sites as a photoshopped picture. Anyone who does this . Obviously has an inferior complex. They want to be someone so bad . They need mental health counseling. I have a lot more in this if people want to know. Its an illegal entry in Boone & Crockett. Let's chat . Thanks

 

[Heyrrd]

Thanks gerald, was an interesting read.

The dvd on the hunt for the spyder bull was interesting as well. With so many deer, and elk hunters around in that region i still find it quite hard to comprehend a bull could go unnoticed until he made it to 500 inches. No doubt it was taken on that unit, but i guess we will never really know.

Check out my response below. That bull was bought and planted in that hunt

 

[Steelhead]

There should be 2 different categories public land and private land record books.

We gonna do guided and unguided records?? I’m in!!

 

[Jape]

Maybe, maybe not, but does it really matter? Yeah, the guy that shot it has gobs of cash and if he wants to pay for an armed escort to carry him on a throne and shoot a bull then go for it. Not my idea of fun but to each his own.

Now, if it was farm raised then it shouldn’t qualify but it appears it was substantially investigated and verified. I think it’s time to let it go.