Montana Proposed Black Bear Season Changes

[Labman]

This was proposed by the commission and not FWP. The current commission seems to generally lean towards opportunity over protecting the resource, at least when it comes to predators. I think FWP would have liked to see a quota implemented in the areas you mentioned.

There is a quota beginning June 1 on any district that would have normally closed on 31 May. See the peach colored banner at the bottom of the page where the seasons for each district is laid out.

 

[bigsky2]

There is a quota beginning June 1 on any district that would have normally closed on 31 May. See the peach colored banner at the bottom of the page where the seasons for each district is laid out.

It says BMU’s are subject to close after May 31st if female harvest reaches 37% of cumulative spring harvest. At least they put some protection in place, but I wouldn’t say that’s a quota. Maybe I’m missing what you’re referring to.

 

[SilentBirdHunter]

General comment/ opinion, no derail intended. Predators need to be decreased. Bears, lions, wolves, and coyotes. I personally feel there should be a state funded bounty on coyotes. $25 per tail. Grizzlies delisted and throw in a meaningful tag allotment.
Painting a broad swath.
Yeah, I know...

Why Coyotes when the majority of their diet is rodents and lagomorphs?

 

[Labman]

It says BMU’s are subject to close after May 31st if female harvest reaches 37% of cumulative spring harvest. At least they put some protection in place, but I wouldn’t say that’s a quota. Maybe I’m missing what you’re referring to.

Yep, that’s it. Not a set number but a set %.

 

[rogerthat]

Yep, that’s it. Not a set number but a set %.

So if 37% of the harvest by May 31st is female or the unit reaches 37% before June 15 the unit is closed?

 

[bigsky2]

So if 37% of the harvest by May 31st is female or the unit reaches 37% before June 15 the unit is closed?

On May 31st, so female harvest could vary significantly from year to year.

 

[mtmuley]

Why Coyotes when the majority of their diet is rodents and lagomorphs?

And deer fawns. mtmuley

 

[Lota lota]

I wanted to put this in a separate thread because I feel like it is flying under the radar and could have some big effects on our bear populations. Commissioner Cebull from Region 5 is proposing a statewide bear season closure of June 15th. Additionally, hunters will no longer be required to present harvested bears to FWP, and will instead be required to submit two teeth. Spring bear harvest already increased 11% with the introduction of hound hunting, and now we will be increasing harvest even further. Although I like the idea of hunting in June when bears are much more active, I wouldn't be surprised at all if this leads to an over harvest of bears. Maybe quotas need to be implemented as a safeguard. If we are going to increase harvest, it doesn't make sense to me to do away with the in person reporting. I feel that there will be a lot of hunters that will be too lazy to send in the teeth.

Here's the full amendment- https://fwp.mt.gov/binaries/content...esponse-to-statewise-black-bear-amendment.pdf

Comments will be accepted through December 7th by emailing the commission at [email protected] .

I worked for FWP for 4.5 years in Region 1...tagging bears, enforcing laws etc. The harvest isn't high at all. In fact, most of the harvest was from out of state hunters (Utah mainly). Why I don't know. I asked our regional biologist how many bears she thought were in the area. She said, "Roughly 1 per square mile". After the fact, I attended a season setting meeting and recommended a 2-bear quota, per person, per year (Like Idaho used to do). I said every Montana resident should have the opportunity to kill two bears a year (Spring and Fall Season). I was almost shouted out of the room by the Wildlife Manager. Montana has the LARGEST and most COMPREHENSIVE database on black bears in the continental United States (Why we are still taking teeth and data is beyond me). When I worked for FWP, we had a backlog of 7-10 years of teeth collected from bears at Mattson's in Manhattan...That still hadn't been processed. We are doing fine population wise...I've seen it first hand.

 

[Labman]

So if 37% of the harvest by May 31st is female or the unit reaches 37% before June 15 the unit is closed?

No restrictions until June 1 in units with no other restrictions and that used to close 31 May. Once June 1st hits if a district is over 37% female harvest the unit shuts down like any other quota type unit. Units that were open until 15 June in the past don’t have the harvest restrictions.

