My Two-year HOWA Experiment

[rjthehunter]

My biggest question is why wouldn't they make a left handed action? 30% of the population is left eye dominant... I'm right handed but left eye dominant. They're cutting off a pretty large percentage of possible customers due to not making a left handed action. I'm not going to spend any amount of money on a rifle if it's not left handed. I've been given a couple right handed rifles, and I simply don't use them. Sure a guy could shoot a right handed rifle and make it work but they weren't designed that way. They're designed to shoot with one hand and rack the bolt with the same hand, thus keeping your finger off the trigger while racking the bolt. I've shot a lot and in semi auto rifles it isn't such a big deal but for a bolt action rifle, I just don't understand. They're giving up 30% of possible sales.

 

[VikingsGuy]

What is the reason for BigFin’s distaste for brakes?

I won’t speak for BigFin, but my recollection (which could be wrong) was the muzzle blast/noise/hearing downside.

 

[88man]

Brakes you either love them or hate them. Most of my friends once they had a brake installed on one rifle had brakes installed on all new rifles thereafter.

 

[rjthehunter]

Brakes you either love them or hate them. Most of my friends once they had a brake installed on one rifle had brakes installed on all new rifles thereafter.

I've got a brake on my 338 that came from Gentry. No sound increase with it. It's a pretty sweet design and makes a 338 feel like a 270 without ruining the shooters ears.

Gentry Custom Quiet Muzzle Brake | Gentry Custom

Gentry Custom is recognized as a leading gunsmith & custom rifle builder. We also offer installation of our popular Quiet Muzzle Brakes. CALL: (406) 388-4867

gentrycustom.com

 

[Fire_9]

I've got a brake on my 338 that came from Gentry. No sound increase with it. It's a pretty sweet design and makes a 338 feel like a 270 without ruining the shooters ears.

Gentry Custom Quiet Muzzle Brake | Gentry Custom

Gentry Custom is recognized as a leading gunsmith & custom rifle builder. We also offer installation of our popular Quiet Muzzle Brakes. CALL: (406) 388-4867

gentrycustom.com

There is no such thing as a muzzle brake that doesn’t increase noise levels for the shooter or by standards. It may be less than some but there will still be an increase. Most brakes shot in an open area aren’t too bad for the shooter. It’s the guy sitting next to him that takes the brunt of it

 

[rjthehunter]

There is no such thing as a muzzle brake that doesn’t increase noise levels for the shooter or by standards. It may be less than some but there will still be an increase. Most brakes shot in an open area aren’t too bad for the shooter. It’s the guy sitting next to him that takes the brunt of it

It doesn't increase the sound to me. I've shot it with and without. Yes it might increase for the person next to me but they can plug their ears, they don't need to focus on the shot. The reduction in recoil is worth more than the increase in sound around me IMO

 

[Miller8812]

I know I’m about 6 months too late to this debate but I have a 300 win with a 26in barrel and I’d much rather have a 24.

 

[Losing_Sanity]

It is still interesting to me that after reading this post and other threads on this Howa package, that there is no 30-06 option. Seems to me that the old ought-six would be a "give me" for marketing, given it's commonality. Almost everyone I talk to has owned or will own a 30-06 at some point in time. I know it's beating a dead horse, but this one still gets me...

 

[noharleyyet]

Give me the full 26 for heavy powder...and no, not 2" more for a brake. I've never owned a 30-378 due to it's goose gun specs with a brake.

 

[VikingsGuy]

It is still interesting to me that after reading this post and other threads on this Howa package, that there is no 30-06 option. Seems to me that the old ought-six would be a "give me" for marketing, given it's commonality. Almost everyone I talk to has owned or will own a 30-06 at some point in time. I know it's beating a dead horse, but this one still gets me...

If you have owned and hunted with ‘06’s for years you probably aren’t the target for this gun. The worst decision a marketer can make is making feature selections based on the preferences of folks who are unlikely to buy your product anyway. I think they have made good choices for a one-gun western hunter looking to upgrade from a cheap starter rifle or old hand-me down. Targeting first time hunters would drive different specs, as would targeting old-timers, PA woods hunters or dedicated hand loaders.

 

[Hunt_4life]

7mm is my favourite elr and hunting caliber. 7-08 should be more popular in my opinion.

 

[Michael Case]

Over the last two years we have been shooting a wide variety of Howa rifles, barrel lengths and tapers, cartridges, stocks, etc. The idea is to come up with a few (five or less) rifle options that are considered a great value for people looking for one rifle to cover the majority of their hunting. For me, value is the intersection of performance and price.

My role was that of a hunter for over 40 years, with the last dozen years being 100+ days per season. I gave my ideas, maybe more like wishes, to Howa. They have been making/selling rifles for a long-time and they know that gig. They built what I asked and sent them for me to use and test. They have relationships with manufacturers that allow for many options to consider.

I had to put aside some of my personal biases, yet demand certain features based on my personal experiences of hunting many species in many different conditions. A bit more challenging than expected when value is paramount to the end product.

With my belief that value is the intersection of price and performance, here is how I approached both those intersection variables.

Price - My goal when we started were to come up with 3-5 chamberings, in the best performing combinations we/I have found, so that the average hunter can buy one of these rifle/scope combos with complete confidence. That is all done within the sideboards of an end pricing model that will appeal to the average hunter. Popular chamberings and projected sales must be considered when determining what level of "scale" will be realized that can further bring down cost, thereby improving value.

Performance - There are some aspects that I think are critical to an accurate, durable, rifle, no matter the price point. Accuracy is paramount, and the Howa barreled action on which this is built comes with a great reputation for accuracy. Triggers are so much a part of accuracy that an excellent trigger is a must; something Howa is known for. A stock that is suited for consistent performance in all conditions. Cartridge chamberings that can perform well with factory ammunition and is readily available. Protection from weather by fully Cerakote-ing the barrel/action/bolt. Scopes and stocks that I have tried and know to work.

