No atheists in foxholes apparently

[VikingsGuy]

Sorry for any confusion. It was not my intent to label then with any religious tag, I was merely invoking the metaphorical reference that has been commonly used for deniers of all sorts when face with the risk they deny. My apologies to any atheists who misunderstood my meaning. Take care.

 

[MThuntr]

meh call a spade a spade and get on with it then. It's 2020 not 1917

 

[Ben Lamb]

Reality has a way of making entrenched ideology seem suddenly silly & unimportant.

But the Tyson saying is more poetic.

 

[Jape]

We need more nurses like your daughter @VikingsGuy. Hope she stays safe and healthy.

We are already seeing claims from the plaintiffs bar against healthcare providers related to the pandemic. Unbelievable. When a crisis happens you get to see people for who they really are.

 

[VikingsGuy]

meh call a spade a spade and get on with it then. It's 2020 not 1917

Ironically I was once criticized for using "call a spade a spade" - I don't use that one any more.

Is It Racist To 'Call A Spade A Spade'?

For almost half a millennium, the phrase "call a spade a spade" has served as a demand to "tell it like it is." It is only in the past century that the expression began to acquire a negative, racial overtone.

www.npr.org

 

[MinnesotaHunter]

meh call a spade a spade and get on with it then. It's 2020 not 1917

Battle of the Bulge, 1944-45....

In general, I think a lot of this behavior is just human nature and built in defense mechanisms in our brains. As a culture we are just so infrequently faced with perceived life threatening situations, we come up with all kinds of ideas in our heads to try and cope....

 

[Fire_9]

Refusing to treat while having the proper PPE is a tough action to defend. That being said, it would be hard for me to argue with a nurse that refused to treat someone if they didn’t have the correct PPE. That’s a tough call to make but as a health care provider or first responder, your health/safety trumps everything else within reason. I have a feeling those hospitals would change their tune on not allowing nurses to wear masks if they stood together and refused to treat patients without proper PPE. Once again that’s a tough call to make but you have to stand up for what is right.

 

[RobG]

I’m trying to wrap my head around this. If you’re going to make an accusation like this, have the courage to do it in open forum where everyone can see it for what it is.

VG, God bless your daughter.

I'm also stunned. Look at who is posting the laughing icon at some of the responses. Sick.

Regarding the masks, I'm told the normal ones in use are primarily for protecting the patient, although you would sure think they would offer some protection.

 

[Carbon]

Don’t take the PPE and union protection for granted. On one hand, the union will keep the shitbags from getting fired, but I bet the union doesn’t tolerate the types of things going on in non union hospitals with PPE right now. My wife, a non union NICU RN, is prohibited from wearing a mask, even if she supplies her own (which she has, because the decent company that I work for donated them), because they are ‘unnecessary’ and alarm and frighten parents.

My sister in law is temporarily living with my wife and I, waiting for her new house to close and just started a new job in the ICU at one of Arizona’s largest hospitals.
On her first shifts they put her with COVID patients, but are unable to provide the appropriate PPE because they don’t have enough.
We all got symptoms over the weekend and got tested.

To my absolute amazement, they told her that she would have to continue reporting to work until she received a confirmed positive test. Now, that could make a little sense if COVID patients were their only patients but they also take care of non COVID patients.
It’s horrifying to hear how wreckless the hospital is with other patient’s safety.
Sending nurses who were just exposed to COVID, without adequate PPE, in to rooms to care for deathly ill, non covid patients.
To the vast majority of us that are young and healthy coronavirus really is ‘just the flu’ if we get it. To people already in the ICU for terrible illnesses it’s pretty much a sure death sentence.
The hospital administration is going to kill people.

This is stunning to me. My mom winters in AZ and has pretty severe COPD. Luckily, she’s been very careful to avoid being exposed. If she were in the hospital and contracted the virus from someone known to have been exposed and not REQUIRED to were proper PPE to prevent transmission, my head would explode. I would do everything within my power to see that whatever administrators made that decision payed a steep price, including being removed from the healthcare field, if possible. Absolutely stunning.

VG, sorry to hear you have to deal with dipshits. Prayers for your daughter and hardworking, caring healthcare workers.

 

[MTGomer]

This is stunning to me. My mom winters in AZ and has pretty severe COPD. Luckily, she’s been very careful to avoid being exposed. If she were in the hospital and contracted the virus from someone known to have been exposed and not REQUIRED to were proper PPE to prevent transmission, my head would explode. I would do everything within my power to see that whatever administrators made that decision payed a steep price, including being removed from the healthcare field, if possible. Absolutely stunning.