 

[bigsky2]

I worked for FWP for 4.5 years in Region 1...tagging bears, enforcing laws etc. The harvest isn't high at all. In fact, most of the harvest was from out of state hunters (Utah mainly). Why I don't know. I asked our regional biologist how many bears she thought were in the area. She said, "Roughly 1 per square mile". After the fact, I attended a season setting meeting and recommended a 2-bear quota, per person, per year (Like Idaho used to do). I said every Montana resident should have the opportunity to kill two bears a year (Spring and Fall Season). I was almost shouted out of the room by the Wildlife Manager. Montana has the LARGEST and most COMPREHENSIVE database on black bears in the continental United States (Why we are still taking teeth and data is beyond me). When I worked for FWP, we had a backlog of 7-10 years of teeth collected from bears at Mattson's in Manhattan...That still hadn't been processed. We are doing fine population wise...I've seen it first hand.

That doesn’t surprise me at all in Region 1. I would bet the June 15th extension won’t have a huge impact in that part of the state. I just don’t think all regions should be treated the same. Region 4 is totally different. We have smaller island ranges that are much more accessible, and based on a study that was done in region 4, the bear population in region 4 is already at the harvest threshold. Now we’re adding hound hunting and a June 15th extension with no quota.

This was posted on another thread, goes to show much bear hunting pressure has increased in just a few years though.

“FWP harvest statistics are definitely showing a big uptick in harvests from 2020 - present.

2017: Statewide (SW) - 1393, R1 - 507
2019: SW - 1457, R1 - 562
2020: SW - 1387, R1 - 504
2021: SW - 1974, R1 - 718
2022: SW - 2159, R1 - 749”

FWP :: Harvest Estimates

 

[Irishman]

I would think that an extension until June 15th would make a big change in region one. Many areas in Region one would become much more accessible by June than they are in mid May.

 

[Gerald Martin]

I worked for FWP for 4.5 years in Region 1...tagging bears, enforcing laws etc. The harvest isn't high at all. In fact, most of the harvest was from out of state hunters (Utah mainly). Why I don't know. I asked our regional biologist how many bears she thought were in the area. She said, "Roughly 1 per square mile". After the fact, I attended a season setting meeting and recommended a 2-bear quota, per person, per year (Like Idaho used to do). I said every Montana resident should have the opportunity to kill two bears a year (Spring and Fall Season). I was almost shouted out of the room by the Wildlife Manager. Montana has the LARGEST and most COMPREHENSIVE database on black bears in the continental United States (Why we are still taking teeth and data is beyond me). When I worked for FWP, we had a backlog of 7-10 years of teeth collected from bears at Mattson's in Manhattan...That still hadn't been processed. We are doing fine population wise...I've seen it first hand.

“She said ,roughly one per square mile…”

Same drivel I heard 20 years ago. How do they know? It’s easy to repeat what’s written in a manual and taught as “scientific”. There hasn’t been a black bear population study that I am aware of for decades in region one. The one tool used to evaluate the health of the overall population is seeing if hunters killed as many or more bears this year as they did last year. If they did kill as many, the population is doing great.


How many bears killed per year is “harvest isn’t high at all?”

 

[theat]

I worked for FWP for 4.5 years in Region 1...tagging bears, enforcing laws etc. The harvest isn't high at all. In fact, most of the harvest was from out of state hunters (Utah mainly). Why I don't know. I asked our regional biologist how many bears she thought were in the area. She said, "Roughly 1 per square mile". After the fact, I attended a season setting meeting and recommended a 2-bear quota, per person, per year (Like Idaho used to do). I said every Montana resident should have the opportunity to kill two bears a year (Spring and Fall Season). I was almost shouted out of the room by the Wildlife Manager. Montana has the LARGEST and most COMPREHENSIVE database on black bears in the continental United States (Why we are still taking teeth and data is beyond me). When I worked for FWP, we had a backlog of 7-10 years of teeth collected from bears at Mattson's in Manhattan...That still hadn't been processed. We are doing fine population wise...I've seen it first hand.

I love spring bear hunting in Montana. I spend 20-30 days out in the field almost every spring season.