This was a seemingly easy project when we first took it on. When you start down the path with value as the end goal, you quickly realize where costs pile up and how to assess the cost-benefit of each feature you might consider. Decisions must be made that keep the "value equation" a highest priority.

A few things I know we have finalized:

Four chamberings have been solidified, with a fifth being considered. The idea being to give coverage for the person more likely to be hunting elk, or elk a bit more than deer, or the person who hunts elk and deer about the same, and the person who might hunt only deer or antelope. Those chamberings will be:

1. .300 Win Mag - 24" barrel (all barrels being a #2 contour)
2. 7mm Rem Mag - 24" barrel
3. .308 Win - 22" barrel
4. 6.5 Creedmoor - 22" barrel
5. 7mm-08 is being considered, but every ammo manufacturer says it is losing popularity. Most know of my affection for that cartridge, but if having to make my short-action choice between a .308 and a 7mm-08 where one can be produced at a scale with significantly better value, it's a no brainer. I am lobbying that our audience would buy enough 7mm-08s that sales would be better than projecting from ammo sales.

The scope combination for this set up will be a Leupold VX3i with CDS. Again, to create the greatest value (price/performance), it will be a 3.5-10x40mm. Will come with Leupold rings and bases. The glass of the VX3i is excellent, as is the price for what you get with that scope. I see the CDS as a huge value item for the small marginal cost.

Stock will be an H-S Precision, the same as what Howa has been using in their recent Howa-HS packages. There is just not a stock option out there that can compete with the quality/price mix of the H-S. It will have its own custom color scheme that adds no cost, as colors have never improved performance.

Right now it seems as though one retailer is excited to have the exclusive on the package. Should know more about that in the next week. Hope to have it shipping to the retailer sometime in August.

No pictures yet, as none of the prototypes we were testing look like this final package.

I hope when the average hunter is making their decision about their next hunting rifle purchase, this package will be very attractive. I do know that they will not find a package that performs as well as this package, at the price this package will be sold for (and pricing is very close to being finalized). I think most hunters end up in a quandary or analysis paralysis when it comes to buying their first few rifles. These packages are tried and tested, such that they can buy any of these chamberings and not look back.

A few things that were crossed off at the beginning, as a function of anticipated demand, end cost to buyer, and production availability.

I was thinking of the person who is buying their first rifle, or filling out a breadth of options to cover a few more possibilities. As a result of my approach, the hunter/shooter looking for a specialty cartridge to fill in the small gaps between their current rifles, or the person willing to spend a few thousand extra for any/every small upgrade, is probably not the intended buyer.

I never expect a huge array of chamberings. The lower selling models add cost to the more popular models, thereby pressuring my "value goal."

The super lightweight option that replaces the Alpine Mountain Rifle is not going to be available this year, but we have had meetings about such and I have held a prototype. Unfortunately, the cost will be significantly higher than what this first rifle project allowed for.

And to answer in advance, Howa does not offer left-handed models. Sorry about that.

In my decision to buy my last two Rifles I found not only Randy Newburg but Howa Rifles, the one led to the other.
Granted the Howa was more $$ than the cheeper brands but I buy for longevity and durability. I tried everything on the market before I went with Howa.
And I have one of many brands. But I have seen most of them change over the years. In both quality and function.
The 308 I purchased was an additional replacement for a 1965 model 70 Featherwight, to nice to be in inclement weather. The 243 to be a short range deer Rifle to supplement a custom "Long Range " one I built from a Mausur k98 14 lbs. A bit to heavy to buck brush. Price today for a Savage $245 on sale but the bolt is not to my liking and it is "imho" not good enough to be handed down for future generations.
Some may forget or not know Howa made at one time "All" Weatherby Rifles and some think that they are "The Greatest"
My rant for the day maybe

 

[Michael Case]

If you have owned and hunted with ‘06’s for years you probably aren’t the target for this gun. The worst decision a marketer can make is making feature selections based on the preferences of folks who are unlikely to buy your product anyway. I think they have made good choices for a one-gun western hunter looking to upgrade from a cheap starter rifle or old hand-me down. Targeting first time hunters would drive different specs, as would targeting old-timers, PA woods hunters or dedicated hand loaders.

The 06 is the most used in my lifetime of Hunting, I have 3 and still use them. But also like variety and at times less recoil even though I change every butt pad to Packmyre. I don't recommend an 06 for beginning hunters but that caliber has taken every critter in North America

 

[Michael Case]

I am not a package gun guy myself but like the idea of a quality rifle paired with a quality scope. All the package guns I've see are a little too 'budget friendly' with cheap plastic stocks and throwaway scopes. It should be a nice option for folks looking for a one and done rifle/scope combo with a big step up in quality from other package gun combos.

I'd be remiss if i didn't put a plug in for us lefty's. It probably won't happen but Howa has at least one sold if they should ever drop.

I have been a "Lefty" but admittedly I switch back and forth, I'm not eye dominant either. For me a 30-30 was my go-to when I was 8, a pump shotgun my friend and my first rifle as an adult was a Rem 760 pump. But I like the range consistency of bolt guns and the overall stringth they afford. In ROTC in HS the international free rifle in 22 was our go to and it was only Right Handed so I got jaded. I still switch a RH bolt if needed when Hunting. Not everyone can. But it helps sometimes.

 

[runningmt]

Such a shame that the 6.8 Creedmoor Ackley Improved Short Mag with a 37.5” barrel didn’t make the cut.