DouglasR
Well-known member
Thanks Ben!
Please proofread my letter to the Dnr discouraging the mtb trail expansion.
- Thread starter DouglasR
- Start date
I wouldn’t go down this rabbit hole.
elkduds
Well-known member
Thanks for making your opinion known in writing. Find others to sign it along w you, the more the merrier. Show it to likeminded local organizations, ask them to sign on or write their own letters. Power in #s. Ask to testify if there are hearings, follow up w phone calls to key legislative players. If you can get a DNR rep (do they have a sportsmen's forum or roundtable?) on your side, that is a force multiplier. Good luck!
DouglasR
Well-known member
DouglasR
Well-known member
Yeah, I’m not going down that rabbit hole or any other ones.
My original letter was short and concise because at the end of the day I really don’t know what I’m talking about.
kinda just ranting.
I’m pretty sure this battle’s already lost.
especially when most of the hunters I talk to think the gutless method and not aging meat makes venison inedible.
“But how will you get the deer out without a trail and game cart
““I take all my deer to a professional butcher because they do a much better job than I can”
what?
I’m just a lonely niche user I guess.
#poorme
DouglasR
Well-known member
I just can’t wait to ride the four wheeler 200yds across my buddies parents cornfield to sit in the stand in the little hedge row in the corner and wait for a big slammer to walk by!
so exhilarating!!!
maybe Jimmy John will let me sit one of his sweet blinds in the fields along the sangamon that he fenced in by my parents house where Charlie the farmer used to let me and my buddies frolic and play as children.
so exhilarating!!!
maybe Jimmy John will let me sit one of his sweet blinds in the fields along the sangamon that he fenced in by my parents house where Charlie the farmer used to let me and my buddies frolic and play as children.
noharleyyet
Well-known member
Just send em this link Douglas...
DouglasR
Well-known member
Yeah, that’s battle’s lost.
I did get the park super to angrily say
“Yeah well hookers and prostitutes use that parking lot too!”
Pretty unprofessional language, but hey,
“Welcome to the park”
Right?
I did get the park super to angrily say
“Yeah well hookers and prostitutes use that parking lot too!”
Pretty unprofessional language, but hey,
“Welcome to the park”
Right?
noharleyyet
Well-known member
…hookers and prostitutes? He must be new.
R
rwc101
Guest
DouglasR
Well-known member
Mr Edison,
I just wanted to say thank you for the phone call this afternoon.
I did find your comment about
“yeah well, hookers and drug dealers use that parking lot too” to be inappropriate, irrelevant and condescending.
I’m not really certain what your response had to do with me proclaiming that hunters use the old garage parking lot, but it has been noted.
Do I need to be concerned for my safety when using that parking lot?
Furthermore, I feel you made no real logical, supporting arguments for the construction of trail 11.
In one breath you mention the “master plan” from the 70’s and 80’s mentioning a UTV trail connecting the parking lots in the property while in the next breath explaining how a UTV trail is no longer a sought after goal due to environmental restrictions.
So if the UTV trail has been removed from the “master plan” what is the significance of this “master plan” you keep referencing?
Obviously it can be amended.
It’s over 40 years old.
Is it really relevant today?
I would again like to voice my concerns over the user data collection methods from the mountain bike club.
This is a club that is trying to acquire free public land to develop into a recreational area for their niche use and you’re counting on them to accurately provide you with the numbers of users from their trail counters?
One might say they have a vested interest.
It really seems like that data should be something the park collects independently from the mountain bike club that is trying to acquire FREE PUBLIC LAND.
Again, it is my opinion that there are 15-20 core members of Kickapoo mountain bike club that are trying to do this.
While they might claim 10,000 users a year, I would be interested to see how many of these uses are simply repeat users ie the same 15 guys riding the trails 5 nights a week and or someone lapping trail 1 or trails 2-3 where the counters are numerous times in one evening.
In contrast, as you authoritatively stated in our phone conversation hunters are required to report all hunting trips whether successful or not to an online database on their own accord.
As a supporter of common sense game management this makes great sense and I wholeheartedly support it.
But if the hunters have to purchase licenses and go to the trouble of reporting their hunts online shouldn’t the mountain bikers have to do something similar so that their impact on the environment can be accurately noted?
Again, I’m very skeptical of the user numbers being reported by the mountain bike club.
I really think that is something that needs to be studied by an independent group without a vested interest in the club.
In conclusion, Tim, I would like to extend an open invitation to you and anyone else who would like to come along on a squirrel hunt on the multi use trails starting at the main mountain bike parking lot anytime in the foreseeable future.
I’m free starting tomorrow through the close of season
February 15, 2022.
Respectfully,
Douglas R
I just wanted to say thank you for the phone call this afternoon.
I did find your comment about
“yeah well, hookers and drug dealers use that parking lot too” to be inappropriate, irrelevant and condescending.
I’m not really certain what your response had to do with me proclaiming that hunters use the old garage parking lot, but it has been noted.
Do I need to be concerned for my safety when using that parking lot?
Furthermore, I feel you made no real logical, supporting arguments for the construction of trail 11.
In one breath you mention the “master plan” from the 70’s and 80’s mentioning a UTV trail connecting the parking lots in the property while in the next breath explaining how a UTV trail is no longer a sought after goal due to environmental restrictions.
So if the UTV trail has been removed from the “master plan” what is the significance of this “master plan” you keep referencing?