A lot has changed over the past 20 years in region 1 and 2 when it comes to the amount of bears I see in the field as well as the amount of hunters pursuing them. There has always been certain areas that get quite a bit of pressure, but if I worked hard I could always find places others didn't want to put in the effort or risk to get to. That kind of place is getting harder and harder to find. All the best spots around me almost always have at least one or two rigs parked at the trailhead or gate pretty much everyday during May. I'm also seeing a lot less bears the past few years.

I have talked with a few region 1 and 2 biologists I had worked with in the past about the increased spring bear hunting pressure. All of them agree that it is not sustainable in the long run. Unfortunately, the overall FWP opinion these days is to kill as many bears as possible and they are told to keep a lid on their opinions.

Here is some FWP data comparing 2010 to 2022. I had these charts organized better, but when I posted it they keep getting smooshed together.

2010 Total MT Bear Tags Sold : 23,564 total 951 non resident
2022 Total MT Bear Tags Sold : 42,634 total 2,959 non resident
Difference: Increase of 19,070 hunters. 81% increase
Increase of 2,008 non resident hunters. 311% increase

Region 1 Harvest
2010: Females: 182 Males: 344 Total: 528
2022: Females: 277 Males: 472 Total: 749
Difference: Females: +52% Males: +37% Total: +42%

Region 2 Harvest
2010: Females: 116 Males: 203 Total: 319
2022: Females: 205 Males: 361 Total: 566
Difference: Females: +77% Males: +78% Total: +77%


I don't see how anyone that cares about having a healthy black bear population to continue hunting in the future, can look at the massive increases in hunter numbers and bears harvested and think that FWP's bear management system is sustainable. Almost doubling the amount of sows getting killed in 12 years is going to start dropping population numbers big time. I also completely agree with Geralds post above mine. FWP has almost ZERO understanding about what is going on with black bears in western Montana, and if they get their way with eliminating mandatory reporting, they will have even less than that.

 

[bigsky2]

I love spring bear hunting in Montana. I spend 20-30 days out in the field almost every spring season.

A lot has changed over the past 20 years in region 1 and 2 when it comes to the amount of bears I see in the field as well as the amount of hunters pursuing them. There has always been certain areas that get quite a bit of pressure, but if I worked hard I could always find places others didn't want to put in the effort or risk to get to. That kind of place is getting harder and harder to find. All the best spots around me almost always have at least one or two rigs parked at the trailhead or gate pretty much everyday during May. I'm also seeing a lot less bears the past few years.

I have talked with a few region 1 and 2 biologists I had worked with in the past about the increased spring bear hunting pressure. All of them agree that it is not sustainable in the long run. Unfortunately, the overall FWP opinion these days is to kill as many bears as possible and they are told to keep a lid on their opinions.

Here is some FWP data comparing 2010 to 2022. I had these charts organized better, but when I posted it they keep getting smooshed together.

2010 Total MT Bear Tags Sold : 23,564 total 951 non resident
2022 Total MT Bear Tags Sold : 42,634 total 2,959 non resident
Difference: Increase of 19,070 hunters. 81% increase
Increase of 2,008 non resident hunters. 311% increase

Region 1 Harvest
2010: Females: 182 Males: 344 Total: 528
2022: Females: 277 Males: 472 Total: 749
Difference: Females: +52% Males: +37% Total: +42%

Region 2 Harvest
2010: Females: 116 Males: 203 Total: 319
2022: Females: 205 Males: 361 Total: 566
Difference: Females: +77% Males: +78% Total: +77%


I don't see how anyone that cares about having a healthy black bear population to continue hunting in the future, can look at the massive increases in hunter numbers and bears harvested and think that FWP's bear management system is sustainable. Almost doubling the amount of sows getting killed in 12 years is going to start dropping population numbers big time. I also completely agree with Geralds post above mine. FWP has almost ZERO understanding about what is going on with black bears in western Montana, and if they get their way with eliminating mandatory reporting, they will have even less than that.

Thanks for sharing that. I knew the changes could have a negative effect on populations here in Region 4, but based on the lack of public comment against the season extension, I was assuming the changes wouldn't negatively affect region 1 and 2. Those numbers are pretty eye-opening.

The sad thing is, if the season extension does have negative consequences, I don't foresee there ever being a point where people will be advocating for more bears and trying to put any protections in place to reverse the trend. I think less bears and more bear hunters will just become the new normal.

