MT FWP and Shoulder Seasons.

[tjones]

"“Frustratingly I hear the enthusiasm for the shoulder seasons from the department as being this great fix. It is working, but I’m still stymied by the idea that we’re hunting elk for seven months in Montana. Who’d have thought that was a reasonable approach?” Colton said. “I also struggle with the idea that one week, this animal is worth anywhere from $6,000 to $13,000 and the next week, it’s treated like a rodent. We’ve lost, I fear.” Commissioner Colton.


Vore said he didn’t have the money or the manpower to rewrite the 2004 Elk Plan yet. The department is finishing its mountain lion management plan and then it will take two years of assessment and public input to write the next elk plan, Vore said. He also echoed a warning made by former FWP Director Jeff Hagener.

“Director Hagener said if we open up revisiting the population objectives, some could also go down,” Vore said.


http://www.montanaotg.com/blog-nati...7uGvL2fDlAVhO81uMFewiBkAzkeQ0PkUztWLtpn9OK4yA

 

[Sytes]

Always a bummer to have your post get lost amidst the various other threads on shoulder season comments. This guy on hunt talk once shared the following;

View attachment 84989

Though hell, what's wrong with another thread on Shoulder seasons? After all, it's just the internet. And for sake of a response; It's a bummer residents can not pony up 20% on our Sportsman Package, etc to support our Biologists, Wardens and yes, of course the administrative staffing/costs to assist with funds necessary to put together another comprehensive game management plan. Instead - I suppose we hit the non residents again.

 

[tjones]

I know you are new to all this but with the start of the session its relevant Charles. And its real simple even for you, if you don't like a thread simply don't click on it.

I guess we could keep beating the wolf dead horse.

 

[Sytes]

Oh snap, Tony... as others share, just having a bit of fun. Carry on.

 

[BuzzH]

Always a bummer to have your post get lost amidst the various other threads on shoulder season comments. This guy on hunt talk once shared the following;



Though hell, what's wrong with another thread on Shoulder seasons? After all, it's just the internet. And for sake of a response; It's a bummer residents can not pony up 20% on our Sportsman Package, etc to support our Biologists, Wardens and yes, of course the administrative staffing/costs to assist with funds necessary to put together another comprehensive game management plan. Instead - I suppose we hit the non residents again.

WTF do they need more time and money for?

For hells sake, there hasn't been a change to the general hunt areas, about 99% of the state, since 1957. They sure aren't wasting any of their time and money figuring out new hunting season dates or season setting, that's for sure.

Pull them off all biology related work and get the EMP done. What good is data if you never use it to adjust seasons, etc.? Waste of time and money...they know elk populations are in the chit in large areas of Montana, they know their calf/cow ratio's suck, they know their bull to cow ratio's are crap...and then change absolutely nothing.

Data not used for any meaningful management decisions, is data that may as well not exist.

Thanks for the info tjones….

 

[Sytes]

Buzz, WTF do they need more $? Ha!

To properly fund the FWP Law Enforcement versus the State fudging with the Pittman-Robertson Fed $ by having our law enforcement arm handling wildlife management for 14 hours of their 40 hour work week. Instead - use that funding to support the intent of the biologists / admin for a new Elk Plan. The purpose within the scope of the Pittman-Robertson.

 

[tjones]

Buzz, WTF do they need more $? Ha!

To properly fund the FWP Law Enforcement versus the State fudging with the Pittman-Robertson Fed $ by having our law enforcement arm handling wildlife management for 14 hours of their 40 hour work week. Instead - use that funding to support the intent of the biologists / admin for a new Elk Plan. The purpose within the scope of the Pittman-Robertson.

FWP wardens were funded properly until last session when the R's adjusted the FWP budget. HR2 I believe. Ben Lamb?

IIRC the lion plan has been in the works 3 years.

 

[bigsky2]

I've always liked what that Colton guy has to say. Seems like he's always outnumbered though.

 

[ImBillT]

Seven months! I didn’t realize y’all were hitting them for that long! No wonder there’s so much frustration.

 

[BuzzH]

Buzz, WTF do they need more $? Ha!

To properly fund the FWP Law Enforcement versus the State fudging with the Pittman-Robertson Fed $ by having our law enforcement arm handling wildlife management for 14 hours of their 40 hour work week. Instead - use that funding to support the intent of the biologists / admin for a new Elk Plan. The purpose within the scope of the Pittman-Robertson.

Makes a lot of sense to have a warden bust their ass all year stopping poachers so the elk can be mowed down from August 15-February 15...

Almost as frustrating as having a biologist, and paying them to collect data that they cant use to make management decisions. Just the same way they cant make a change in season length, number of tags issued, etc. For what the department provides, they have more funding than they need. Plus, I'm not about to pay more for the lack of management that happens in Montana. IMO, I have no idea why any NR would pay the fees they do to hunt Montana, unless they have access to decent private. I pay half price for my NR OTC deer tag in Montana, and if not for hunting with my family that are still residents, I wouldn't even do that. I refuse to buy an elk tag, even though I can get one for less than I DONATE to Wyoming's AccessYes program.

You cant even find an elk to kill in Montana in 7 months and you think the lack of funding and wolves are causing your woes?

Wow...

 

[Sytes]

A real bummer that all law enforcement operations have been cut back 33% for Montana's Fish Wildlife and Parks. No doubt about it. Pretty darn wet pile of horse shnitz! Look at that, we agree on one aspect.

Oh wait - you do agree with at least that, right?

 

[BuzzH]

Real bummer there's barely enough wildlife left on public land to warrant protecting...

Or that Residents hunters that have purchased elk tags for 20-30-40-50+ years are no longer doing so.

That's a bummer.

 

[PaulRevere]

It disgusts me to think about my license fee dollars going to the administration of this slaughter.

 

[Sytes]

It's a bummer Montana's "Shoulder Season" was not implemented as desired by RMEF. The season as envisioned by RMEF was a good fit.

It's a bummer the Pittman-Robertson Federal $ has been made to water down needed FWP law enforcement operations versus supportive funding for a new elk management plan.

It's a bummer...

Yup - it is a bummer.

 

[Sytes]

FYI for any interested in sharing your opinions, this was shared in the other Shoulder Season thread. Comment period goes through until January 18th. Input is accepted from any state. Whether they listen to the public or not... if you don't place your opinion - you know they didn't read it - that is fact. If you do... well, there is a better chance they read it...

http://fwp.mt.gov/hunting/publicComments/2018/elkShoulderSeasons.html

 

[mikewatson_22]

This was my first season hunting, so I'm probably not the best opinion to listen to but I hunted roughly 15 days in the general rifle season and 6 or 7 in the shoulder season and this is what is saw: Elk that knew exactly where the public/private boundaries were, a limited amount of public land that was actually available to hunt on, and a lot of elk still up in the high country with our warm winter (before this week). I think the shoulder season has the reputation of guys walking out in their buddy's field, putting down 3-4 elk, and driving the truck up to retrieve em. I'm sure this still happens but I wasn't seeing it.

What I saw on the public land hunts was what I think is fair chase. Myself and the one other person I know who filled a tag in the shoulder season were both hiking an average of 5 miles per day, hunting relatively hard. I guess at the end of the day everyone has their own set of ethics, they know if its fair chase or not before they pull that trigger.