MT FWP Tentative Season setting meetings

[Eric Albus]

huntin, what you said, I've been saying for years. Sask, and private land holding are the only reason there is a decent buck left in Eastern Mt. To little escape habitat and to many people equals a snowballs chance in Hades for a mule deer buck to make it to 5-6 yrs. of age.

Shorter seasons, more diverse seasons are the answer to placing less impact on the resource whilst still allowing the public to get out and hunt.

 

[antlerradar]

huntin,

Shorter seasons, more diverse seasons are the answer to placing less impact on the resource whilst still allowing the public to get out and hunt.

I hope this it the way we go. The other option is limited draw everywhere. There is no future in keeping the current season. The amount of slippage in both size, number of the deer and the quality of the hunt I have seen in hunting in SE MT in the last 40 years is breath taking. I don't see a light at the end of the tunnel if we stay with the current season structure.

Eric put forth a sold Plan but I think there are other options.

 

[el unit]

I would be all for shortening seasons. I think it needs to be kept simple to have any chance of happening. I also think it should be state wide, not just a bandaid here and there.

I agree.

 

[MTGomer]

People on here for the most part agree that there is an issue. They may not all agree what the solution is.

Does FWP acknowledge that there is an issue? I suspect not. If no, how would people convince them otherwise? Before we can get them to change anything, they will have to agree that there’s a reason.

 

[BuzzH]

People on here for the most part agree that there is an issue. They may not all agree what the solution is.

Does FWP acknowledge that there is an issue? I suspect not. If no, how would people convince them otherwise? Before we can get them to change anything, they will have to agree that there’s a reason.

Oh hell no, they think its great to eliminate big-game on public lands, they've been on a mission to that for at least 20 years, and they've succeeded.

The FWP leadership needs to be sent packing, they're living in denial. Their "data", both population estimates and harvest data, are complete chit...nothing makes any sense and their own numbers don't jive at all. You point it out, you're an A-hole, and the excuse machine rev's up to max.

They haven't listened to Sportsmen for a long, long time, no reason to believe they will now.

 

[Pagosa]

I hope this it the way we go. The other option is limited draw everywhere. There is no future in keeping the current season. The amount of slippage in both size, number of the deer and the quality of the hunt I have seen in hunting in SE MT in the last 40 years is breath taking. I don't see a light at the end of the tunnel if we stay with the current season structure.

Eric put forth a sold Plan but I think there are other options.

Agree, someone that puts forth a working plan will have support from like-minded hunters.

 

[u1299]

Ya let’s do something but you’re all dreaming if you think anything can be done to go back to the big buck era of the 50’s and 60’s.

 

[BuzzH]

Ya let’s do something but you’re all dreaming if you think anything can be done to go back to the big buck era of the 50’s and 60’s.

Totally agree, but this isn't all about mule deer...I'd settle for having whitetail hunting like I did in 2004, or elk hunting on public land in the mid-90's...or goat hunting like the root in the 80's...or sheep hunting like in the in the 90's...or pronghorn hunting like the late-80's-early 90's...or moose hunting like the 80's and 90's.

All have declined significantly...

Thank you MTFWP for providing the worse hunting I've seen in my lifetime in Montana.

No reason to change anything, carry on with your great "management"...

 

[mdunc8]

I’ve recently discussed this with the Region 7 supervisor and manager. There’s a near zero percent chance of anything happening in that region anytime soon.

 

[belly-deep]

I’ve recently discussed this with the Region 7 supervisor and manager. There’s a near zero percent chance of anything happening in that region anytime soon.

There’s a zero percent chance of anything happeneing anywhere. Unfortunately people will either have to get mad to the point of pitchforks and torches or the FWP will have to see revenue drop from the hunting being so bad people quit buying tags. I’m not betting on either one of those things happening.

 

[tjones]

Unfortunately people will either have to get mad to the point of pitchforks and torches or the FWP will have to see revenue drop from the hunting being so bad people quit buying tags.

Ya this will never happen. The majority of the hunters are not like guys on here. They don’t want less opportunity, they want more. Start talking more restrictive seasons and every 06 packing dude will cry foul. All they want is to be able to kill a cow, a forky and a big dry doe.