 

[DinksOnly]

I have spent several years hunting northwest Montana for bears. It’s been abysmal to see the decline in bears and uptick in hunters. Doesn’t take long to see why when you look at the increase of license sales and increase in harvest. Who are most of these hunters? Non-residents. Why is there no cap on non-resident bear licenses? Or increase in price at the very least? YouTube has destroyed what once was a low key very unpressured luxury. Same for Turkey hunting. At the same time I’ve never seen so many mule deer in the areas i hunt in northwest Montana. Correlation between more predators being killed? Who knows.

Spend a lot of time hunting 510 as well. Half the quota being filled by non-residents every year? Why does no one seem to care about these things?

Before you know it Montana will be the only state left with OTC spring bear.

 

[cgasner1]

I have spent several years hunting northwest Montana for bears. It’s been abysmal to see the decline in bears and uptick in hunters. Doesn’t take long to see why when you look at the increase of license sales and increase in harvest. Who are most of these hunters? Non-residents. Why is there no cap on non-resident bear licenses? Or increase in price at the very least? YouTube has destroyed what once was a low key very unpressured luxury. Same for Turkey hunting. At the same time I’ve never seen so many mule deer in the areas i hunt in northwest Montana. Correlation between more predators being killed? Who knows.

Spend a lot of time hunting 510 as well. Half the quota being filled by non-residents every year? Why does no one seem to care about these things?

Before you know it Montana will be the only state left with OTC spring bear.

I doubt you even hunt mt

 

[406Outdoorsman]

I have spent several years hunting northwest Montana for bears. It’s been abysmal to see the decline in bears and uptick in hunters. Doesn’t take long to see why when you look at the increase of license sales and increase in harvest. Who are most of these hunters? Non-residents. Why is there no cap on non-resident bear licenses? Or increase in price at the very least? YouTube has destroyed what once was a low key very unpressured luxury. Same for Turkey hunting. At the same time I’ve never seen so many mule deer in the areas i hunt in northwest Montana. Correlation between more predators being killed? Who knows.

Spend a lot of time hunting 510 as well. Half the quota being filled by non-residents every year? Why does no one seem to care about these things?

Before you know it Montana will be the only state left with OTC spring bear.

I mean I see 20-30 bears a season in region 1 and I don't even hunt that much. Maybe you're not seeing them because you and everybody else drive up and down Thompson River Rd all day waiting for one to cross the road.

Complaining about turkey hunting pressure has got to be a first on here . If you're having trouble with those yard birds maybe just focus on harvesting one of those before you go looking for bears....... Best of luck to you young man.

 

[cgasner1]

I mean I see 20-30 bears a season in region 1 and I don't even hunt that much. Maybe you're not seeing them because you and everybody else drive up and down Thompson River Rd all day waiting for one to cross the road.

Complaining about turkey hunting pressure has got to be a first on here . If you're having trouble with those yard birds maybe just focus on harvesting one of those before you go looking for bears....... Best of luck to you young man.

Seems like the kinda guy to jump on here and says he is too busy with work to scout and would appreciate some help…. Not looking for any honey holes or anything

 

[DinksOnly]

Seems like the kinda guy to jump on here and says he is too busy with work to scout and would appreciate some help…. Not looking for any honey holes or anything

Dang it you guys know me. Yard birds are fun but it’s nice to really pound it on public for some real wild birds. I mean it’s a lot like elk hunting….. Maybe that’s why i can’t kill them i suck at that too.

Anyways…. 30 bears a season you got any spots to help a guy out? I’d prefer some of the local golf courses and trash bears. I prefer 3 footers but would maybe shoot 4. Easier to throw on my back like the pro guys do.

 

[DinksOnly]

I mean I see 20-30 bears a season in region 1 and I don't even hunt that much. Maybe you're not seeing them because you and everybody else drive up and down Thompson River Rd all day waiting for one to cross the road.

Complaining about turkey hunting pressure has got to be a first on here . If you're having trouble with those yard birds maybe just focus on harvesting one of those before you go looking for bears....... Best of luck to you young man.

What’s your definition of young man?