US Debt Limit

[more_cowbell]

Every time someone says this, I am convinced they have never looked at the budget.

We are essentially debating the definitions of "efficient" and "wasteful". Is a tax break to build out solar and wind electrical production wasteful? If a tax break for ethanol so corn farmers have a stable market wasteful? Is it efficient to have different tax rates on income versus capital gains? is it efficient to give homeowners a break on the mortgage interest paid or children they have? are the 1,000,000+ joint replacements Medicare pays for each year efficient?

The whole concept of a politician voting for something because it benefits the people that vote for them, even if it hurts the country overall, is how we get to this point.

At the micro level, are you familiar with the practice of, for example, a government agency scrambling to fully spend their budget every year, in order to get the same amount (or more) next year? So if close to the end of the fiscal year, if it looks like they have too much money, they’ll quickly spend it on whatever, or have their employees engage in extra “work”, to burn up the allocated money.

I’d imagine that has quite the cumulative effect across the entire system.

 

[noharleyyet]

There was 2 scenarios in my response. I should've separated them better. $38k is 3.8% of a million.

The $100k a year is meant for non millionaires to get a sense of the impact. Hence the mention of $3,800.

Regardless, most people who've made a lot of money are usually pretty smart with their money.

$50 bil is still a big number.

Not when obfuscating or rationalizing performative malfeasance...lying with a straight face is something politicians all are masters at teaching their elite constituents. Gimme the actual end game & I'll show you how to circumvent common sense...I mean the common sense the unwashed (shudder)recognize, can't have any of that shit.

"Usefulness" ...make em feel special to be in on the master plan.

 

[FI460]

At the micro level, are you familiar with the practice of, for example, a government agency scrambling to fully spend their budget every year, in order to get the same amount (or more) next year? So if close to the end of the fiscal year, if it looks like they have too much money, they’ll quickly spend it on whatever, or have their employees engage in extra “work”, to burn up the allocated money.

I’d imagine that has quite the cumulative effect across the entries system.

That's often because they were operating so lean and mean all year they were able to accrue a surplus.

Now they can finally purchase some new office furniture that wasn't made in the middle of the Cold War...

 

[Handlebar]

That's often because they were operating so lean and mean all year they were able to accrue a surplus.

Now they can finally purchase some new office furniture that wasn't made in the middle of the Cold War...

Hardly

 

[more_cowbell]

Now they can finally purchase some new office furniture that wasn't made in the middle of the Cold War...

That Cold War furniture is probably better quality (literally bombproof!) than the imported stuff replacing it (and price marked up for the government purchase)

 

[FI460]

Hardly

I've always suspected my desk came from federal surplus when they closed the Midway Air Station in 1978. I'm about to sign it up for AARP.

I've got some money left over on an index this year. I'm wasting some of it on new office furniture before the end of the fiscal year.

That Cold War furniture is probably better quality (literally bombproof!) than the imported stuff replacing it (and price marked up for the government purchase)

Sure in 1978. This thing was held together with duct tape when I inherited it 6 years ago.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

We just put another $1.5 trillion dollars on our grandkids' credit cards.

My daughter should be well on her way to that 850 then

 

[noharleyyet]

My daughter should be well on her way to that 850 then

Just think how cool it'll be to regale the next generation on how you used to school the unenlightened conservative commoners on HT.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

Just think how cool it'll be to regale the next generation on how you used to school the unenlightened conservative commoners on HT.

I think the way it works is that I will be considered a cranky old conservative and will ridiculed in the parlance of the new generation.

 

[noharleyyet]

I think the way it works is that I will be considered a cranky old conservative and will ridiculed in the parlance of the new generation.

..any day now.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

..any day now.

I already have no idea what Gen Alpha are talking about... and I refuse to download tiktok, I watch them on insta like the rest of my generation....

winter is coming.

 

[noharleyyet]

I already have no idea what Gen Alpha are talking about... and I refuse to download tiktok, I watch them on insta like the rest of my generation....

winter is coming.

Wish I could help but the ambush was so skillfully staged...

 

[rogerthat]

Wish I could help but the ambush was so skillfully staged...

I never have a single clue what you’re ever talking about. Guess I’m too dumb

 

[noharleyyet]

I never have a single clue what you’re ever talking about. Guess I’m too dumb

 

[SAJ-99]

At the micro level, are you familiar with the practice of, for example, a government agency scrambling to fully spend their budget every year, in order to get the same amount (or more) next year? So if close to the end of the fiscal year, if it looks like they have too much money, they’ll quickly spend it on whatever, or have their employees engage in extra “work”, to burn up the allocated money.

