MT Legislature - Week 5

[Lawnboy]

Lawnboy, I'll add this for you to think about. The FW&Ps commission voted this in, to address the outfitter's leasing all the good private lands around the CMR. If you don't limit residents then you can't limit NR, by Montana Law. The fact that they picked high enough numbers to give all residents a tags speaks volumes. Why would you be for anything that helps to mitigate some of the leasing problems, and gives Resident hunters less competition from the NR, and outfitters?

The objective numbers were set to socially acceptable numbers from the Ag community. They picked 2000 head, when there was 4000. There was 2700 at last count. I don't think I would use those numbers to support my position.

I don't have much of a dog in this fight, because I hunt the Western part of the state. It actually hurt us a bit, because some of the NR hunters that didn't draw, came west last year.

I can understand maybe what you're saying about the CMR but my unit is far away from that and so is many of the other ones that they went to this system. Why not do the whole state them?(I pray not)

Wouldn't the new rule that eliminates outfitters tags sort of take away some of these issues?

My main beef is the blanketing of almost half the state with this. I'm deathly afraid of our state turning into a Utah of small seasons, choose your weapon etc..... It has made me chose either to apply first choice for archery or first choice for rifle (which is a tough draw). If I put the archery second as a back up I more than likely won't draw it with the current tag allocations. Like I said I'm not hunting the Breaks I'm refering to the Snowies, Mocassins, Bear Paws, Ashland and many others. I don't see huge conflicts in these areas as they have a mix of private and public.
I realize we have been spoiled in Montana but once we begin restrictions it seems that we can never go back.

 

[shoots-straight]

[I can understand maybe what you're saying about the CMR but my unit is far away from that and so is many of the other ones that they went to this system. Why not do the whole state them?(I pray not)
/QUOTE]

The Western third of the state is mostly public lands, doesn't apply. You can't lease public lands for hunting.

Wouldn't the new rule that eliminates outfitters tags sort of take away some of these issues?

It might, but I really don't think it will have a big impact. NR, hunters will still pay access fees. I-161 hadn't been voted in, when the commission did their thing.

My main beef is the blanketing of almost half the state with this. I'm deathly afraid of our state turning into a Utah of small seasons, choose your weapon etc..... It has made me chose either to apply first choice for archery or first choice for rifle (which is a tough draw). If I put the archery second as a back up I more than likely won't draw it with the current tag allocations. Like I said I'm not hunting the Breaks I'm refering to the Snowies, Mocassins, Bear Paws, Ashland and many others. I don't see huge conflicts in these areas as they have a mix of private and public.
I realize we have been spoiled in Montana but once we begin restrictions it seems that we can never go back.

So my question would be: Has the hunting, and the hunt experience, in those areas been better, the same, or worse, sense the commission made them limited entry?

 

[Lawnboy]

SS, I would say the experience is the same hunting those districts the bummer is having to decide whether you want to try for an almost impossible rifle draw as your first choice or archery. You can't have both because there are archery quotas now and they fill up on first choice applicants. I know it sounds stupid but it has really limited your options. The reality is that you're not going to draw a rifle tag but by just putting in for the 1 in a million chance you've eliminated yourself for archery all together.

I realize that public can't be leased. I also realize that private is private. Seems most landowners have a grudge against FWP whether legitimate or not. They hate them and they aren't going to open up they're lands to the public no matter what. Which if I had an awesome ranch I don't think I would allow every tom, dick or harry to hunt on either. I would also realize that if the wildlife were doing damage and I wasn't allowing any hunting I would have to just deal with these issues.

I also know that the leasing issue isn't strictly a NR issue. There are lots of Bozeman "rich guys" that are leasing up places all over the state. It would be interesting to see how much is actually leased by residents over non. Which while it sucks the odds that you and me could ever hunt these places is slim to none. So again I just think that the 2 groups fighting each other have put really less opportunity for you and me and I don't see how it's really helping accomplish whatever it is they are trying to accomplish.

I also have NR relatives and friends that would come out and archery hunt and now it's dang near impossible for them in these areas.

 

[BuzzH]

I guess it comes down to a decision...and IMO there isnt a bad choice.

Put in and draw the archery tag hunt a great unit with your bow. If you dont get an elk, go rifle hunt a general unit.

Apply for a rifle tag...draw it, have a good time. If not go bowhunt/rifle hunt a general area.

Doesnt seem like you're "sacrificing" much to me.

Also, the BEARS paw mountains were never unlimited archery permits...its been a draw area forever.

 

[Ben Lamb]

Up today:

House FWP:
10-FEB-11 3:00 PM 152 HB363 Provide for use of wolf license money Mike Cuffe
10-FEB-11 3:00 PM 152 HB370 Increase motor vehicle fee for state parks and Virginia & Nevada Cities Carolyn Squires
10-FEB-11 3:00 PM 152 HB387 Revise issuance of B-10 and B-11 hunting licenses & related permits Kelly Flynn

Senate Ag:
10-FEB-11 3:00 PM 335 SB237 Revise laws relating to brucellosis surveillance Ron Arthun

Of concern are both HB 363, which will require hunters and anglers to pay for livestock loss due to wolves, and SB 237, which will require FWP to "reduce prevalence" of brucellosis in elk (Test & Slaughter).