Obviously it can be amended.
It’s over 40 years old.
Is it really relevant today?
I would again like to voice my concerns over the user data collection methods from the mountain bike club.
This is a club that is trying to acquire free public land to develop into a recreational area for their niche use and you’re counting on them to accurately provide you with the numbers of users from their trail counters?
One might say they have a vested interest.
It really seems like that data should be something the park collects independently from the mountain bike club that is trying to acquire FREE PUBLIC LAND.
Again, it is my opinion that there are 15-20 core members of Kickapoo mountain bike club that are trying to do this.
While they might claim 10,000 users a year, I would be interested to see how many of these uses are simply repeat users ie the same 15 guys riding the trails 5 nights a week and or someone lapping trail 1 or trails 2-3 where the counters are numerous times in one evening.
In contrast, as you authoritatively stated in our phone conversation hunters are required to report all hunting trips whether successful or not to an online database on their own accord.
As a supporter of common sense game management this makes great sense and I wholeheartedly support it.
But if the hunters have to purchase licenses and go to the trouble of reporting their hunts online shouldn’t the mountain bikers have to do something similar so that their impact on the environment can be accurately noted?
Again, I’m very skeptical of the user numbers being reported by the mountain bike club.
I really think that is something that needs to be studied by an independent group without a vested interest in the club.
In conclusion, Tim, I would like to extend an open invitation to you and anyone else who would like to come along on a squirrel hunt on the multi use trails starting at the main mountain bike parking lot anytime in the foreseeable future.
I’m free starting tomorrow through the close of season
February 15, 2022.
Respectfully,
Douglas R
DouglasR
Well-known member
Is that one too cunty?
@noharleyyet it was either “hookers and prostitutes” or “hookers and drug dealers”
I don’t want to misquote him.
He definitely said hookers though.
So basically I’m just supposed to keep trolling this guy as much as possible whilst not ending up in jail like Joe Exotic?
That’s how politics work?
@noharleyyet it was either “hookers and prostitutes” or “hookers and drug dealers”
I don’t want to misquote him.
He definitely said hookers though.
So basically I’m just supposed to keep trolling this guy as much as possible whilst not ending up in jail like Joe Exotic?
That’s how politics work?
DouglasR
Well-known member
Shucks,
looks like Malinda and I are gonna have to discuss
Tim’s accusations of “hookers and drug dealers” using the parking lots.
looks like Malinda and I are gonna have to discuss
Tim’s accusations of “hookers and drug dealers” using the parking lots.
noharleyyet
Well-known member
What a prick. I guess you should ask him how he knows hookers and drug dealers use it? And why hasn't he reported known consistent illegal activity on his site? Is he a frequent customer? Is he getting kickbacks?
Public land in Illinois is in a sad state, and the state doesn't give a damn about the public, especially hunters- unless they're an outfitter in Pike County.
Pucky Freak
Well-known member
Could they just build the trail, and then close it to mtb Oct 1-Jan 20? I only say this as last ditch idea to preserve a little bit of access if it’s a losing battle anyways. One of my local shed-hunting spots just got blew up by a new mtb trail - I had no idea it was being installed until it was too late. I’ve also hunted areas with popular run/bike trails running through them, and I know how impractical “shared use” can be. Probably 90% of the trail users have no clue hunting is even allowed there, and give looks of being startled and alarmed when they see some guy toting a weapon.On the flip side, if you’re set on all-or-nothing no new mtb trail you might find more allies among the granolas than from IL hunters. In my (limited) observation a strong majority of IL hunters have given up on IL public land hunting access.
As far as Kickapoo goes, I agree that because it already has a large mtb trail, it’s much better to leave the N 1/3 undeveloped. Here’s a copy of my email to superintendent Edison:
“I am against the expansion of the MTB trail in the northern portion of the park. There are a limited number of undeveloped public lands in IL, and their preservation means a lot to those of us who travel to those areas to reflect, decompress, and enjoy the beauty of nature. I personally enjoy places in IL like Kickapoo for such reasons, and have purchased IL nonresident hunting and fishing licenses for many years to hunt and fish on public lands and waters. Thank you”
VikingsGuy
Well-known member
In my experience, bike enthusiasts and dog park advocates are the worst folks to deal with at "city hall" and they both have shockingly high win rates. They are the Ted Williams of the niche advocacy world.
DouglasR
Well-known member
Welp, now they’re making my points for me.
Again, could someone please explain to me why we need 10 more miles of trails if we’re not going to maintain the ones we already have?
Time to send an email to the superintendent...
Steve Fox is the bike club “president” btw.
Again, could someone please explain to me why we need 10 more miles of trails if we’re not going to maintain the ones we already have?
Time to send an email to the superintendent...
Steve Fox is the bike club “president” btw.
DouglasR
Well-known member
And I ride heaven and hell every time because it’s not a true lap if you don’t.
These mf’s show up fully kitted out for the Alaska classic on downhill bikes just to ride 5 miles and go home.
And they want more trails...
These mf’s show up fully kitted out for the Alaska classic on downhill bikes just to ride 5 miles and go home.
And they want more trails...
Chama Grande
Well-known member
I worked BLM in Colorado for a while, and my mentor at the time looked at me and said 'they always have money for more trails, never money to maintain anything'. He said it was true for the ATV crowds, the truck bros, the dingy horse women, and the MTB community. Damn it if he wasn't dead on.
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