Montana 2025 Legislative Session

[Forkyfinder]

Good discussion guys. One observation I have about late season hunts is that I think a lot of hunters perceive of them as “easy” hunts and don’t actually have the skill required to be lethal when the situation calls for it.

I am of the opinion that a lot of the hunters signing up for “easy meat” damage hunts aren’t representative of the quality of hunters who are able to be successful in general seasons.

I personally have never signed up for a late season damage hunt. Mainly, because it isn’t my preferred style of hunting and by the time late season rolls around I have either filled my freezer and don’t need more meat or I have made peace with the critters for the year and am happy to leave them alone until the following year.

I’m personally of the opinion that if I were a landowner with an elk problem ( I am not), I’d let hunters help me with controlling the numbers but it would only be people whom I know to be good hunters and would trust to respect my property who I would be calling rather than random strangers of unknown skill and character.

Ive never been selected. Ive signed up twice, in total, i think. The comment about generalizing hunters who sign up for it is interesting to me. I personally find it strange that we can assign traits for an entire demographic based on 7-50 out of likely thousands who use it, and the near single digit land owners that have ever participated in the last 10 years. Who could you have possibly interacted with that gave you the evidence to draw that conclusion?

How many b tags should one person be able to buy? A long ways from infinite. Thats the relevant question.

 

[Carnage2011]

Ive never been selected. Ive signed up twice, in total, i think. The comment about generalizing hunters who sign up for it is interesting to me. I personally find it strange that we can assign traits for an entire demographic based on 7-50 out of likely thousands who use it, and the near single digit land owners that have ever participated in the last 10 years. Who could you have possibly interacted with that gave you the evidence to draw that conclusion?

How many b tags should one person be able to buy? A long ways from infinite. Thats the relevant question.

I know this probably won’t shock the HT crowd, but I’m questioning the data on this one. In the last two years alone I am aware of four damage hunts in two units that involved at least 45 guys. So either FWP has something weird with their data or this is the only place in the state to actually use damage hunts.

 

[BourbonSnowCone]

He might be.... In general - its probably not useful to roast legislators.

Besides that, put some respect on the name thats trying to repeal 635. I cant imagine thats popular amongst the special interest groups that try to lobby him.

Nice to meet you Jed.

 

[Forkyfinder]

Nice to meet you Jed.

Ya got me!

 

[SixPoint]

I know this probably won’t shock the HT crowd, but I’m questioning the data on this one. In the last two years alone I am aware of four damage hunts in two units that involved at least 45 guys. So either FWP has something weird with their data or this is the only place in the state to actually use damage hunts.

Folks are confusing damage hunts with supplemental hunts. There are thousands of hunters that register for damage hunts online. You pick a species and a unit and if there’s a damage hunt in that unit they work through the roster. In addition landowners can appoint a handful of hunters that aren’t on the roster. These hunts utilize existing licenses for the most part but can create a special license if need be.

Supplemental hunts are capped at 12 hunters. They are required to purchase a supplemental license that is only valid for that hunt. Hunters are not chosen off the damage roster.

 

[Rie Bread]

There are some type 1 and 2 BMA that offer some sort of roaster as well.

 

[Gulf of America]

Yup, exclusively. I maintain a list of folks from the local community that are proven killers and are good people, or ones who buy me beer.

Whereabouts and what kind of beer?

 

[Gerald Martin]

Ive never been selected. Ive signed up twice, in total, i think. The comment about generalizing hunters who sign up for it is interesting to me. I personally find it strange that we can assign traits for an entire demographic based on 7-50 out of likely thousands who use it, and the near single digit land owners that have ever participated in the last 10 years. Who could you have possibly interacted with that gave you the evidence to draw that conclusion?

How many b tags should one person be able to buy? A long ways from infinite. Thats the relevant question.

Obviously, my opinion about hunters who think late season hunts are an easy way to get meat is very broad brush. I wouldn’t read too far into it to conclude that I think everyone who signs up for a late season hunt or hunts a late shoulder season is a poor hunter. I just think a lot of folks who don’t put much effort into killing an elk in the long general season think killing a cow afterwards is going to be easy and are often disappointed by how difficult it is to kill a cow. There’s a lot of factors that make it more difficult than they think, including cold weather, deep snow, lack of cover, highly pressured herds and the sporadic availability of elk to hunt on accessible properties.

 

[mtmuley]

Obviously, my opinion about hunters who think late season hunts are an easy way to get meat is very broad brush. I wouldn’t read too far into it to conclude that I think everyone who signs up for a late season hunt or hunts a late shoulder season is a poor hunter. I just think a lot of folks who don’t put much effort into killing an elk in the long general season think killing a cow afterwards is going to be easy and are often disappointed by how difficult it is to kill a cow. There’s a lot of factors that make it more difficult than they think, including cold weather, deep snow, lack of cover, highly pressured herds and the sporadic availability of elk to hunt on accessible properties.

Spot on. mtmuley

 

[Gulf of America]

Whereabouts and what kind of beer?

@SixPoint I can provide references, but they might not answer a call

 

[Gerald Martin]

The more I think about population control hunts and how I would personally be more interested in participating, would be with earlier antlerless hunting much like we outlined in our proposal. ( shameless plug. )

Personally, I would be very happy most years to shoot a cow mid-October especially in an area that has more elk than are beneficial for carrying capacity or are causing legitimate problems for working ranchers. Especially if it was a B-tag that would still allow me to pursue a bull with my general tag. Most years, I’d probably be willing to use my general tag to shoot a cow. I know I am way more selective with my elk hunting when there’s meat in the freezer and way less likely to shoot an immature bull just to fill a freezer.

I’m way past the point of needing to fill all my tags just because I have them, even though I want ample opportunity to hunt and harvest in the occasion that I find an animal that gets me excited to pull the trigger. The qualification of what motivates me to shoot is highly subjective based on many factors, antler size being one of the lesser factors, and is easily satisfied with one or two animals per year.

I know I’m rambling and not sure how relevant my personal hunting preferences are to this discussion, but I have long thought that the most effective method of keeping elk populations in particular areas within socially acceptable levels is for there to be cooperative collaboration between landowners within that region to coordinate among themselves and FWP biologists as to what the appropriate numbers are and then coordinate access for qualified public hunters among themselves to achieve the desired harvest.

The current piecemeal approach to keeping elk herds within objectives isn’t working well, mainly because there’s a disparity of values and goals among landowners within that region and access to “problem elk” is so fragmented. FWP is being tasked by the Legislature as a result of landowner pressure to solve “elk problems” that are neighbor relations problems not really elk problems.

To me, the most important work that can be done to address over objective elk numbers is landowners sitting down with each other to find as much common ground as possible and work together to provide adequate controlled access to hunters so that effective, appropriate harvest can be achieved.

If specific landowners refuse to be good neighbors there’s nothing that FWP or the Legislature can do to change that.