You can send comments to the House FWP members by scrolling down the page here

And to the Senate Ag committee here

 

[BuzzH]

I wish there was a wa to just tell the MT legislature to scrap every one of these stupid bills and then fire them for being some ignorant.

I'm tired of typing...

 

[Ben Lamb]

I'm tired of typing...

Only 2 1/2 more months to go.

 

[Lawnboy]

Thanks for the updates Ben. I'll quit griping and hijacking your important thread. It's not like I'm going to change anything anyways.

 

[Ben Lamb]

We're Americans, it's our right to gripe!

The debate on the archery tags is important. We're entering in to a world that might require more permits in certain areas, but I 100% agree with you that Montana should never, ever turn out like Utah.

Our liberal seasons are born out of a commitment to the resource, and the ability of hunters to conserve large tracts of land as well as forgo opportunity for the sake of doing what's right. If the Commission blows a decision, then hunters have to stand up and take them to task.

 

[Ben Lamb]

HB 309 has passed the House 57-43

Not sure who switched their vote.

Off to the Senate. Hopefully the Senators have a better understanding of what's at stake.

 

[tjones]

All ready contacting them Ben. Disappointing but not surprising.

 

[Ben Lamb]

Here's the executive action from yesterday.

Senate Fish and Game:

SB 134 - Provide for economic impact statements on FWP seasonal rules
Amended so that a request for an Econ impact statement must come 90 days before the rule is adopted. Still a bad bill.
Passed 7-3

SB 184 - Allow for Bow and Arrow hunting of Bison
Passed unanimously

SB 144 - Revise laws governing translocation of Bisonrohibit free roaming bison
Amended to include a sunset of 2013, and report any bison movement to EQC
Passed 9-1

House FWP:

HB 337 - Revise definitions related to Fish and Game Violations
Passed 17-3

HB 361 - Requiring the issuance of archery only elk permits at 2007 levels
Amended to to capture all districts included in 2008 seasonal rule
Passed 11-9

HB 372 - Clarify preference system laws for nonresident permits and licenses
Amended to exclude permits, and change party size from 6 to 5
Passed 20-0

HB 228 - Revise Hunting Privileges for youths
Reconsidered as amended
Passed 12-6

HB 173 - Allow artificial light on arrows for certain hunts
Motion to reconsider - failed 9-10

 

[drahthaar]

Am I reading that right? HB 228, no age limit for purchasing a hunting license?

 

[tjones]

We all need to keep track of these silly bills and who introduced them and how they voted then hit them hard come re election time. Nonsense most of it.

 

[Ben Lamb]

HB 228 was amended to set a minimum age of 10, only have 1 gun in the field, and mandate a mentor was with the kid.

 

[drahthaar]

HB 228 was amended to set a minimum age of 10, only have 1 gun in the field, and mandate a mentor was with the kid.

Still adds that many more dead cows to the pile, one gun, BFD, when most cows are just dumped out of the window of the truck. This just makes me sick. This "youth" hunt should go the other way and be @#$%-canned completely.

I have said it before, the folks in BC figured it out, why can't we?

The stats from the Region 1 check stations showed "youth" hunters killed, or should I say "tagged" 70% of the cows brought through the check stations(that are only open on weekends, and now there isn't even one in Hungry Horse to see what they are bringing out of the south fork and middle fork). Not bad for a bunch of beginners. Riiiiiiiiight. As my buddy that was at one of the check stations noticed, amazing how they did that wearing sneakers and t-shirts, and never seemed to even get wet, even though dad was soaked. And all the cows were whole!!

WHAT A JOKE!!

 

[Ben Lamb]

Write your legislator and tell them: http://leg.mt.gov/css/find a legislator.asp

 

[BuzzH]

Wow, the youth hunting nationwide is getting a little out of hand.

I remember talking to a buddy when they opened cow hunting to youths in MT...he had one kid that just turned 12 the other turning 12 a couple years later. I remember him saying "well, at least we'll have elk steaks for the next 5 years"...wink-wink...

 

[drahthaar]

Write your legislator and tell them: http://leg.mt.gov/css/find a legislator.asp

Oh I have, it just never seems to end.

 

[drahthaar]

Wow, the youth hunting nationwide is getting a little out of hand.

I remember talking to a buddy when they opened cow hunting to youths in MT...he had one kid that just turned 12 the other turning 12 a couple years later. I remember him saying "well, at least we'll have elk steaks for the next 5 years"...wink-wink...

That is what I am saying, they are just blatant about it!!