Gird your loins.

[Jock Conyngham]

This is the direction a lot of people and several organizations want to move Montana toward:

Did y’all know that compared to Arizona New Mexican issues:

47% more elk licenses, but
13% less public resident,
58% less public nonresident, and
558% more nonresident licenses (public and private).

The cause? Privatization of elk licenses. Arizona has no outfitter draw set aside or private landowner licenses for any species.

Big game license privatization is horrible for both Resident and Nonresident DIY hunters.

We need to reduce and stop big game license privatization so both resident and nonresident hunters of average means don’t lose our hunting opportunity to wealthy hunters that can afford privatized licenses.

US western state resident hunters need to stick together and make hunting more public and keep it that way.

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[rogerthat]

Who is a lot of people and several large organizations? No offense but this seems like a post to illicit a reaction without providing much for facts. However I agree I don’t want our wildlife privatized if that’s your point.

 

[Jock Conyngham]

Who is a lot of people and several large organizations? No offense but this seems like a post to illicit a reaction without providing much for facts. However I agree I don’t want our wildlife privatized if that’s your point.

That’s an understandable request, but I’m not going to specifically diss organizations in a public forum. Feel free to DM me; I’m not hard to find. Here is the short answer—look at the organizations that have become permit power brokers in those SW states. They are easy to identify, and they are active and ascendant in Montana.

 

[Jock Conyngham]

Who is a lot of people and several large organizations? No offense but this seems like a post to illicit a reaction without providing much for facts. However I agree I don’t want our wildlife privatized if that’s your point.

And, better than I, go to a local source: Jesse Deubel, New Mexico Wildlife Federation. Great guy, great organization, and a lot to teach Montana about the forces at play.

 

[Flynarrow]

I have also been tracking" Ranching For Wildlife" Programs like are ongoing in NM, UT and CO......and similar give aways have started in Montana. After the Legislatures in those states give away a % of elk tags to "Ranchers/Landowners" via some enabling legislation, it isnt very many years before these same "ranchers" are back at the trough asking, and too often getting, an increase in the percentage of tags. The greed never stops.

Kinda like the Marijuana tax percentage going to Conservation at 49% but is now approaching zero by our Legislative Representatives most of sportsmen voted for. Sportsmen continue to get what they vote for.

 

[Treeshark]

Before I go ahead and do anything hasty with my loins, isn’t this just a copy and paste from the New Mexico thread?

That one didn’t go quite how the original poster had planned.

 

[Jock Conyngham]

You know it’s a a copy and paste; you’re on that thread. That doesn’t mean the New Mexico privatization experience is not worth pondering for Montanans.

 

[SAJ-99]

You know it’s a a copy and paste; you’re on that thread. That doesn’t mean the New Mexico privatization experience is not worth pondering for Montanans.

I agree, it is well on its way. Many protest but that hard choices are avoided in the name of opportunity.

 

[Treeshark]

That doesn’t mean the New Mexico privatization experience is not worth pondering for Montanans.

I agree with you there Jock, there are some similarities between New Mexico and Montana that make this a worthwhile discussion to be sure.

 

[Jock Conyngham]

I agree with you there Jock, there are some similarities between New Mexico and Montana that make this a worthwhile discussion to be sure.

Treeshark, there may be things we agree on, but you and I come at this from very different angles. I see New Mexico as a cautionary tale, where an organization run by a guy who thinks the North American Model is socialist has extraordinary power over tags, has an economic self-interest in auctioning them to the wealthiest, and has refused to be audited on its conservation expenditures.

I saw your post in the NM forum, which I will copy here so I don’t misquote you:
“I’m a working man who loves to hunt- as a NR to all western states, UW landowner tags are one of the best ways for me to actually make this happen.

Montana would be served well to go the NM route on this one, both their state financial situation and their private/public land game problems would be improved.”

The state is currently tracking on a $2.5-2.6B surplus, so I don’t take your point about our finances. The private/public land wildlife issues are certainly real, but most resident hunters I know (and lots of NR’s) believe strongly in the North American Model. We need to make some hard choices, but my opinion, and that of many others, is that New Mexico stands as a example of wildlife monetization and privatization run amok. If it works for you and other non-residents in New Mexico, go ahead and argue for it there. Many of us here feel that Montana is not New Mexico, and we will work hard to keep it that way.

The best of luck to you with your draws and your hunting. And, incidentally, your caution over hastiness with your loins made me laugh. Thanks for that.

 

[Treeshark]

Thanks Jock. I pretty well punched myself out on that other thread, Montana’s tags are Montana’s call. I appreciate your post.

 

[Jock Conyngham]

Thanks Jock. I pretty well punched myself out on that other thread, Montana’s tags are Montana’s call. I appreciate your post.

And I appreciate your courtesy. I hope we can have a beer sometime and talk hunting.