I’d imagine that has quite the cumulative effect across the entire system.

I'm sure there is a lot of that, but I doubt it adds up to much (vs. the total budget). What I worry about is giving the politics the idea to hire someone to oversee the spending of these budgets. Maybe that is where we are now? Inefficiency is certainly a problem, but not an easy fix. What concerns me is these superficial understandings of the budget leads to stupid ideas like selling public land. If we aren't careful, we will find ourself in the minority at some point soon.

 

[more_cowbell]

I'm sure there is a lot of that, but I doubt it adds up to much (vs. the total budget). What I worry about is giving the politics the idea to hire someone to oversee the spending of these budgets. Maybe that is where we are now? Inefficiency is certainly a problem, but not an easy fix. What concerns me is these superficial understandings of the budget leads to stupid ideas like selling public land. If we aren't careful, we will find ourself in the minority at some point soon.

Labor costs also add up. Maybe we let plug in SkyNet and let chatgpt take its course -- start replacing people in both the private and public sector. That should also help the Fed with the low unemployment rate problem.

And not sure if you saw it, but in the Jon Stewart interview with the deputy defense secretary, her attitude towards spending and/or where $billions of purchased inventory might be (hard to tell), did not inspire confidence. ("We don't have an accurate inventory that we can pull up, of what we have, where.")

 

[SAJ-99]

Labor costs also add up. Maybe we let plug in SkyNet and let chatgpt take its course -- start replacing people in both the private and public sector. That should also help the Fed with the low unemployment rate problem.

And not sure if you saw it, but in the Jon Stewart interview with the deputy defense secretary, her attitude towards spending and/or where $billions of purchased inventory might be (hard to tell), did not inspire confidence. ("We don't have an accurate inventory that we can pull up, of what we have, where.")

Yes, I saw that. It wasn't a good look for a government employee. The government is dealing with antiquated computer systems. Every time someone brings up the idea of allocating funds to upgrade, people are outraged over the spending. Doesn't matter if it is the military/VA, the IRS, or medical. The interesting part is there are a ton of VERY smart people in the government, just not the ones that get elected. Again, that is our fault.

 

[more_cowbell]

Yes, I saw that. It wasn't a good look for a government employee. The government is dealing with antiquated computer systems. Every time someone brings up the idea of allocating funds to upgrade, people are outraged over the spending. Doesn't matter if it is the military/VA, the IRS, or medical. The interesting part is there are a ton of VERY smart people in the government, just not the ones that get elected. Again, that is our fault.

Although for an example at the state level, many years ago the Feds gave Oregon over $80mil to upgrade its Employment Dept. unemployment insurance benefits system/software (which was was about 1993). The money didn't make it out of the trust account for a new system.

State auditor later warned the Dept. that if there was a catastrophic event, the system would crash. Department still failed to act.

Cut to a few years later in 2020 when the covid shutdown caused mass layoffs and UI applications. This crashed the system just as the auditor predicted, and a lot of people waited months for benefits. The Department's head got fired.

Apologies for getting us off track, but point is sometimes with any organization (public or private), there's also an internal inertia compontent that prevents change from being made, even when it can or should be done. The neglect piles up and agencies like the FAA keep using super old computers/systems to keep us safe in the air. [Edit to say I'm not contending this is the FAA's fault or that it has been neglectful. Only using FAA as an example of an agency using old tech.]

 

[Handlebar]

Although for an example at the state level, many years ago the Feds gave Oregon over $80mil to upgrade its Employment Dept. unemployment insurance benefits system/software (which was was about 1993). The money didn't make it out of the trust account for a new system.

State auditor later warned the Dept. that if there was a catastrophic event, the system would crash. Department still failed to act.

Cut to a few years later in 2020 when the covid shutdown caused mass layoffs and UI applications. This crashed the system just as the auditor predicted, and a lot of people waited months for benefits. The Department's head got fired.

Apologies for getting us off track, but point is sometimes with any organization (public or private), there's also an internal inertia compontent that prevents change from being made, even when it can or should be done. The neglect piles up and agencies like the FAA keep using super old computers/systems to keep us safe in the air.

Bureaucracy is the enemy of excellence

 

[BigHornRam]

I think the way it works is that I will be considered a cranky old conservative and will ridiculed in the parlance of the new generation.

Very true! Once upon a time I voted for Mike Dukakis. Look how I turned out.