The "classics"

[glennw89]

With winter setting in (close to -30 Celsius here last night), time for hunting campfire discussions ...

I'm curious what would make a "Top Five Classic Cartridges" list - emphasis on longevity/history/North American big game.

1) 257 Roberts - plenty of history here
2) 270 Winchester - still perhaps the mountain rifle standard
3) 30-06 - the original
4) 300 H&H - the epitome of cool for me, although admittedly close to 30-06
5) 30-30 - the classic big woods deer cartridge

 

[Dan O]

I think I would have to slip the 45-70 in there somewhere, but where and which one to bump????

 

[Ben Lamb]

450 3 1/4" BPE. That cartridge hunted the entire world before smokeless powder came along, and it killed everything on the planet.

8mm Mauser - the cartridge's that started it all for the modern cartridge. 1888 design, first spitzer bullet design and first super velocity round (2300 fps kicked 1800 fps in the ass 140 years ago).

30-06 - the cartridge that saved the world, and brought home meat for Americans for over 100 years.

338 Winchester Magnum - If you're going to be a bear, be a grizzly.

416 Rigby: Because Jumbo needs 400 grains moving at 2400 fps to be ethically brought down, but it'll work on a gemsbok too. The perfect balance of power & style.

 

[Ben Lamb]

I think I would have to slip the 45-70 in there somewhere, but where and which one to bump????

From a design point, the 270, 30-06 & 257 Roberts are all descendants of the 8mm Mauser. The 45-70 is it's own creation. I'd take out the 257 or 270 and put the 45 Gov't in there personally.

 

[SaskHunter]

I'm surprised that a guy from Ontario didn't put the .303 British in his top five.

In terms of NA big game killed, in Canada anyway, the 30-30 and .303 Brit are probably tied for calibers of historical value and wide use.

 

[Ben Lamb]

I'm surprised that a guy from Ontario didn't put the .303 British in his top five.

In terms of NA big game killed, in Canada anyway, the 30-30 and .303 Brit are probably tied for calibers of historical value and wide use.

The 303 in a Lee Speed is an all time classic. Good call.

 

[morley.tyler]

I think we'd be remiss to not include one of the Weatherby Cartridges. Probably the 300 Weatherby. Roy was an icon and a pioneer in the industry.

Also, if 70+ years doesn't make a classic, then nothing is.

 

[OntarioHunter]

I'm surprised that a guy from Ontario didn't put the .303 British in his top five.

In terms of NA big game killed, in Canada anyway, the 30-30 and .303 Brit are probably tied for calibers of historical value and wide use.

I live in Ontario but I'm "from" Montana.

30-06 is at the head of the line, of course. Best cartridge ever developed for killing man or beast.

.300 H&H is the father of belted magnum

.303 British was probably the most widely used hunting cartridge across the globe during the 20th century which was truly the golden age of big game hunting

.257 Roberts was the trend setter, if not the first, of the homemade "wildcats" to achieve popular commercial production (more research needed) Edit: 35 Whelen was developed earlier (1922 vs 1928) but unclear which cartridge was first commercialy produced by Remington - both in the 1920s. Apparently Remington did not make 35 Whelen in a rifle until 1988.

30-30 was the most popular and best surviving cartridge of the many that Winchester designed to fit Browning's revolutionary lever action repeating rifles.

I guess you can tell I'm a historian.

 

[Jbaldwin40]

I'm surprised that a guy from Ontario didn't put the .303 British in his top five.

In terms of NA big game killed, in Canada anyway, the 30-30 and .303 Brit are probably tied for calibers of historical value and wide use.

My dad gave me a 303 to use on my first deer hunt.

 

[TN2shot07]

With all the popularity of the 6.5’s right now I’m not sure the list can exclude the original, 6.5-55 Swede? No telling how many critters have fallen to that one around the world. I don’t own one yet but I plan on it.

 

[nhenry]

To me, the classics are
- 375 H&H, the standard for Africa
- 45-70 Gov't, nuff said
- 30-06 Springfield, the driving case in the wildcatting age
- 7.62x54R, oldest cartridge still in military use
- 300 Win Mag, the Lord's cartridge

I can be swayed on the 7.62x54R. I'd replace it with a 6.5x55 Swede.

 

[nhenry]

Shoot but then I remember about 30-30 and I believe that deserves an honorable mention

 

[Europe]

I'm surprised that a guy from Ontario didn't put the .303 British in his top five.

In terms of NA big game killed, in Canada anyway, the 30-30 and .303 Brit are probably tied for calibers of historical value and wide use.

and the 280 Ross.