VG, sorry to hear you have to deal with dipshits. Prayers for your daughter and hardworking, caring healthcare workers.

If your mother were in the ICU, she could be cared for by a nurse that was caring for COVID patients and the nurse would very likely be wearing the same surgical (not N95) mask she had on when he/she was just in the COVID + room.
He/She would have likely worn an N95 (the same one he/she has been using all week) if he/she was intubating or extubating the covid patient, otherwise it would be a surgical mask.
The nurse may not have worn an N95 for the intubation if it was done in an emergency to save a life, as he/she wouldn’t have had time to retrieve it from the locked cabinet management has them stored.

The nurse would absolutely be wearing the same scrubs.

Under ‘normal’ circumstances, from what I’m told, hospital staff would wear gowns, shoe covers, N95s, face shields etc and it would all be single use, disposable for each entry to a room where a patient has a contagious disease.

TLDR; keep your mom away from the parts of the bigger hospitals were COVID patients are, if at all possible until this is over.

 

[TheJason]

Look at who is posting the laughing icon at some of the responses.

The same person who claims to desire objective conversation.

objective
[əbˈjektiv]

ADJECTIVE

1. (of a person or their judgment) not influenced by personal feelings or opinions in considering and representing facts.Contrasted with subjective.
   "historians try to be objective and impartial"
   synonyms:
   impartial · unbiased · unprejudiced · nonpartisan · disinterested ·
   [more]

Hopefully the same level of callous and lack of empathy and objectivity doesn't bleed over to the law enforcement side, but unlikely.

 

[Carbon]

If your mother were in the ICU, she could be cared for by a nurse that was caring for COVID patients and the nurse would very likely be wearing the same surgical (not N95) mask she had on when he/she was just in the COVID + room.
He/She would have likely worn an N95 (the same one he/she has been using all week) if he/she was intubating or extubating the covid patient, otherwise it would be a surgical mask.
The nurse may not have worn an N95 for the intubation if it was done in an emergency to save a life, as he/she wouldn’t have had time to retrieve it from the locked cabinet management has them stored.

The nurse would absolutely be wearing the same scrubs.

Under ‘normal’ circumstances, from what I’m told, hospital staff would wear gowns, shoe covers, N95s, face shields etc and it would all be single use, disposable for each entry to a room where a patient has a contagious disease.

TLDR; keep your mom away from the parts of the bigger hospitals were COVID patients are, if at all possible until this is over.

Will do. Thanks Gomer!

 

[rmauch20]

The same person who claims to desire objective conversation.



Hopefully the same level of callous and lack of empathy and objectivity doesn't bleed over to the law enforcement side, but unlikely.

If you’re speaking about me, I am flattered, by the way I retired after 22 years last fall. So my lack of empathy and callousness has transitioned into the oil field. Anyway, continue to be lemmings. Good luck to you all. If you guys ever make it to Salina area send me a message to have a beer LOL. I am out!

 

[Europe]

.For those few who sent me PMs accusing me of making up this story to curry favor/sympathies on Hunttalk, you have showed your true stripes. This is an extremely stressful situation for people I love and I don't care if your political/conspiracy blinders don't allow you to hear the experiences of others. Your selfishness is self evident and feel free to not waste your time PMing such outrageous BS.

It is what one does when know one is looking that is important.

In this particular case, someone was looking, but it would not/does not matter to your daughter whether someone was/is looking or not. She knew what had to be done and did it! and will continue to do so.

It not only speaks well of her but also of the man who raised her.

As to your above post. believe me I understand and have suggested to those who do not like me to put me on "ignore" and they will not see my posts.

right now I am unable to post anyway. I am trying to assist where I can, but at my age I am so tired in the evening I go right to sleep. I joked with a couple other ladies my age the other day and told them. I am now going to bed at the same time I use to be putting on my makeup to go out for the evening---aaaaggghhhh I hate old age, but it is better than the alternative (-;

All the best to everyone, stay safe

Back to this thread------Kudos to your daughter and please thank her!

 

[mottlet]

Refusing to treat while having the proper PPE is a tough action to defend. That being said, it would be hard for me to argue with a nurse that refused to treat someone if they didn’t have the correct PPE. That’s a tough call to make but as a health care provider or first responder, your health/safety trumps everything else within reason. I have a feeling those hospitals would change their tune on not allowing nurses to wear masks if they stood together and refused to treat patients without proper PPE. Once again that’s a tough call to make but you have to stand up for what is right.