The Bitterroot units are about as restrictive as anywhere. It took a long time to get here and every 2 years its a fight to keep it. Pressure from hunters and other bios. Funny the other bios want things loosened up because too many Bitterroot hunters are hitting their units.

 

[antlerradar]

Ya let’s do something but you’re all dreaming if you think anything can be done to go back to the big buck era of the 50’s and 60’s.

I would be ecstatic if we could get back to the 90's. Happy if we could just stop the downward spiral.

 

[antlerradar]

I’ve recently discussed this with the Region 7 supervisor and manager. There’s a near zero percent chance of anything happening in that region anytime soon.

My fear is that in the future FWP in Region 7 will be mostly be reduced to a sideline role in management.

 

[Schaaf]

I absolutely want change in our season length and structure. I also will say I don’t necessarily agree that it is as bad as many on here believe. At least the public land I hunt. I haven’t asked a landowner to hunt in over 5 years and I can’t think of a season in recent memory that I haven’t been able to hunt mule deer over 165.

I’m also aware that I go out of my way to find secluded areas and that isn’t the general hunter’s experience.

 

[antlerradar]

FWP will have to see revenue drop from the hunting being so bad people quit buying tags. I’m not betting on either one of those things happening.

Back when I was on the licensing and funding advisory council I was shocked at number of people that have an ALS number but don't buy licenses every year. I thought that most hunters were like me and had bought a licence every year since they were 12. That is not the case.
People have ether quit hunting or taken management into there own hands and leased property for hunting. I wouldn't have people from Western Montana willing to pay me thousands of dollars each if the hunting was even close to good on public.

 

[antlerradar]

I absolutely want change in our season length and structure. I also will say I don’t necessarily agree that it is as bad as many on here believe. At least the public land I hunt. I haven’t asked a landowner to hunt in over 5 years and I can’t think of a season in recent memory that I haven’t been able to hunt mule deer over 165.

I’m also aware that I go out of my way to find secluded areas and that isn’t the general hunter’s experience.

Back in the 80's and 90's I could find several deer twenty inches better every year. The trend is not in the right direction.
A 165 buck is a nice buck but it could also be a three year old with good genetics.

 

[Schaaf]

I get that and that’s why I support change. I’m just pointing out that my experiences haven’t been the desolate wasteland that many have described.

 

[BuzzH]

I get that and that’s why I support change. I’m just pointing out that my experiences haven’t been the desolate wasteland that many have described.

Its probably worse than some are claiming, like anywhere along the Clark Fork west of Missoula for elk...its grim.

That's really sad too, because the hunting used to be pretty good that way, and for some really good bulls.

 

[u1299]

The advanced technology we all use and desire has contributed immensely to the decline in quality big game populations, just think back to what was available if you’re old enough, to even as recently a time as the 70’s and 80’s. Just “log in” and you have information at your fingertips that old bastards like me never had, all which means more hunters in the field, better equipped, never having to wonder what the hell is over the next ridge or beyond the next canyon because google earth solved that dilemma. It is what it is, can’t uninvent technology, and none of this is an excuse for not changing management to meet the current conditions, just a reminder IMO that we all contributed somewhat to where were at..

 

[onpoint]

I have been watching this discussion and have no disagreement that changes would have benefits. I also miss, say, 1991..............
However, unless I missed this, just a couple of factors for instance....
Montana's population has grown from about 787,000 (1980) to 1,043,000 (2016), a 32.5% increase. How many of those are like me - outdoorsmen/women who moved here to capitalize on what is/was here? What effects have this increase in users brought to the resource? What changes can be implemented to please the largest number of folks (resident hunters, ranchers, farmers, non consumptive users - yup, they matter too, non resident hunters, etc) while benefiting the resource?
Also since, 1980 - Montana land use and the type of ownership of large tracts of land has changed dramatically. Along with that change in ownership types has come a massive change (as compared to 40 years ago) in the general public's ability to access private lands.
It's gonna take a very large amount of coordinated and organized grass roots work to orchestrate change that'll satisfy the majority of the wide range of stakeholders in this one...........