Panda Bear, a little north of you still uses one and she gets the bullets from Woodleigh, which is a "twofer" for her as she also hunts with a 275 H & H

I think we'd be remiss to not include one of the Weatherby Cartridges. Probably the 300 Weatherby. Roy was an icon and a pioneer in the industry.

Also, if 70+ years doesn't make a classic, then nothing is.

100% agree. The 257, 300 and 340--- not a bad line up

_____________

For me, my list of classics are also what I used and still would if I was able to do so

6.5 Swede
300 H & H
375 H & H

to add a lever then I would have to include the 250/3000
a double 450/400

However between the 375 H & H, 450/400, and 9.3 x 64 Brenneke , it would be hard not to choose the Brenneke, although it is not legal in all parts of Africa when hunting the big 5, I liked the old girl/caliber. The 450/400 was also, a classic, in more than one way, but, I used the 375 H & H the most and it served me well.

 

[std7mag]

Some of the cartridges listed started in Europe, or elsewhere and didn't come to North America untill later.

I'm thinking.
45-70 and it's ilk.
30-30, originally a black powder cartridge.
250, 300, 303 Savage.

 

[Ben Lamb]

The 30-30 was one of the first cartridges designed for smokeless powder in the US. 1894. That puts it in rarified company. It was still 6 years after the far superior 8mm Mauser though.

 

[RobertD]

but, I used the 375 H & H the most and it served me well.

April, how does the experience of shooting a .375 compare to smaller hunting rounds? What all types of game did you take with the caliber? I am just curious

 

[VikingsGuy]

Now that the cool kids have moved on to PRC cartridge family, can we call the 6.5 Creedmoor a classic

 

[Europe]

April, how does the experience of shooting a .375 compare to smaller hunting rounds? What all types of game did you take with the caliber? I am just curious

Sir, --opinions will vary and I am sure people like HappyMyles and Buffybr, as well as others will disagree, but for me: Giraffe, Buffalo, Cape Eland, Kudu, Roan, Hippo and only because it is a legal requirement --Lion and Leopard . Lion is a good hunt, but the 300 H & H is enough gun IMHO. The leopard is a boring hunt ( (unless you wound it )-: ) and the 300 H & H is definitely enough gun. The hippo was hunted on land and those suckers can get your attention, quick, so back to the 375 H & H. The only animals I hunted with the 450/400 was Elephant, Buffalo, Rhino, and Lion . I was willing to take the punishment for the piece of mind knowing that 2nd shot did not depend on my ability with a bolt gun, especially when the animal in question had taken exception to my shooting him.

Your second question. My absolute favorite was the 300 H & H. It did not beat me up, and imho it was "enough gun" for 90% of everything I wanted to do. In Africa, my second choice would be the 375 H & H, but outside Africa I still preferred the 300 H & H to all others but a close second was the Swede.

To put a finer point on your 1st question. It ( 375 ) took away some of the fun --- before the hunt and after the hunt. NOT, during the hunt, but preparing for the hunt and the ice on the shoulder and margaritas, after the hunt can create a different set of problems .

Please let me know if I didn't answer your question, to your satisfaction sir and I will pm you, as I do to want to derail this thread

 

[RobertD]

Sir, --opinions will vary and I am sure people like HappyMyles and Buffybr, as well as others will disagree, but for me: Giraffe, Buffalo, Cape Eland, Kudu, Roan, Hippo and only because it is a legal requirement --Lion and Leopard . Lion is a good hunt, but the 300 H & H is enough gun IMHO. The leopard is a boring hunt ( (unless you wound it )-: ) and the 300 H & H is definitely enough gun. The hippo was hunted on land and those suckers can get your attention, quick, so back to the 375 H & H. The only animals I hunted with the 450/400 was Elephant, Buffalo, Rhino, and Lion . I was willing to take the punishment for the piece of mind knowing that 2nd shot did not depend on my ability with a bolt gun, especially when the animal in question had taken exception to my shooting him.

Your second question. My absolute favorite was the 300 H & H. It did not beat me up, and imho it was "enough gun" for 90% of everything I wanted to do. In Africa, my second choice would be the 375 H & H, but outside Africa I still preferred the 300 H & H to all others but a close second was the Swede.

To put a finer point on your 1st question. It ( 375 ) took away some of the fun --- before the hunt and after the hunt. NOT, during the hunt, but preparing for the hunt and the ice on the shoulder and margaritas, after the hunt can create a different set of problems .

Please let me know if I didn't answer your question, to your satisfaction sir and I will pm you, as I do to want to derail this thread

No, that's a thorough and interesting answer. That covers all I was curious about - thank you for sharing stories of your experiences

 

[Big Slick]

I’m sure the 35 Remington could be thrown in the mix.