Everybody ought to read that again. Little sister is an ICU nurse in DC, her husband is a police officer, also in the District. They have two boys, 4 and 2.


We'll send soldiers into the sandbox without batteries for their night vision and nurses into a pandemic without a friggin mask, all to keep a tight grip on a bottom line. And we expect em to be ok with it because when it hits the fan, we'll call em heroes and thank em for their service as we lower em into the ground. My sister ain't trying to get anybody to write a song about her, she just wants to do her job, safely, and go home to her family.

 

[Panda Bear]

mottled, I certainly understand you point and can not argue with it. However, men and women do walk into the mouth of the lion for a variety of reasons and like you say, maybe they should not. I read of soldiers saving the soldiers, police officers saving the public or other officers, health providers saving folks who need help, even ordinary citizens doing things they would normally not do and probably should not do in an effort to help others. I have on occasion put myself between a bear and a child or older citizen, when they should not have been where they were, the town should have made sure they were not there at that time, but sometimes we just react. I guess I fall into the group that sides with Vikingguys daughter.

I certainly hope that Vikingsguy's daughter will be o.k. and that the patient she treated is o.k. and I will not and am not judging those who would not help at that particular point in time.

I also thank your sister and her husband for their service and hope they both stay safe.

 

[VikingsGuy]

Thank you for all your kind words and support. My wife and I are indeed proud of our daughter and thankful to all first responders and health care workers throughout Hunttalk nation. Focusing on her was not the intent of my OP, it was really more about pointing out the short-sightedness of the "deniers". But again, thanks all.

Take care, stay safe and shoot straight.

 

[Pucky Freak]

My employer initially banned masks - too scary for clientele. Now they are all but required. As we all know, things change rapidly in a pandemic.

My wife works PRN direct care in a long-term care facility. Just 3 outbreaks in Iowa’s 400+ facilities so far, and not the one she works in.

Her employer recently contacted her and begged her to take more hours. Coworkers have other illnesses and are having to stay home, creating a shortage.

We had a discussion about heroism and cowerdice in these times and what to do. I need her at home to care for our 3 young kids, but I can watch them on weekends. Part of her wants to quit her job to keep our family safe, and the other part wants to help others outside our family too.

We decided she will pick up some extra shifts, wearing homemade masks. I will cancel *some* of my turkey hunting. We also decided that if/when COVID-19 shows up in long-term care locally, she’ll be picking up a lot more shifts and I’ll be Mr. Mom for a while.

Thanks for everyone out there on the front lines of the epidemic working to keep us all safe and healthy.

 

[Marshian]

If your mother were in the ICU, she could be cared for by a nurse that was caring for COVID patients and the nurse would very likely be wearing the same surgical (not N95) mask she had on when he/she was just in the COVID + room.
He/She would have likely worn an N95 (the same one he/she has been using all week) if he/she was intubating or extubating the covid patient, otherwise it would be a surgical mask.
The nurse may not have worn an N95 for the intubation if it was done in an emergency to save a life, as he/she wouldn’t have had time to retrieve it from the locked cabinet management has them stored.

The nurse would absolutely be wearing the same scrubs.

Under ‘normal’ circumstances, from what I’m told, hospital staff would wear gowns, shoe covers, N95s, face shields etc and it would all be single use, disposable for each entry to a room where a patient has a contagious disease.

TLDR; keep your mom away from the parts of the bigger hospitals were COVID patients are, if at all possible until this is over.

As a physician who intubated a known covid patient last night, I’m very glad my hospital isn’t having the staff use the bare bones scenario described above. All staff in our Covid ward must wear an N95, face shield protector,plastic jump suit, gown, double gloves and booties at all times. A surgical mask doesn’t protect you hardly at all, instead it protects those around you by catching your cough and aerosolized viral particles if you are infected. I would absolutely refuse to work in a Covid Ward, no matter my job description, if I wasn’t given an N95 mask or some other purified air respirator system.

Also, it’s not terribly common to have to flat out emergently intubate a Covid patient. They deteriorate usually over a matter of hours so you do have enough lead time to don protective gear. You are of no use to any patient if you are sick or dead. Best wishes to all the hardworking nurses and medical staff out there.